AA Moving on
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Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 3,359
AA Moving on
I have debated whether to post this or not. My intention is not to have this turn into an AA bashing post. But I try to post things I am going through in this process bc someone else might be going through the same thing - anyhow...
I have decided after 4+ months to depart from AA. And no, this is not me getting closer to a drink. This is not about fear of completing the steps - I am on step #6. I just find I am having to adjust me, JDooner too often to fit the the program and having to make exceptions and say its just the people not the program. I think it is the program, actually.
I am turning to Rational Recovery, as the forever nature of not drinking makes more sense for me, coupled with positive motivation - vs beating down my ego to fit the program. Yeah I know some will preach this is not the program but after trying over 10 different meetings in the past 4+ months its what I have found.
I do like the fellowship, which I know I am being ousted by - my sponsor wants nothing to do with me - which feels very cultish actually...and I really like what AA has taught me in terms of spirituality. AA has shown me that I got away from my higher power. The booze and drugs caught up with me and became more important than the skiing, yoga, mtn biking, racing cars, triathlons - in these sports/hobbies I found my connection with my higher power and it balanced my life. The booze got in the way of this and AA has helped restore this concept for me - this combined with making a big plan I see as my recovery + continued therapy.
I am sorry if I offend anyone but this is my experience. It is with fond memories that I bid AA goodbye and its with equally fond knowledge that I know it will be there should I need to return.
I have decided after 4+ months to depart from AA. And no, this is not me getting closer to a drink. This is not about fear of completing the steps - I am on step #6. I just find I am having to adjust me, JDooner too often to fit the the program and having to make exceptions and say its just the people not the program. I think it is the program, actually.
I am turning to Rational Recovery, as the forever nature of not drinking makes more sense for me, coupled with positive motivation - vs beating down my ego to fit the program. Yeah I know some will preach this is not the program but after trying over 10 different meetings in the past 4+ months its what I have found.
I do like the fellowship, which I know I am being ousted by - my sponsor wants nothing to do with me - which feels very cultish actually...and I really like what AA has taught me in terms of spirituality. AA has shown me that I got away from my higher power. The booze and drugs caught up with me and became more important than the skiing, yoga, mtn biking, racing cars, triathlons - in these sports/hobbies I found my connection with my higher power and it balanced my life. The booze got in the way of this and AA has helped restore this concept for me - this combined with making a big plan I see as my recovery + continued therapy.
I am sorry if I offend anyone but this is my experience. It is with fond memories that I bid AA goodbye and its with equally fond knowledge that I know it will be there should I need to return.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 2,443
Originally Posted by KateL 
My experience was almost identical to yours x
I went to AA for quite a few months in the beginning of my sobriety. I stopped going after a while.
I really enjoy the comradery of like minded folks, which is why I am so grateful for SR.
Re-Tread
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Meditation
Posts: 1,300
Similar experience here. Though I relapsed after leaving AA.
Not going back though. I only heard from one of my 'friends' from the rooms once I stopped. And I even called some of the guys and left messages. Never heard back.
And they didn't / don't know I drank either.
Its all good.
I love AA information but at this point in my life I don't have the time to spend in meetings.
And I don't need AA to stay sober.
Best of luck
Not going back though. I only heard from one of my 'friends' from the rooms once I stopped. And I even called some of the guys and left messages. Never heard back.
And they didn't / don't know I drank either.
Its all good.
I love AA information but at this point in my life I don't have the time to spend in meetings.
And I don't need AA to stay sober.
Best of luck
Behold the power of NO
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: WA
Posts: 7,764
Well, I'm one AA member who won't ostracize you and won't predict gloom, doom and awful things coming your way LOL
Sounds like you are making a decision based on self knowledge, not on your AV
Ultimately it's about not killing ourselves with drinks and drugs and living a content balanced life.
I hope you'll keep on posting here and helping others (especially the newbies). RR frowns upon fellowshiping, meetings etc. but I think it is so important that people talk about their experience and how they quit and show the new person there is hope and it can be done.
Sounds like you are making a decision based on self knowledge, not on your AV
Ultimately it's about not killing ourselves with drinks and drugs and living a content balanced life.
