1,537 days and the streaks over....
Administrator
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 211,439
I could be PC and just wish you well...but I don't really think you'd appreciate that Stu.
I do wish you well, and I hope you're right - but, if for nothing else but the benefit of others...a few personal observations
..
The problem was me too...but the me problem I have includes my use of alcohol and other drugs.
Many's the time I drank and nothing bad happened....that kinda misses the point when you consider the many thousands of times I drank and drugged and bad things *did* happen, even if they were mostly soul-based....
I've had to learn, painfully, that anytime I think a drink is a good idea (or at least not a bad idea) I'm in trouble.
Anytime I think I can turn it off like a tap, I'm in trouble.
Anytime I forget where I've come from and think the rules don't apply now, I'm in trouble.
Anytime I'm drinking to fit in, to not be different, I'm in trouble too.
I've struggled hard to build a new life over the last 5 years. It's a good life because I've accepted what and who I am.
I've come to see that acceptance as a great gift.
Regardless of the fact we may see the gift in different lights, I truly wish the same for you.
I am sorry for the loss of your friend.
D
I do wish you well, and I hope you're right - but, if for nothing else but the benefit of others...a few personal observations
I was the problem not the booze or alcohol. My life sucked because of ME not any other reason. Through God and the programs of AA/NA I have learned how to fix ME. Nothing else, just ME. This isnt a test, or an experiment. This is life. With the risk of getting this post closed down, I had half a glass of beer at a memorial for some lost friends. I didnt rob a liquor store or buy dope after. I just believe that with AA/NA goes abstinence, which I no longer subscribe to. Just sayin.
The problem was me too...but the me problem I have includes my use of alcohol and other drugs.
Many's the time I drank and nothing bad happened....that kinda misses the point when you consider the many thousands of times I drank and drugged and bad things *did* happen, even if they were mostly soul-based....
I've had to learn, painfully, that anytime I think a drink is a good idea (or at least not a bad idea) I'm in trouble.
Anytime I think I can turn it off like a tap, I'm in trouble.
Anytime I forget where I've come from and think the rules don't apply now, I'm in trouble.
Anytime I'm drinking to fit in, to not be different, I'm in trouble too.
I've struggled hard to build a new life over the last 5 years. It's a good life because I've accepted what and who I am.
I've come to see that acceptance as a great gift.
Regardless of the fact we may see the gift in different lights, I truly wish the same for you.
I am sorry for the loss of your friend.
D
Self recovered Self discovered
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Toronto Canada
Posts: 5,148
We here never learn about the success stories of the sort you are describing, what we have are only the failed cases. Sorta like taking a roll call and asking for those absent to sound off. I am sure that people do resume moderate drinking, the capacity of the human spirit is limitless I believe. Even if it is only one in a thousand, or one in a million, it still happens. That's not where my money is because I don't play those odds, but still...
Here is an excellent survey of studies, data, and an extensive if not exhaustive collection of literature about recovery from alcoholism and a return to moderate drinking. It also raises the obvious questions concerning various models of alcoholism and how they may be addressed. Draw your own conclusions.
I expect you to be a success at whatever you do, so can you drop me a line from time to time to tell me how things are going? I wish you well on your journey, Stugotz. My deepest condolences on the passing of your buddy.
Here is an excellent survey of studies, data, and an extensive if not exhaustive collection of literature about recovery from alcoholism and a return to moderate drinking. It also raises the obvious questions concerning various models of alcoholism and how they may be addressed. Draw your own conclusions.
I expect you to be a success at whatever you do, so can you drop me a line from time to time to tell me how things are going? I wish you well on your journey, Stugotz. My deepest condolences on the passing of your buddy.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Eastern Us
Posts: 1,366
Stu,
I'm very sorry about your friend. Life can be a real kick in the n@ts sometimes.
I've always learned something from your postings. From having the guts to post your mugshot for the world to see, to saying unpopular, but sometimes necessary things, to your apparent fondness to Charles Bukowski.
Life isn't static. What once seemed paramount at one point in our lives, sometimes becomes just an occasional thought at a different time. Perhaps you have learned enough about yourself and the damage that alcoholic drinking can cause that you can just close that chapter of your life an get on with living. I do think that you have too much experience with this to just stop lending a voice when you can to help, especially the struggling new comers. You had it bad and you survived. That is a powerful story.
