addiction recovery is cultural
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Drug Abuse Resistance Education - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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the Americans of my generation remember these campaigns to scare young kids away from drugs
popular recovery beliefs that are pasedt off as fact are soo far off from reality.
If someone uses drugs weekly or more they see a negative impact on their life?
No...that's not true
Just Say No - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
the Americans of my generation remember these campaigns to scare young kids away from drugs
popular recovery beliefs that are pasedt off as fact are soo far off from reality.
If someone uses drugs weekly or more they see a negative impact on their life?
No...that's not true
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Originally Posted by soberhawk 
I do not know whether governments use scare tactics. I think our health services try to inform as objectively as they can and there is discussion whether to legalize some drugs. Mostly because some criminal organization earn so much money on the drug market.
I do not know anyone that uses drugs weekly or more who is not very impacted by this use.
I do not see it as scare tactics to say that drugs are dangerous – they are.
It has been discussed to legalize marijuana here – I am very skeptical whether that is a good idea.
I do not know anyone that uses drugs weekly or more who is not very impacted by this use.
I do not see it as scare tactics to say that drugs are dangerous – they are.
It has been discussed to legalize marijuana here – I am very skeptical whether that is a good idea.
In 2008 approximately one in every 31 adults (7.3 million) in the United States was behind bars, or being monitored (probation and parole). This has grown every year since and 1 in 18 African Americans adults is behind bars in the US - this is slavery in today's modern age in my opinion.
The financial impact of this is staggering in a time when we are worried about deficits. I would argue most addicts including alcoholics are powerless over their disorder. Most IV addicts deep into their dependency are not gainfully employed and a drain on our welfare system. Yet it costs roughly $100-300 per day to get a fix. How do you suppose these addicts pay for their habits? Crime. Typically you can get 5% fencing stolen goods (generous), which would make a $100/day habit cost society $2000/day per addict, not to mention the opportunity cost of lost wages and negative society impact. Once incarcerated for their crimes it costs on average $75K per inmate of taxable dollars.
We are not winning the war on drug in my opinion, as the resources are focused on the wrong things and the opportunity costs are staggering. Only the cartels and corrupt politicians in bed with said cartels are benefitting from the US war on drugs. We live in a World of misguided policy designed to cater to ignorance and sleep walking through life brainwashed on what the Kardashian's are doing and other realty TV.
An example of a good policy on decriminalization and policy with results is Switzerland's policy on drug, which has almost eradicated the problem over the past decade from an epidemic status - smaller population I understand but progressively the results are undeniable yet the US continues to negatively influence other Countries to fuel a certain ideal that is flawed.
This is all just my opinion.
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Originally Posted by soberhawk
I do not know whether governments use scare tactics. I think our health services try to inform as objectively as they can and there is discussion whether to legalize some drugs. Mostly because some criminal organization earn so much money on the drug market.
I do not know anyone that uses drugs weekly or more who is not very impacted by this use.
I do not see it as scare tactics to say that drugs are dangerous – they are.
It has been discussed to legalize marijuana here – I am very skeptical whether that is a good idea.
I do not know anyone that uses drugs weekly or more who is not very impacted by this use.
I do not see it as scare tactics to say that drugs are dangerous – they are.
It has been discussed to legalize marijuana here – I am very skeptical whether that is a good idea.
The other part of me fears the unknown and worries the world will become full of teenagers jabbing syringes into their eyeballs within a couple of weeks of legalisation.
If there was a vote, I would have to think long and hard on the subject and Im really not sure how I would end up voting -- even though I hate the way drug crime has destroyed many communities and would likely be solved by legalizing it..
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Originally Posted by MrTumble
I have very mixed feelings on the subject of legalising drugs. The part of me that wants to be all grown up and rational thinks that drug prohibition is causing far more problems than it solves.
The other part of me fears the unknown and worries the world will become full of teenagers jabbing syringes into their eyeballs within a couple of weeks of legalisation.
If there was a vote, I would have to think long and hard on the subject and Im really not sure how I would end up voting -- even though I hate the way drug crime has destroyed many communities and would likely be solved by legalizing it..