I hope you'll keep on posting here and helping others (especially the newbies). RR frowns upon fellowshiping, meetings etc. but I think it is so important that people talk about their experience and how they quit and show the new person there is hope and it can be done.
Member
Join Date: May 2013
Location: North East, US
Posts: 2,310
Everyone has to find their own way of doing things in every aspect of life. Sobriety is no different. If AA is no longer a good fit, take what you learned and keep on moving. RR sounds exciting. I'm sure you'll be telling us all about it
I really thought I was going to need my popcorn on this thread... Not so much... Guess we really are all in this together no matter which way we go.
I really thought I was going to need my popcorn on this thread... Not so much... Guess we really are all in this together no matter which way we go.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 19
Hey, whatever works for you. Like they say, take what you want from the meetings and leave the rest. I've been in the program for almost 4 months and while I haven't even really gotten into the steps, I was a drinker with social anxiety that put up a wall and isolated myself from everyone. Being able to meet other people like me and knowing I'm not alone has been a much bigger help than any spiritual guidance I've received. But seriously, to each his own. If you can stay sober without AA more power to you!
Member
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 557
It's not offensive to say you tried something and didn't think it would work for you, as long as you're not insulting the people for whom it did. So thank you for that! A lot of people are not so respectful. I'm sorry your experience was so negative! I know for me those promises really started materializing while working on step nine, but that may not have been your experience, so I respect that. It sounds like you're staying focused on sobriety, so that's all that matters! I'm also sorry about your sponsor. I'm not really friends with mine outside of AA, so I probably wouldn't continue a friendship with her if I stopped doing the program. That's just the way it goes. The same thing would happen if I left a job or changed churches - my relationships would change. I'm sure you'll find other people who will support your sobriety. Or maybe you'll find you don't need that, not really familiar with Rational Recovery. And of course SR will always be here!
@imp - I'll always take any excuse for popcorn!
@imp - I'll always take any excuse for popcorn!
Member
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Bklyn. NY
Posts: 1,859
Thanks for the thoughtful post. Hope you find what you're looking for in RR.
I'm grateful that the meetings and people in my life seem different than a lot of the ones I hear about on this forum. Maybe also people in AA respect me a bit more, because of the time I've accumulated. I rarely get anybody breathing down my neck regarding things I should and shouldn't do. Just a rare BB thumper here and there, and they get to me enough to understand how you feel .
I myself would love to check out RR, or one of the other groups but I feel I'm almost too far gone in AA to even give it a try. I'm fine with the fact that they're coming from a different angle, but I've heard a lot about the AA bashing stuff, and it wouldn't fly well with me. And I know too I wouldn't be able to keep my mouth shut. Not sure if I want to invite that kind of thing into my life, and since what I'm doing is working - you know, why try to fix it if it ain't broken. I do have interest however in things outside of the 12 steps and the bigbook. I liked the ideas behind mindfulness and CBT and feel I'd probably be able to benefit from a support group based on that kind of thing. Maybe one day I'll find a meeting based supplement that works. Maybe one day I'll try RR so I can at least talk from experience, and not what I've heard others say. Others have been very wrong about AA, I imagine the same could easily be true for RR.
Anyhoo... Feel I'm thinking out loud hear so forgive me if I'm going OT. Only thing I'd like to suggest is finishing the steps. Seems you're open to it, and believing them to be a positive thing. I can only see one benefitting from that. The fact that it sounds like you're stopping short at 6 does lead me to think the next 3 might have you questioning something. 8 and 9, IMO are the 2 toughest steps... and for some 7 poses equal challenges. I know people who are doing things they know are not healthy or good for them, but they believe step 7 says they have to give them up. Which isn't true, but I won't get into that as it's a whole nuther subject. Step 7 is to me nothing more than a complete willingness to become the best person I can possibly be. Doesn't tell me I have to quit or stop doing anything. Although over time (decades even) that's what seemed to happen.
Anyhow, I appreciate your posts here and look forward to hearing of your new experience. Who knows, I might run into ya one day at one of those other places. Wishing you the best.....
