bemyself

Just another random thought:

I'm reminded (for my own recovery especially, given so many relapses) of quite a number of individuals I've known in both AA and rehab outpatients - yes, some with several years sobriety and involvement in one or both types of groups - who have, sadly, relapsed and quite shortly after, died. Either from suicide or from the body just not being able to handle drinking that last time, and so they have died in the most frightful ways, from the inside as it were.

this for me is a literally sobering reminder that in the final analysis, it really does come down to how I'm working (or not) on my mind and spiritual / inner life. Years of AA meetings or outpatients' group are worth diddly squat without that constant inner work and walking the path. I really GET that now, after quite some years.

Soberpotamus

That's good stuff, Vic.

It is so scary to realize sometimes the percent of addicts who fail at sobriety. The odds are against us, statistically anyway. I want to do all the things I can and need to do to live the best sober life possible.

I really appreciate your comments. Thanks again

sydpet18

In my humble opinion, no-one should be "pressured" to go to AA. The Fellowship works on attraction, not promotion. Working the Steps has worked for countless thousands and is suggested as a means of recovery. Like jumping out of an airplane with a parachute, it is suggested that you pull that rip-cord well prior to hitting the ground.
You have been sober for 450 days .... the Steps vastly improve the quality of sobriety, no matter where we are at.

sydpet18

In my humble opinion, no-one should be "pressured" to go to AA. The Fellowship works on attraction, not promotion. Working the Steps has worked for countless thousands and is suggested as a means of recovery. Like jumping out of an airplane with a parachute, it is suggested that you pull that rip-cord well prior to hitting the ground.
You have been sober for 450 days ....there is no "wrong way" to stay sober. The Steps vastly improve the quality of sobriety, no matter where we are at.
Why are "they" doing this ? Why the pressure ? Hey Jennie, and walk away !! They are ignorant and you do not need this crap. Who cares how "they" get their kicks? Walk away and back into AA. There you will not be judged nor pressured and we in AA do together what we cannot do alone.

jdooner

I think you know the answers but are looking for approval in this post. Just my opinion but that is what you are looking for right? Perhaps its what others see in you at the meeting. For me when I know a truth subconsioculy but force my will to repress it to get my way, I want others to acknowledge and accept as a way for me to accept a decision I know deep down is wrong.

If you are working the 12 steps, even on your own, the program is not about self will. In fact, its the exact opposite. Its a spiritual program and finding strength outside of yourself. Further, the 12th step is about helping others and service once you have had a spiritual awakening. So by not going to meetings, I am confused how you can work the 12th step?

Perhaps this is the wrong program for you and you may want to consider AVRT or another cognitive approach as a rational program to augment what you are already doing (in line with your freethinking stance). Of course if everything is working out fine, I am a little confused by the reason for the post - again why I think its more about seeking approval from others to support a position you yourself are questioning subconciously. But as a Psychologist you already know this.

sydpet18

Jdooner, I agree ... the classic rejoinder for those who rely on self will is this : next time you get a savage stomach upset, try a dose of self will ... a bit earthy but then I am Australian ! Willpower is totally ineffective in preventing us from picking up a drink. The book Alcoholics Anonymous is all about finding a power greater than SELF.

Boleo

You tend to over-analize everything. That's not necessarily a bad thing. I to over-analize everything. It did cost me a few relapses at first, but I think it made my understanding of recovery stronger in the long run (I learned a lot about what doesn't work).

That being said, I suspect that it was my study of Existentialism and Zen that saved me from fallacious reasoning. They taught me that I could think all I want - so long as I never fully trust my own thinking.

Mirage74

The 11th tradition states AA public relations policy is based on attraction rather than promotion. Why when someone's not attracted to AA do so many members resort to promotion, and violate this tradition?

Maybe there's a fine line between sharing "ES&H" and promoting the program.

jdooner

Where are you seeing promotion?

Sorry I thought you meant in the responses to the OP - I see in the OPs comments Mirage74. I agree.

Mirage74

Actually, jdooner, I was speaking in regards to the responses. I'm not trying to be confrontational, but when someone is moving in a path that is not the "traditional" AA program, other AA members sometimes provide traditional" AA solutions (from the BB, etc.). I'm just not sure that's what she looking for.

I think she questioning people's motives. Who is in a position to question anyone else's path to recovery, especially if they've achieved some quality sobriety under their belt? If someone doesn't buy into the program, no amount of coersion is going to change their mind. Or at least the tradition is against it in principal.

Maybe I'm off base, maybe it's not promotion and just ES&H. I just try to keep my side of the street clean. If someone wants what I got, great. If not, that's ok too. Just my 2cents. Peace

jdooner

I read this as you are working some hybrid AA program using the literature and steps but your own construct, which the Big Book specificaly cites as wrong.

Again I question the motives behind this post. It is my opinion based on what I have read that this post is about reassurance from a consensus group with this accoplished and intelligent OP with a degree in Psychology probably knows the answer but if like me unwilling to accept it herself. (assumption and judgement made based on my experience, which I have shared).


I never knew duration of sobriety provides seniority. I learn much from the newcomer.


This might be a problem with the CC.



Mirage. I have read through many of the responses and I see more sharing, some with opinions, as I have outlined above. I don't see much promotion. The OP is working her own program based loosly on AA's 12 steps from what I gather but this is not part of AA nor endorsed. In fact in my first post I suggested AVRT or some other rational program based on the comments from the OP. That is not promotion.

I am not going to make assumptions about other people's posts. So for me, I try to share my experience as it relates to a question and provide an opinion. I tend to avoid cheerleading as it never helped me personally.

When I have struggled with something its often somethign I am unwilling to acknowledge or admit and I sometimes have been guilty of coming on these boards to support the wrong decision as a way to justify. That's just my experience and what I have tried to share here.

ScottFromWI

Because members of AA are people. And people don't always do what they are "supposed" to do. This is not a situation inherent to AA - it applies to every religion, political group, social group and society all around the world. Some people want to promote whatever it is they believe/do because it works for them. You cannot control what they believe or what they do, only how you react to it.

Soberpotamus

Approval for what exactly? You'll be telling me something I don't know.

Soberpotamus

And I guess some people who are commenting didn't read through the whole thread, because I did come to a conclusion about what I'm going to do at CC, btw. And thanks to all who've contributed! Much appreciated. Love the feedback, as always.

Soberpotamus

I have to say, this is just wrong. I have read AA's history. I know that the program is always a program of suggestion. And I am doing that program.

Soberpotamus

I think there is a fine line, yes. Good point.

Soberpotamus

Interesting. Well, since this is technically my 3rd try I guess I've gotten over the relapsing bit, knock on wood. And I studied existentialism years ago when I got a degree in Philosophy (and didn't come away with the message not to trust my own thinking, but to each their own). Yeah, I do analyze things a lot and sometimes "overanalyze"... but I guess that would be someone's opinion, now wouldn't it?

Soberpotamus

Jdooner... I'm tempted to respond to all of what you said there. But, I won't. I'll be nice today. It's just not worth it.

Mirage74

Not trying to control what others do. Just pointed it out. That's how I reacted.

Mirage74

And jdooner, I never specifically singled you out, but you did suggest twice now that the OP is wrong and deep down knows the right answer. Which would be the right answer according to you, or AA, or your interpretation of it at least. I don't know if that's attraction or promotion, or neither.

I'm out, shouldn't have even gotten involved. My apologies.