The other part of me fears the unknown and worries the world will become full of teenagers jabbing syringes into their eyeballs within a couple of weeks of legalisation.
If there was a vote, I would have to think long and hard on the subject and Im really not sure how I would end up voting -- even though I hate the way drug crime has destroyed many communities and would likely be solved by legalizing it..
It is my opinion that the substances are not the causation rather the symptom of the underlying issue. The issue is much bigger and quite ugly. This is the problem in my opinion - loping in a mirror can be difficult. Its much easier to point to genetics and simply throw our arms up and say we are born this way - round up the Leppers and throw them on a desert island or build a prion to house them. But if this were the solution would the statistics show increase efficacy?
If the statistics show we are going backwards what does that mean? Why throw good money at bad? I can only reconcile this is political to fund anterior motives and an agenda designed for failure. I agree with Cabo wholeheartedly on this topic - our Government is obfuscating a failed policy by publishing limited results designed to purposely mislead - yet even these misleading data are so atrocious that it highlights how failed our policy is.
Unfortunately for the citizens that experience the tragedies directly or kids are murdered or worse kidnapped in Texas, Arizona or California by the cartels and sold into human trafficking our failed policies are all too real.
Drug cartel threatens to kill every child in Mexican border town - Norfolk Crime | Examiner.com
I mean 5 year old children lit up with uzis highlight how awful things have become - and from what I see will only get worse.
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I am not that well informed about the situation in the US. We do undoubtedly have increasing problem with marijuana here. It is a problem that many youngster get lost in this and criminal organizations earn money on this. The use of other drugs has been rather stable the last decades, but it is still a problem that needs to be faced.
I think we need a variety of approaches to face this challenge this can not be solved by the police alone.
I think we need a variety of approaches to face this challenge this can not be solved by the police alone.
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Soberhawk - the problem with the US is we act as Worldwide bullies levering trade on countries that implement policies that we disagree with...so the US policy has much to do with how policy is in Scandinavia. My point is I am not so sure that availability to drugs is the problem. It goes to the causation effect. Are drugs the problem or the symptom. I believe the symptom. If an addict is suffering he/she will find a way to cope behaviorally or by using a substance. The root cause is in the cause of addiction. Yet funding and managed care has reduced the ability to deal with root causes. In effect we plug a hole in the dyke and when another pops open we plug that. But as you know with enough holes the integrity of the dyke is at risk. I feel this is what is occurring. Read up on how awful the cartel violence is, I mean people are living in sheer hell in Mexico and South America and now its spilling into other areas of he World.
Legalization is fancy for wealth redistribution. You take from the Cartels and provide to legitimate businesses that will pay taxes. Its just like alcohol and cigarettes. Decriminalization is simply humane, in my opinion.
Legalization is fancy for wealth redistribution. You take from the Cartels and provide to legitimate businesses that will pay taxes. Its just like alcohol and cigarettes. Decriminalization is simply humane, in my opinion.
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I can disagree with US policies in some areas – I do not think the drug policies in the US are impacting Scandinavia.
It is a problem that there is so much money in the drug market, it will be interesting whether bitcoins and some internet technologies like tor will transform this marked – it probably will.
It is a problem that there is so much money in the drug market, it will be interesting whether bitcoins and some internet technologies like tor will transform this marked – it probably will.
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with your opinions on the US addiction and recovery culture aside..don't you think we would be better off learning culture views and customs from cultures and ethnic groups that have a much lower abuse rate? Instead we are preaching our culture of addiction
and recovery to the rest of the world and to a certain extent people around the world are buying it..hook, line , and sinker. It's not unlike countries in other parts of the world taking up cultural customs like blue jeans, Hip hop..or reality tv
Our twisted philosophy is that we have one of the highest drug and alcohol abuse rates so we must have the best recovery methods or views..because we require it...make sense to you? not to me
and recovery to the rest of the world and to a certain extent people around the world are buying it..hook, line , and sinker. It's not unlike countries in other parts of the world taking up cultural customs like blue jeans, Hip hop..or reality tv
Our twisted philosophy is that we have one of the highest drug and alcohol abuse rates so we must have the best recovery methods or views..because we require it...make sense to you? not to me
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We can all learn from others but I do not know of any country that has found a perfect solution. I have traveled some in the middle east, not much drinking there but I do not see their methods a solution.