One afterthought. There are lots of threads on quitting today, or forever, and IME the today thing is nothing more than a tool for people new in recovery, and a message to live in the moment for anyone past that. 99% of the people I know (OK, maybe 97) with a few or more years sober are in this for life. And they know it. They just might state it differently at times out of habit, because it sounds good, or for the newcomer. Anyone with any sober time truly hanging onto 1 day at a time regarding picking up a drink, isn't where I'd ever want to be in my sobriety. I too believe I'd run from that. Thankfully again, that's not my AA experience.
I'm grateful that the meetings and people in my life seem different than a lot of the ones I hear about on this forum. Maybe also people in AA respect me a bit more, because of the time I've accumulated. I rarely get anybody breathing down my neck regarding things I should and shouldn't do. Just a rare BB thumper here and there, and they get to me enough to understand how you feel
.I myself would love to check out RR, or one of the other groups but I feel I'm almost too far gone in AA to even give it a try. I'm fine with the fact that they're coming from a different angle, but I've heard a lot about the AA bashing stuff, and it wouldn't fly well with me. And I know too I wouldn't be able to keep my mouth shut. Not sure if I want to invite that kind of thing into my life, and since what I'm doing is working - you know, why try to fix it if it ain't broken. I do have interest however in things outside of the 12 steps and the bigbook. I liked the ideas behind mindfulness and CBT and feel I'd probably be able to benefit from a support group based on that kind of thing. Maybe one day I'll find a meeting based supplement that works. Maybe one day I'll try RR so I can at least talk from experience, and not what I've heard others say. Others have been very wrong about AA, I imagine the same could easily be true for RR.
Anyhoo... Feel I'm thinking out loud hear so forgive me if I'm going OT. Only thing I'd like to suggest is finishing the steps. Seems you're open to it, and believing them to be a positive thing. I can only see one benefitting from that. The fact that it sounds like you're stopping short at 6 does lead me to think the next 3 might have you questioning something. 8 and 9, IMO are the 2 toughest steps... and for some 7 poses equal challenges. I know people who are doing things they know are not healthy or good for them, but they believe step 7 says they have to give them up. Which isn't true, but I won't get into that as it's a whole nuther subject. Step 7 is to me nothing more than a complete willingness to become the best person I can possibly be. Doesn't tell me I have to quit or stop doing anything. Although over time (decades even) that's what seemed to happen.
Anyhow, I appreciate your posts here and look forward to hearing of your new experience. Who knows, I might run into ya one day at one of those other places. Wishing you the best.....
One afterthought. There are lots of threads on quitting today, or forever, and IME the today thing is nothing more than a tool for people new in recovery, and a message to live in the moment for anyone past that. 99% of the people I know (OK, maybe 97
) with a few or more years sober are in this for life. And they know it. They just might state it differently at times out of habit, because it sounds good, or for the newcomer. Anyone with any sober time truly hanging onto 1 day at a time regarding picking up a drink, isn't where I'd ever want to be in my sobriety. I too believe I'd run from that. Thankfully again, that's not my AA experience.
Self recovered Self discovered
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Toronto Canada
Posts: 5,148
JDooner, this is a gutsy post. Congratulations to you.
For me, I needed to find an unconditional, permanent sobriety through a personal empowerment approach. I did it by allowing no process or relationship, temporal or spiritual, to dictate my success. I chose to believe in myself and my ability. I own it, and I own it for good. My own good.
I wish you every success.
For me, I needed to find an unconditional, permanent sobriety through a personal empowerment approach. I did it by allowing no process or relationship, temporal or spiritual, to dictate my success. I chose to believe in myself and my ability. I own it, and I own it for good. My own good.
I wish you every success.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 3,359
As an update, I had my weekly therapy session today. I explained my decision to my therapist and he played devils advocate. Actually pointed out this is consistent with my "all of nothing" personality, which led me here to begin with.
As an aside, I attended a sober party NYE at a guys house that has been my mentor. Anyhow, his whole family is in AA. His wife (Alanon and AA), his kids (3 teenagers in AlTeen). This is not what I want at all. It felt very cultish too- even though the intentions were genuine - this was my perception. I don't think its coincidence that I made this decision so close to this event.
Further, I have been fairly open with much of my sponsor issues. My sponsor reads the BB to me - its not a together thing - I find it belittling and I can't go at my pace - this pisses me off. When he has an issue he gets his sponsor involved in my issues and I feel bullied - this further irritates me.
