caboblanco

to be born an alcoholic as many or most in recovery people believe is how alcoholism starts there would have to be a specific gene that was directly linked to alcoholism. Experts have never found such a gene or series of genes to be able to call anybody even prone to alcoholism. If anybody has real proof of this I would like to see it. I don't know why so-called experts make up ideas and try to pass them off as fact. I don't know the motivation to do that but if anybody has an idea please chime in. I like to think people like to base their recovery in science or fact but it seems a lot of people believe what is just most comfortable for them to hear. To tell someone they were born an alcoholic is like taking all the blame off the alcoholic.

bigsombrero

I dunno, a quick google search gave me hundreds of examples, including this one from the U of Michigan that links genetics (among other things) to predisposed alcoholism. It was posted in Science Daily, is that legit enough for you?

Scientists explore new link between genetics, alcoholism and the brain

You ask people for real proof that it's genetically linked - I don't think true proof exists. But science IS working on it. At least we're trying to find a link of some kind. What are you saying - that we are all just deviant miscreants who want to be alcoholics?

I am all about science and facts. I don't believe in Jesus or any other ancient myths about gods and religions that human society still clings to. I believe in double-blind, published research studies. I also believe that we need to keep an open mind, keep reading and researching, and ANYTHING we can find, no matter how small, to link alcoholism to either behavior OR genetics is important.

Simply posting a thread saying "A genetic disposition to alcoholism has not been proven" doesn't really get us anywhere. You're right, of course, but what are we supposed to do? Stop trying to find one?

nomis

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zykD9Pn8Kx0

Start listening around the 1:45 mark. Most doctors I've listened to suggest that alcoholism is a combination of genetic and environmental factors.

caboblanco

No big. I just don't think we should pass things off as fact that aren't. There has been many alcohol gene studies and no dice

bigsombrero

I was certainly never presented a genetic link as fact. I am not sure one exists, but I do appreciate the research that goes into trying to find something. Locating the source of this problem is complex.

For all I know, we're all alcoholics because every one of us stubbed our toe on a rusty nail at some point between the ages of 2 and 4. I really don't care, I'm just excited every time I see research grants given to folks who are trying to find a common link.

Don't you find it interesting that Greece and Italy have fewer people disposed to alcoholism than other nations? The theory is that wine and beer have been consumed in those countries for so long that all of those with weak genetics towards alcohol have died out along the way. Therefore, they have fewer people left with the "alcoholism" gene. Because they all died out. I dunno, seems worth exploring. Again, I'm open to anything. Dismissing research IMO doesn't do us any good.

2granddaughters

For centuries it was common knowledge that the world was flat ... and the sun revolved around the earth.

Whether I was "born" an alcoholic or developed into an alcoholic is of little consequence. The question today is what am I going to do about it.

All the best.

Bob R

visch1

Really how important is it? Fortunately I am aware that I cannot drink alcohol in safety. No debating that, I proved it! Also I’m compulsive by nature or genetically, doesn’t matter, I can’t eat just 1 potato chip, 1 teaspoon of ice cream or 1 of most things. For me it’s a continual situation. BE WELL

Grymt

Part of the problem and caution that people approach this with may have a genesis in the acts of Eugenics.
The world at times is ravaged by people who use such to justify crimes against humanity. This is a fact. It is lamentable.
As the world that we live continues to experience economic uncertainties (Greece for example has gone from a country with one of the lowest rates of suicide to one with the most, interestingly particularly amongst ordinary phamacists) alcoholics will continue to have to deal with alcoholism.
All that really matters to me is that I'm an alcoholic and I don't drink. I think it's good for alcoholics to not drink.

Mountainmanbob

nomis

Try watching the documentary "Pleasure Unwoven" on Youtube. It tackles the choice theory head on.

nandm

What difference does it really make?

The bottom line is I am an alcoholic. I can not drink alcohol in any shape or form.