I do not think there is any final solution this will be an ongoing battle as long as there are humans.
We can not punish our way out of it.
US does export a lot of culture – I could live without some of it (a burger chain with a clown for one), but it is luckily voluntary whether I want to visit that establishment
I do not think there is any final solution this will be an ongoing battle as long as there are humans.
We can not punish our way out of it.
US does export a lot of culture – I could live without some of it (a burger chain with a clown for one), but it is luckily voluntary whether I want to visit that establishment
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the solution and the given culture towards alcohol are different things. i'm saying we should adopt those aspects of the culture that pertain to alcohol.. not just their recovery solution for addicts...is more then just a program..
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As I said Switzerland is perhaps the best example of a policy that works - drug dealers are targeted not users and harm reduction vs criminalization.
http://www.watoday.com.au/comment/sw...622-2opcj.html
Life throws up many contradictions and conundrums but human society always works best when it tries to manage rather than obliterate them. Swiss drug policy provides a good case study.
At the Harm Reduction International Conference in Vilinus, Lithuania I was privileged to hear former Swiss president Ruth Dreifuss and health and police officials from Zurich explain their unique approach. It's a policy based on four pillars one of which is harm reduction. Before outlining the policies it's worth remembering that Switzerland is a highly democratic and decentralized society that makes wide use of the initiative and referendum to determine law and policy. Change is hard to achieve and popular support is not just important, it is essential. This was achieved for harm reduction, medics as well as social reformers playing a key role in the campaigns.
The new approach started back in the 1980s when the HIV-AIDS epidemic arrived and open drug scenes were attracting many young people, for example in Platzspitz Park in Zurich. The community was fed-up with what they saw as a loss of public amenity and health officials warned of the dangers to disease control. A whole range of harm reduction initiatives were developed and sanctioned, including housing and social support, street and prison work, supervised injecting rooms (13 in 8 cities), drug testing, needle exchange, methadone programs and heroin-assisted treatment.
The policy had two objectives- a healthier population and improved public amenity. Dreifuss has said it was designed to bring "addicts out of the shadows" and into contact with a range of services. For example it is estimated that 70 per cent of the 30,000 opiate or cocaine users now receive some form of treatment. The number of drug injectors with HIV has halved, as has overdose mortality among injectors.
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What's interesting, however, is that such policies exist alongside the traditional approaches, namely prevention, treatment and law enforcement. Drug production, distribution and consumption still remains illegal although in the case of some drugs possession doesn't carry heavy or criminal penalties. What the Swiss have attempted is a mix of laws and policies that recognize the reality of drug use and the enormous difficulties associated with attempts to eradicate it. However, this doesn't lead them to libertarianism but rather government action to reduce the harms that come with it. It's classic pragmatism.
This puts the police in an important position in the equation and leads one to ask: "Is it possible for harm reduction and law enforcement to co-exist?". At the conference a police inspector and a harm reduction official from Zurich explained the way they have learned to work together, particularly with regard to supervised injecting rooms.
The police target drug dealers rather than users, train their officers alongside health workers and have built up trust and understanding with other agencies of government. It's what the academics call joined-up government and it works because the political arm of government has insisted this is the way to go, complicated but effective.
Radicals say it doesn't go far enough and conservatives say it's a step too far. The former say the law enforcement pillar is still too harsh and the latter that the wrong messages are being sent out.
The fact is many people are still arrested every year for drug offences, the number having nearly doubled in the 1990s, but because of harm reduction policies Switzerland is a healthier and happier country than it would otherwise have been. As a advisory paper to the Canadian Parliament(2002) put it " whereas in the mid-1980s drug addicts were largely viewed as marginalized people responsible for their own fate, today they are generally seen as ill, dependent people who are victims of a personal predisposition or outside circumstances". It's the sort of win/win approach to public policy that agitates the fundamentalists but delivers for both the needy and the mainstream.
Read more: Swiss recipe for dealing with drug addiction proves a success
http://www.watoday.com.au/comment/sw...622-2opcj.html
Life throws up many contradictions and conundrums but human society always works best when it tries to manage rather than obliterate them. Swiss drug policy provides a good case study.