Anyhow, as my therapist and I broke down some of my "issues" we concluded there are parts that have really worked well. A meeting I like once a week (not a huge commitment), the spiritual aspect - getting me back into the sports and hobbies I love without them becoming all or nothing. In other words, I don't need to rank top 500 in US for triathlons to do a triathlon. Or buy a formula race team to race a car - maybe SCCA would be just fine. Also helped me with the definition of an alcoholic. We agree my life is better without alcohol - period. I can see how my ego is involved in my decision - not a bad thing but it again is an all or nothing.
I do think my experience in AA has been very tainted unfortunately based on the messengers I have come in contact with but there are also parts of the program I don't like or agree with. I think if I came in contact with better messengers, I probably would have been able to have a different experience and outcome through AA. I hope this provides some further clarity.
As an aside, I attended a sober party NYE at a guys house that has been my mentor. Anyhow, his whole family is in AA. His wife (Alanon and AA), his kids (3 teenagers in AlTeen). This is not what I want at all. It felt very cultish too- even though the intentions were genuine - this was my perception. I don't think its coincidence that I made this decision so close to this event.
Further, I have been fairly open with much of my sponsor issues. My sponsor reads the BB to me - its not a together thing - I find it belittling and I can't go at my pace - this pisses me off. When he has an issue he gets his sponsor involved in my issues and I feel bullied - this further irritates me.
Anyhow, as my therapist and I broke down some of my "issues" we concluded there are parts that have really worked well. A meeting I like once a week (not a huge commitment), the spiritual aspect - getting me back into the sports and hobbies I love without them becoming all or nothing. In other words, I don't need to rank top 500 in US for triathlons to do a triathlon. Or buy a formula race team to race a car - maybe SCCA would be just fine. Also helped me with the definition of an alcoholic. We agree my life is better without alcohol - period. I can see how my ego is involved in my decision - not a bad thing but it again is an all or nothing.
I do think my experience in AA has been very tainted unfortunately based on the messengers I have come in contact with but there are also parts of the program I don't like or agree with. I think if I came in contact with better messengers, I probably would have been able to have a different experience and outcome through AA. I hope this provides some further clarity.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,424
Hi Jdooner;
I think you have worked very hard to get where you are and if RR seems a better "fit" then you should go for it.
Please let us know how it's going transition-wise if you don't mind. That might be very helpful to others who are struggling with the same issues.
Best to you
I think you have worked very hard to get where you are and if RR seems a better "fit" then you should go for it.
Please let us know how it's going transition-wise if you don't mind. That might be very helpful to others who are struggling with the same issues.
Best to you
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 3,359
Originally Posted by Joe Nerv
Thanks for the thoughtful post. Hope you find what you're looking for in RR.
I'm grateful that the meetings and people in my life seem different than a lot of the ones I hear about on this forum. Maybe also people in AA respect me a bit more, because of the time I've accumulated. I rarely get anybody breathing down my neck regarding things I should and shouldn't do. Just a rare BB thumper here and there, and they get to me enough to understand how you feel .
I myself would love to check out RR, or one of the other groups but I feel I'm almost too far gone in AA to even give it a try. I'm fine with the fact that they're coming from a different angle, but I've heard a lot about the AA bashing stuff, and it wouldn't fly well with me. And I know too I wouldn't be able to keep my mouth shut. Not sure if I want to invite that kind of thing into my life, and since what I'm doing is working - you know, why try to fix it if it ain't broken. I do have interest however in things outside of the 12 steps and the bigbook. I liked the ideas behind mindfulness and CBT and feel I'd probably be able to benefit from a support group based on that kind of thing. Maybe one day I'll find a meeting based supplement that works. Maybe one day I'll try RR so I can at least talk from experience, and not what I've heard others say. Others have been very wrong about AA, I imagine the same could easily be true for RR.
