neferkamichael

Being addicted to a chemical substance has nothing to do with culture, religion, family or friends. Addiction to alcohol is strictly a physical condition. Ethanol is the principal psychoactive constituent in alcoholic beverages. With depressant effects on the central nervous system, it has a complex mode of action and affects multiple systems in the brain, most notably increasing the activity of GABA receptors. Through positive allosteric modulation, it enhances the activity of naturally produced GABA. Alcohol use results in diverse behavioral effects, including intoxication, cognitive impairment, motor incoordination, tolerance and dependence, and these effects are likely due to its actions on multiple brain proteins. You continuously put that alcohol molecule into your body, it adapts to it and becomes dependent on it for normal functioning. That's why we continue to go back time and time again regardless of the social and financial impacts it has on an individual. None of the models explain why new born infants get addicted to chemical substances including alcohol. New born infants are not Catholic, Jewish, or Protestant, they are no sentient, they have no self-control, and they can't make choices, and yet we all know they they can be born addicted. Drinking alcoholic beverages probably starts with peer pressure with most of us, we all want to fit in with some group. I don't believe addiction has anything whats so ever to do with higher brain functioning at all, but I'm rootin for all of us to stay sober.

caboblanco

Hey nefer!

how does one go down the path to become addicted? There is no cultural influence? If anything part of the culture is the availability of the substance. Without a substance being available you cannot become addicted to it.

MrTumble

I dont want to be disagreeable, as I would love to agree with someone tonight, about something... but I would guess that reliable statistics on alcoholism would be difficult to come by. Reason being the amount of people I have spoken to here who have avoided the doctor, havent told family and have pretty much gone out of their way to hide it through life.

But hey, maybe its possible - just seems a bit tricky.



EDIT: My luck's in, i agree with Nefer !

soberhawk

I have seen many posts here that suggest that (some) people need to hid rock bottom before they can recover, I think this is a American cultural “archetype”. I can almost see Rocky run in the cold preparing for his comeback when I read that.

How we understand recovery and what we think make people change their ways is to high degree cultural.

How you see and understand addicts in Scandinavia, Russia and Iran – is very different.

neferkamichael

How is cabo today!

The path to addiction is using the chemical substance, how we obtain the chemical substance is an independent issue, but we all know how ready someone is willing to offer us a drink for any occasion, I certainly did. I suppose we want to pass on the good feeling without knowing what we are doing until it is too late. Still rootin for everyone.

MrTumble

I also notice that American's are far more wary and concerned about withdrawal than at least us Brits, who I have a feeling are most likely to go through withdrawal thinking it was just a *major* hangover

(sorry, shouldnt laugh, but if were having a Rocky poke at the Americans, count me in !!)

But, the uncanny thing is, that when us "alkies" get talking, no matter where we are from, or which religion, or age, or whatever, it seems we all have a very similar experience of what life looks like through the bottom of a bottle.

jdooner

Nerf - I think you are getting physical and mental components of addiction mixed up. I seem to be in the "agree with Cabo" phase today - maybe because I am on the other side of the World, lol.

Anyhow, I think there is sufficient evidence that contradicts your view that addiction to alcohol is strictly physical. As such, you probably want to state this view as opinion, not fact.

In terms of culture not having an influence, that is just crazy...of course culture plays a big role in addiction. Societal impacts and cultural acceptance have a major role.

In terms of statistic, I am almost inclined to trust Wki more than Governments as its the US Government that is influencing most of the World in its War on Drugs policy, which I believe is one of the most failed and misunderstood positions in history. I find Governments tend to make data fit their narrative - case in point the Affordable Care Act.

freethinking

Where do you get this impression from?

soberhawk

I agree besides all the differences, the bottom of a bottle is the bottom of a bottle.

MrTumble

General experience. Dont worry, Im not claiming its a fact.

freethinking

I think things are getting confused, the way I am reading them. It seems to me, and maybe I am wrong, that Nefer is stating that addiciton is addiction is addiction. It doesn't matter if you are from Israel or Ital or the U.S. The actual addiction is the same. I agree with this (if, in fact, this is all that Nefer is stating).

I don't see anyone saying here (unless I am missing something) that culture doesn't effect one's path in addiction as compared to someone else's. That would be absurd.

freethinking

I'm not offended or anything...but I was wondering if you got the impression from here (SR) - that's all.

MrTumble

Well yes, SR is pretty much the only contact I have with other alkies, who are also predominantly American. So yes...

soberhawk

I have the same impression. I think that has something to do with different relations to health services.

The ER would not take people with withdrawal symptoms here.

freethinking

Hmm, I feel like most of the admins are not American (and they are the ones who often suggest the medically supervised detoxes)....one is Australian I think....another Canadian. Most people I meet in the AA rooms around here battled out their detoxes at home. But, I know what you mean....I have been surprised how often medically supervised detoxes have been suggested on here for the amount of alcohol drank. But, I also wonder if this site would be liable on some level if seeking professional help for a detox wasn't suggested when people describe withdrawal. Everyone's just trying to help though, no matter what.

freethinking

Interesting. All I have to do is call a place, describe my drinking and bam - I am admitted that day. They have specific units in most hospitals around here for those of us who like the comforts of a medically supervised detox. Out of pocket with insurance usually runs $100.

soberhawk

Delirium tremens would be a case for the psychiatric system here, I think – unless you have some other somatic problems.

You could also contact your home doctor and get some benzos of course.

MrTumble

Good points.

But ive had a sneaking suspicion that Americans are better informed on the subject and that might lead to some levels of hypochondria. There's nothing like googling a cough and ending up with some terminal tropical disease (only done that a few times myself)

freethinking

Most primary care doctors out here would never just prescribe benzos for an at home detox because this is a sue happy country...and if the detox went wrong, that doctor would be liable.

I luckily have quite a few bottles of xanax laying around so I have used that in the past to detox at home. I've only gone to hospital detox when the shakes won't stop and I am starting to get yellowish in the eyes.

Dee74

I suggest people need to see their doctor because a/ it's the safest way and I don't think anyone can argue with that, b/I nearly died from my last home alone detox, and c/it's actually in our rules:

It has nothing to do with me being Australian, tho

D