At the Harm Reduction International Conference in Vilinus, Lithuania I was privileged to hear former Swiss president Ruth Dreifuss and health and police officials from Zurich explain their unique approach. It's a policy based on four pillars one of which is harm reduction. Before outlining the policies it's worth remembering that Switzerland is a highly democratic and decentralized society that makes wide use of the initiative and referendum to determine law and policy. Change is hard to achieve and popular support is not just important, it is essential. This was achieved for harm reduction, medics as well as social reformers playing a key role in the campaigns.
The new approach started back in the 1980s when the HIV-AIDS epidemic arrived and open drug scenes were attracting many young people, for example in Platzspitz Park in Zurich. The community was fed-up with what they saw as a loss of public amenity and health officials warned of the dangers to disease control. A whole range of harm reduction initiatives were developed and sanctioned, including housing and social support, street and prison work, supervised injecting rooms (13 in 8 cities), drug testing, needle exchange, methadone programs and heroin-assisted treatment.
The policy had two objectives- a healthier population and improved public amenity. Dreifuss has said it was designed to bring "addicts out of the shadows" and into contact with a range of services. For example it is estimated that 70 per cent of the 30,000 opiate or cocaine users now receive some form of treatment. The number of drug injectors with HIV has halved, as has overdose mortality among injectors.
Advertisement
What's interesting, however, is that such policies exist alongside the traditional approaches, namely prevention, treatment and law enforcement. Drug production, distribution and consumption still remains illegal although in the case of some drugs possession doesn't carry heavy or criminal penalties. What the Swiss have attempted is a mix of laws and policies that recognize the reality of drug use and the enormous difficulties associated with attempts to eradicate it. However, this doesn't lead them to libertarianism but rather government action to reduce the harms that come with it. It's classic pragmatism.
This puts the police in an important position in the equation and leads one to ask: "Is it possible for harm reduction and law enforcement to co-exist?". At the conference a police inspector and a harm reduction official from Zurich explained the way they have learned to work together, particularly with regard to supervised injecting rooms.
The police target drug dealers rather than users, train their officers alongside health workers and have built up trust and understanding with other agencies of government. It's what the academics call joined-up government and it works because the political arm of government has insisted this is the way to go, complicated but effective.
Radicals say it doesn't go far enough and conservatives say it's a step too far. The former say the law enforcement pillar is still too harsh and the latter that the wrong messages are being sent out.
The fact is many people are still arrested every year for drug offences, the number having nearly doubled in the 1990s, but because of harm reduction policies Switzerland is a healthier and happier country than it would otherwise have been. As a advisory paper to the Canadian Parliament(2002) put it " whereas in the mid-1980s drug addicts were largely viewed as marginalized people responsible for their own fate, today they are generally seen as ill, dependent people who are victims of a personal predisposition or outside circumstances". It's the sort of win/win approach to public policy that agitates the fundamentalists but delivers for both the needy and the mainstream.
Read more: Swiss recipe for dealing with drug addiction proves a success
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Originally Posted by jdooner
As I said Switzerland is perhaps the best example of a policy that works - drug dealers are targeted not users and harm reduction vs criminalization.
"Twelve years ago, Portugal eliminated criminal penalties for drug users. Since then, those caught with small amounts of marijuana, cocaine or heroin go unindicted and possession is a misdemeanor on par with illegal parking. Experts are pleased with the results."
Evaluating Drug Decriminalization in Portugal 12 Years Later - SPIEGEL ONLINE
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Possession of illegal drugs for own use will result in a warning or fine here and will not be registered on your criminal record if it is small quantities.
It is a different matter if you are selling.
It is illegal though and the policy can fine you – and you will go in prison if it is larger quantities and then it will be registered on your criminal record.
It is a different matter if you are selling.
It is illegal though and the policy can fine you – and you will go in prison if it is larger quantities and then it will be registered on your criminal record.
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thanks for the feedback everyone. I didn't mean to get into side shoots about genetics and whatnot but it happens. the main idea was the US culture around alcohol and how we import that culture around the world..and the irony of that.