Whether I was predisposed by genetics, environment, or whatever really won't change who I am today or the outcome of my situation. I fully support research into this area though as it would be nice to see science find a way to keep others from spending years wasting their lives and then maybe if they are really lucky find sobriety and have to rebuild their lives from there. Just for the record, agree with BigSombero that the evidence is not fully in on whether there is a genetic link to it or not. We truly do not know enough about genetics and genetic markers yet.

Pastispast

the same can be said for the higher power myth - but as open minded tolerant people we allow others to find the answers for themselves.
I take it from your thread you haven't read much of the empirical evidence and are just going on a hunch - good luck with that.

Justfor1

cabo, I believe alcoholism is caused my poor choices. Alcoholics take to "self-medicating" & the body and mind becomes addicted. Being under the influence, causes alcoholics to make even poorer choices & many become criminals.

caboblanco

If you have empirical evidence that people are genetically predisposed to alcoholism I would love to see it. To just say it seems through my observation that alcoholics run in families or so on is not evidence. If someone observes that without a valid study and writes a article about it is not evidence either. I have read about real scientific studies and none of them have proven the genetic predisposition stance.

AlcoStudent86

caboblanco, are you suggesting that alcoholism is not a real illness?

caboblanco

i'm not suggesting that I'm saying that nobody is born an alcoholic, however I in no way believe alcoholism is a disease. That theory is based on pseudo science and I don't know why it ever got accepted. It's an insult to people with real diseases

Johno1967

Hmmmm.... similar argument pitched by climate change skeptics. While people debate about the cause no one is doing anything about the problem.

[/QUOTE]"It's an insult to people with real diseases"[/QUOTE]

That would be your opinion. I'm sure no one has ever done research into that statement.

Is depression a disease? It seems to have much of the western world medicated. Must be pseudo science too. A conspiracy why I'm feeling this way.

I've been told I'm bipolar as well as an alcoholic, I thought I was just a misfit and a p*sshead. My Father suffered all his life with both and my brother committed suicide a manic depressive with bulimia and obsessive compulsive behavior. My sister tried to take her life and suffered bipolar and addictive behavior until she got help. Must be a coincidence.

As someone with a "real disease" I'm not insulted if the alcoholic inside me says he has a sickness of the mind, body and soul. I just know that one drink will tick me off and lead to a spiral of events the mental health profession would label "psychotic". Then no one is holding that gun to my head, and if they were I still wouldn't take that drink. So you might be right but I think you are wrong.

Have a nice day.

Dee74

We all have opinions - strong ones sometimes.

Should the fact that other people believe differently really bother us that much?

I'm in the camp that believes it matters more what I do about my problem than anything else.

Use your energy to stay sober, be happy, live a good and productive life

D

ABIDEBYLAW

Born an alcoholic? I am with you. Do not believe in this at all.
Every person can have their opnion and deservedly so.
My parents and upbringing was the best. I did my damage on my own and will NEVER blame anyone except myself for my own poor decisions.
God Bless all!

ClearLight

holy moly… this is just wrong in several ways.

First you say that alcoholism would have to be caused by a specific gene and in the very next sentence you refer to "a gene or series of genes". That's fundamentally inconsistent. A gene and a series of genes are not at all the same thing. You should know that before you make a sweeping generalization.
You should also know that it's not just genes that are biological factors in behavior - but it's obvious you don't.
What your statement really reveals is that you don't understand anything about biological causation of human behavioral traits - you don't know what you're talking about.

I'm sure it feels good to say but it doesn't have any connection to the real world and it's an opinion that isn't based on any real understanding of biology and human behavior.

From this obvious lack of knowledge you make the pronouncement that you, the person with nothing to back them up and no understanding of what you're talking about, have decided that what "many or most recovery people" suppose is wrong.

From there you request that "If anybody has real proof of this I would like to see it." - as if you would know what they were talking about.

Finally you conclude with the statement "To tell someone they were born an alcoholic is like taking all the blame off the alcoholic." Which, all by itself, is wrong.

I don't mind if somebody has some knowledge, or personal experience, to share. But to make sweeping generalizations with absolutely nothing to back it up is just a waste. While it makes you feel important it doesn't do anybody any good.