NYCDoglvr

I've been sober for 22.5 years thanks to AA but I know it's not for everyone. There's a saying: AA is for people who want it, not for people who need it." Toward offering alternatives for those who eschew the 12 Step program, here's an article describing alternatives to AA that have worked for others:


http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/06/ny...nav=MostViewed

ando68

Times, they are a changing,
Thanks for that NYCdoglvr

dsmaxis10

Harm reduction works for me

NoelleR

Yup, I remember that li'll ditty, but when I was new it had one more additional line..........: AA isn't for people who want it, nor is it for people who need it; AA is for perple who work it.

(o:
NoelleR

Gottalife

I thought it might be something new, but the only new thing was the DSM V alcohol use disorder which does differentiate the level of the problem. This is very helpful. It shows that not everyone who has a drinking problem is an alcholic and, in fact, probably the majority would not need AA. Most will stop or moderate on their own account. There is something very familiar about this picture.

But its not new. In the late 1970's as the authorities were trying to sort out my behaviour, the very first official approach was a court appointed addictions counsellor.
This was followed by lessons and strategies for controlled drinking. They might work for others, but they were a salutory lesson for me. My control lasted for the time it took to get the first drink down. I was back in the slammer a day later, and then sent to the asylum. It was an almost fatal experiment for me. At one point I was hiding from police on the third floor of a construction site, so intoxicated I could not clearly see the police cars below. I almost fell.

For alcoholics of my type, these ideas at best are a stepping stone on the way to recovery. Every failure at controlled drinking helped smash the delusion that I could drink like other people. In the end, I went to AA, last resort. For some reason today AA is often the first resort and, as we dont often 12 step newcomers anymore, we end up with a lot of non alcoholics in the fellowship.

Then there is the idea of harm minimisation. A psychological construct based on aiming for a "realistic" goal. It might mean only getting drunk once a week, it might mean endless counselling, it might mean being numbed out on medication for the rest of your life. To me these things sound like palliative care. We will minimize your suffering while we wait for you to die.

That is so far short of what AA offers the real alcoholic, a full and satisfying life, so good in fact, that there is no longer any need or desire to drink.

SoberCAH

Very well put, Gotta.

For me, AA was a last resort.

I knew that I had the potential to be an alcoholic when I was 18 and I certainly knew I was an alcoholic for the last several years that I drank.

I got sober when I was 31 years old and my life didn't seem to be going very well.

I knew that my continued alcoholism would cost me my career and that seemed to be the only thing that mattered to me.

AA has given me quite a life, so I don't think I will quit going to meetings or working the AA program.

desypete

this passages showed me it can never work for an alcoholic

“Isn’t it more encouraging to know that most people are going to outgrow these habits than to think they’re going to have a disease for the rest their lives?” Dr. Peele asked. “The data show that the odds are in your favor.”

sadly i progressed from weekend binge drinking into 24 / 7 drinking like alcoholics will do
i didnt grow out of it at all as i got older as i never grew up anyway : ) but thats a side issue
the fact is for me my drinking progressed. aa has 75 years of study which shows if your an alcoholic then the drinking will get worse the longer your at it until you end up losing everything and everyone around you or worse death.

i can not undo my own experiences with the booze, but the only way i know how i can make sure they dont happen again is total abstinence

the one other benefit of aa is also thats its free

bill w could of made millions with aa but he gave it away free to the world to play about with he had no control over it at all and its remind that way for all its life and will continue to do so for the future

what other organization has no bosses, is a world wide organization and its free for all ?
it sounds totaly madness to run a company that way and yet it works !!

IOAA2

So totally agree with post! For me I think that worse than death is horrors involved with the progression of continued drinking. We can start with a wet brain and continue.

BE WELL

FlyerFan

I used a handful of programs, AA being one of them. But I also enjoy the communities and support in other programs. There isn't a rule that says you have to stick to just one.

freecoffee

Harm Reduction is a completely valid response to alcohol issues. I (at 24) was waking up shaking so bad I couldn't sign a check without someone asking if I was okay, and then tapered off, took a month off, and went back to massive, life-threatening (a litre of whiskey a day) drinking immediately after 12-step based treatment, then found out about HR. Now I healthily drink a few nights a week. Everyone says AA "works if you work it," but that same principle can be applied to HR and Moderation Management as well.

HR works through needle exchanges in the heroin community and a whole bunch of other issues that everyone advocates complete abstinence from, and is now being applied to alcohol- if someone's going to drink, it's better to have them make a plan and follow it rather than drink, drive, and murder someone(s). In the heroin/intravenous drug community, if they're not going to quit using the drug, it's better to give them clean needles than spread HIV/Hepatitis C everywhere. Moderation Management takes an even more conservative approach to the subject, advocating no more than two drinks a day.

It just takes effort to change a habit. Dependence is not a disease, the hardest part is just getting through the withdrawals. That's half the reason alcohol dependent people drink- to avoid the withdrawal symptoms. After that, it's basically telling yourself that alcohol doesn't control you, you control it. Positive reinforcement like that is healthier for a lot of people than negative reinforcement (ala "powerless over alcohol"). Not saying AA doesn't work- it works for some people, just not most, and if it does, more power to them, but for some of us, it's just healthier to manage than abstain, and keeps us happier.

NYCDoglvr

When I got sober in 1991 it was after a close call with death. I had the "gift of desperation" and couldn't have gotten or stayed sober without the fellowship of AA. It was do this program or die; I never heard of an alternative. Since that time I've seen the huge benefits of cognitive behavior and know there is medication which cuts down on cravings (which I didn't have despite drinking a magnum of wine daily for a decade). Some people can stop drinking on their own but I'm not one of them. It's a life or death disease and I think you have to do whatever it takes (even if it means AA) to recover.
My will got me drunk. By taking suggestions I changed over time, my distorted thinking cleared away and I have peace of mind. The Steps and therapy (plus antidepressants) made all the difference. I was an agnostic when I started and I'm still and agnostic. I do have a higher power but I don't call it God.

Do whatever works and if it doesn't work try something else.

ando68

Harm reduction certainly has its place,, i think meeting people where they are at and working with that is really important, a more holistic approach in my view Is far better.
The cutting back and managing my own alcohol intake never worked, it would work for a while sometimes but would inevitably always return to the same old problematic routine.
Better for me to reduce the harm right down to a minimum which equals zero intake.
My life is far better without it anyway.

HopefulinFLA

This a great thread! As the wife of an alcoholic, I always learn a lot over here. Thank you everyone.

Dee74

Harm reduction didn't work for me because it's predicated on my having some degree of control over my intake.

That was not me at the end of my drinking days.

D