Drug legalization is another issue entirely for me because I don't quite understand the politics of the cartels and other happenings south of the border. JD posted something on this. It seems to if we legalized just marijuana all at once the effect of the cartels in Mexico and elsewhere would be a disaster. The US as a nation will have to have a honest and open relationship with Mexico and other areas of Latin America before legalization would be
in the best interest of all of us (North America and Latin America) oddly enough I don't hear much about the cartels and Latin America when the legalization topic is brought up. All I hear about is how wonderful marijuana is and how it will helped so many people in the US when legalized.
Drug legalization is another issue entirely for me because I don't quite understand the politics of the cartels and other happenings south of the border. JD posted something on this. It seems to if we legalized just marijuana all at once the effect of the cartels in Mexico and elsewhere would be a disaster. The US as a nation will have to have a honest and open relationship with Mexico and other areas of Latin America before legalization would be
in the best interest of all of us (North America and Latin America) oddly enough I don't hear much about the cartels and Latin America when the legalization topic is brought up. All I hear about is how wonderful marijuana is and how it will helped so many people in the US when legalized.
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Originally Posted by caboblanco
thanks for the feedback everyone. I didn't mean to get into side shoots about genetics and whatnot but it happens. the main idea was the US culture around alcohol and how we import that culture around the world..and the irony of that.
Drug legalization is another issue entirely for me because I don't quite understand the politics of the cartels and other happenings south of the border. JD posted something on this. It seems to if we legalized just marijuana all at once the effect of the cartels in Mexico and elsewhere would be a disaster. The US as a nation will have to have a honest and open relationship with Mexico and other areas of Latin America before legalization would be
in the best interest of all of us (North America and Latin America) oddly enough I don't hear much about the cartels and Latin America when the legalization topic is brought up. All I hear about is how wonderful marijuana is and how it will helped so many people in the US when legalized.
Drug legalization is another issue entirely for me because I don't quite understand the politics of the cartels and other happenings south of the border. JD posted something on this. It seems to if we legalized just marijuana all at once the effect of the cartels in Mexico and elsewhere would be a disaster. The US as a nation will have to have a honest and open relationship with Mexico and other areas of Latin America before legalization would be
in the best interest of all of us (North America and Latin America) oddly enough I don't hear much about the cartels and Latin America when the legalization topic is brought up. All I hear about is how wonderful marijuana is and how it will helped so many people in the US when legalized.
And yes, I know a lot of people do home-grown drugs; they don't all come from the cartels.
Ok, off my soapbox
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Originally Posted by caboblanco
thanks for the feedback everyone. I didn't mean to get into side shoots about genetics and whatnot but it happens. the main idea was the US culture around alcohol and how we import that culture around the world..and the irony of that.
Drug legalization is another issue entirely for me because I don't quite understand the politics of the cartels and other happenings south of the border. JD posted something on this. It seems to if we legalized just marijuana all at once the effect of the cartels in Mexico and elsewhere would be a disaster. The US as a nation will have to have a honest and open relationship with Mexico and other areas of Latin America before legalization would be
in the best interest of all of us (North America and Latin America) oddly enough I don't hear much about the cartels and Latin America when the legalization topic is brought up. All I hear about is how wonderful marijuana is and how it will helped so many people in the US when legalized.
Drug legalization is another issue entirely for me because I don't quite understand the politics of the cartels and other happenings south of the border. JD posted something on this. It seems to if we legalized just marijuana all at once the effect of the cartels in Mexico and elsewhere would be a disaster. The US as a nation will have to have a honest and open relationship with Mexico and other areas of Latin America before legalization would be
in the best interest of all of us (North America and Latin America) oddly enough I don't hear much about the cartels and Latin America when the legalization topic is brought up. All I hear about is how wonderful marijuana is and how it will helped so many people in the US when legalized.
I believe that we need to enforce dealing and distribution with even stricter penalties. I would ideally like to see some of the incremental tax dollars generated from legalizing marijuana (like cigarette and alcohol taxes) used to fund education on addiction and Government assisted treatments vs what we have now with managed care.
Thanks for letting me participate in your rather interesting thread!
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