Anyhoo... Feel I'm thinking out loud hear so forgive me if I'm going OT. Only thing I'd like to suggest is finishing the steps. Seems you're open to it, and believing them to be a positive thing. I can only see one benefitting from that. The fact that it sounds like you're stopping short at 6 does lead me to think the next 3 might have you questioning something. 8 and 9, IMO are the 2 toughest steps... and for some 7 poses equal challenges. I know people who are doing things they know are not healthy or good for them, but they believe step 7 says they have to give them up. Which isn't true, but I won't get into that as it's a whole nuther subject. Step 7 is to me nothing more than a complete willingness to become the best person I can possibly be. Doesn't tell me I have to quit or stop doing anything. Although over time (decades even) that's what seemed to happen.
Anyhow, I appreciate your posts here and look forward to hearing of your new experience. Who knows, I might run into ya one day at one of those other places. Wishing you the best.....
One afterthought. There are lots of threads on quitting today, or forever, and IME the today thing is nothing more than a tool for people new in recovery, and a message to live in the moment for anyone past that. 99% of the people I know (OK, maybe 97) with a few or more years sober are in this for life. And they know it. They just might state it differently at times out of habit, because it sounds good, or for the newcomer. Anyone with any sober time truly hanging onto 1 day at a time regarding picking up a drink, isn't where I'd ever want to be in my sobriety. I too believe I'd run from that. Thankfully again, that's not my AA experience.
I'm grateful that the meetings and people in my life seem different than a lot of the ones I hear about on this forum. Maybe also people in AA respect me a bit more, because of the time I've accumulated. I rarely get anybody breathing down my neck regarding things I should and shouldn't do. Just a rare BB thumper here and there, and they get to me enough to understand how you feel
.I myself would love to check out RR, or one of the other groups but I feel I'm almost too far gone in AA to even give it a try. I'm fine with the fact that they're coming from a different angle, but I've heard a lot about the AA bashing stuff, and it wouldn't fly well with me. And I know too I wouldn't be able to keep my mouth shut. Not sure if I want to invite that kind of thing into my life, and since what I'm doing is working - you know, why try to fix it if it ain't broken. I do have interest however in things outside of the 12 steps and the bigbook. I liked the ideas behind mindfulness and CBT and feel I'd probably be able to benefit from a support group based on that kind of thing. Maybe one day I'll find a meeting based supplement that works. Maybe one day I'll try RR so I can at least talk from experience, and not what I've heard others say. Others have been very wrong about AA, I imagine the same could easily be true for RR.
Anyhoo... Feel I'm thinking out loud hear so forgive me if I'm going OT. Only thing I'd like to suggest is finishing the steps. Seems you're open to it, and believing them to be a positive thing. I can only see one benefitting from that. The fact that it sounds like you're stopping short at 6 does lead me to think the next 3 might have you questioning something. 8 and 9, IMO are the 2 toughest steps... and for some 7 poses equal challenges. I know people who are doing things they know are not healthy or good for them, but they believe step 7 says they have to give them up. Which isn't true, but I won't get into that as it's a whole nuther subject. Step 7 is to me nothing more than a complete willingness to become the best person I can possibly be. Doesn't tell me I have to quit or stop doing anything. Although over time (decades even) that's what seemed to happen.
Anyhow, I appreciate your posts here and look forward to hearing of your new experience. Who knows, I might run into ya one day at one of those other places. Wishing you the best.....
One afterthought. There are lots of threads on quitting today, or forever, and IME the today thing is nothing more than a tool for people new in recovery, and a message to live in the moment for anyone past that. 99% of the people I know (OK, maybe 97
) with a few or more years sober are in this for life. And they know it. They just might state it differently at times out of habit, because it sounds good, or for the newcomer. Anyone with any sober time truly hanging onto 1 day at a time regarding picking up a drink, isn't where I'd ever want to be in my sobriety. I too believe I'd run from that. Thankfully again, that's not my AA experience.Joe - I actually see much logic and sense in the 12 steps - I perhaps tend to migrate towards a more non secular 12 step approach though - but that s just me.
I don't take to AA bashing - like I said, AA has done wonders getting me sober, becoming more aware and spiritual. I will always be in debt to the program. My issues as I updated probably have more to do with the people I have come in contact with in the program - which is too bad. Who knows I may find RR does not do it for me and I return to AA? The good thing is I have what is required for membership - the desire to stop drinking - this will not change - ever!
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