You have helped me and I'm not AA. I'm better to have "known" you and I'm sure a lot of others feel the same way.
I'm very sorry about your friend. Life can be a real kick in the n@ts sometimes.
I've always learned something from your postings. From having the guts to post your mugshot for the world to see, to saying unpopular, but sometimes necessary things, to your apparent fondness to Charles Bukowski.
Life isn't static. What once seemed paramount at one point in our lives, sometimes becomes just an occasional thought at a different time. Perhaps you have learned enough about yourself and the damage that alcoholic drinking can cause that you can just close that chapter of your life an get on with living. I do think that you have too much experience with this to just stop lending a voice when you can to help, especially the struggling new comers. You had it bad and you survived. That is a powerful story.
You have helped me and I'm not AA. I'm better to have "known" you and I'm sure a lot of others feel the same way.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Poconos PA
Posts: 1,544
You are the Man Stu. I always thought so and I am happy for you in whatever you choose. Glad you are finding balance in your life. I should also add, whatever anyone chooses out there as long as it keeps them safe and steady then do your thing. If you can't control then you must roll.
Another Day in Paradise
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Upland, CA
Posts: 900
Best wishes and I hope life turns out just the way you hope for. I will impart one thought, unfortunately it isn't original, although I would like to lay claim to it.
WHEN YOU GET HIT BY A TRAIN-IT ISN'T THE CABOOSE THAT KILLS YOU.
All the best, and while I attend very few meetings anymore I do stay in touch with AA and I can only speak for myself, but excess is still apparent in my daily behavior and it was excess that did me in. Sober 13 years but even with no desire to drink, I can say that alcohol adds nothing to my life and I have seen what it CAN take away. That said; I do not play on the tracks.
Just me, everyone else please feel free to move about the cabin
Jon
WHEN YOU GET HIT BY A TRAIN-IT ISN'T THE CABOOSE THAT KILLS YOU.
All the best, and while I attend very few meetings anymore I do stay in touch with AA and I can only speak for myself, but excess is still apparent in my daily behavior and it was excess that did me in. Sober 13 years but even with no desire to drink, I can say that alcohol adds nothing to my life and I have seen what it CAN take away. That said; I do not play on the tracks.
Just me, everyone else please feel free to move about the cabin
Jon
Member of SMART Recovery
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,722
Yeah, you know, this is an issue most folks with long term sobriety have to face sooner or later. Life is better. We know that some folks who were once addicted can drink socially...maybe we're one of them?
I won't do it myself for two reasons. One, I made an irrevocable commitment. Two, I enjoy my life just fine the way it is. I would never risk it.
But that's me. I respect the decisions of others. They don't threaten my own choice, and I want to know what people's experiences are. So stugotz, I hope you'll check in and let us know how you are.
I won't do it myself for two reasons. One, I made an irrevocable commitment. Two, I enjoy my life just fine the way it is. I would never risk it.
But that's me. I respect the decisions of others. They don't threaten my own choice, and I want to know what people's experiences are. So stugotz, I hope you'll check in and let us know how you are.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Chicago
Posts: 166
Originally Posted by stugotz 
Well folks, I have entered civilian life. Therefore with my strong belief of total abstinence, I can no longer consider myself part of the Sober community for that reason alone. I still maintain the same Morals and Beliefs that saved my life and was attainable only through God and AA/NA. Do I regret my decision? Nope, actually I am unburdened as to all the what ifs? I am not the same person that I was for nearly 25 years as an addict and drunk. I would love to still chime in here at SR once in a while but as for my recent change in status, my opinions wouldnt hold water....
On a side note, our community was struck by a recent tragedy down here. Prayers for Family and Friends would be greatly appreciated. Just sayin.....
Warlocks biker shooting arrests: Third Warlocks club member died - Orlando Sentinel
On a side note, our community was struck by a recent tragedy down here. Prayers for Family and Friends would be greatly appreciated. Just sayin.....
Warlocks biker shooting arrests: Third Warlocks club member died - Orlando Sentinel
Cunning, baffling, powerful and maybe most of all, patient. It will wait for decades until a crack appears in your armor.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Bethlehem, PA.
Posts: 1,781
Stu, I know you already mentioned several times that you don't intend to go back to drinking so this is more for those who might be reading this thread and think you're inferring that spiritual fittness is a cure for addictions. I would first ask why total abstinence is a part of 12 step programs if getting spiritually fit actually cured addictions. In theory if you were cured you wouldn't need to abstain.
Second I would ask why the clergy (a group of spiritually fit people), also has a high rate of alcoholism. While getting spiritually fit has many rewards it will not, in and of itself cure all addictions. Please everyone keep in mind that there is a brain chemistry, biology and psychology of addictions that could care less if you're spiritually fit or not.
Here are a few articles that talk about the biology of it all. :
Corrupted Choice
Is Addiction the Result of Brain Evolution? | Psychology Today
The Brain is Vulnerable to Hacking by Drugs | Psychology Today
The Pivot Point | Psychology Today
Just something for everyone to keep in mind. Sorry to hear about the loss of your friend Stu and best wishes in everything going forward.
Second I would ask why the clergy (a group of spiritually fit people), also has a high rate of alcoholism. While getting spiritually fit has many rewards it will not, in and of itself cure all addictions. Please everyone keep in mind that there is a brain chemistry, biology and psychology of addictions that could care less if you're spiritually fit or not.
Here are a few articles that talk about the biology of it all. :
Corrupted Choice
Is Addiction the Result of Brain Evolution? | Psychology Today
The Brain is Vulnerable to Hacking by Drugs | Psychology Today
The Pivot Point | Psychology Today
Just something for everyone to keep in mind. Sorry to hear about the loss of your friend Stu and best wishes in everything going forward.
High on Life
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Been to Hell and Back
Posts: 1,157
Originally Posted by stugotz
All of these things are exactly what happens when we use. So it shouldnt come as a surprise. Sobriety has "Promises" drinking has "guarantees". Just sayin...
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Merritt Island, Fl
Posts: 1,164
Originally Posted by Sally1009
Not sure if you had any more to drink after that one beer. Do you plan to continue drinking? Or was it a one time slip?
Nope, no more. As for a slip? Absolutley not, that would imply that while practicing abstinency I chose to drink. That my friend was not the case at all. Just sayin...
Sally1009
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 467
Originally Posted by stugotz
Nope, no more. As for a slip? Absolutley not, that would imply that while practicing abstinency I chose to drink. That my friend was not the case at all. Just sayin...
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Merritt Island, Fl
Posts: 1,164
Originally Posted by Sally1009
So, just so I understand (sorry if I'm being stupid) are you saying you have made a decision to include alcohol in your life now, and that you feel able to drink moderately? If so, are you SURE this is not denial? Just saying this because I care.
Originally Posted by Threshold
Stu,
Four years in recovery and I feel like I am not any better off deep inside me.
Recovery can be a "cover" as well, an interesting distraction from life and my deeper inner issues. I did that version of recovery. But in time I got down to brass tacks, got honest, or as honest as am I currently able. Maybe in another four years I'll find an honesty deep and raw enough to set me free.
I don't care if I ever get to a place where I can say "I could take a drink and it wouldn't matter". But I want to get up in the morning and feel I can face the day, really face it and embrace it without layers of magical thinking, masks and sidestepping.
I've always gotten the sense that is what you want as well, for your life to not be about drinking, or not drinking, or a regimen of recovery. But for life to be about life, which is enough. More than enough.
Four years in recovery and I feel like I am not any better off deep inside me.
Recovery can be a "cover" as well, an interesting distraction from life and my deeper inner issues. I did that version of recovery. But in time I got down to brass tacks, got honest, or as honest as am I currently able. Maybe in another four years I'll find an honesty deep and raw enough to set me free.
I don't care if I ever get to a place where I can say "I could take a drink and it wouldn't matter". But I want to get up in the morning and feel I can face the day, really face it and embrace it without layers of magical thinking, masks and sidestepping.
I've always gotten the sense that is what you want as well, for your life to not be about drinking, or not drinking, or a regimen of recovery. But for life to be about life, which is enough. More than enough.
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