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What is the actual recovery rate?

Old 09-26-2012, 07:26 PM
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I'm so sorry everyone, I didn't mean to cause such an uproar. As a matter of fact I've never even read Orange Papers. I just know I've seen it mentioned on here before, and I know it purports to provide some kind of statistical analysis of the success rate of AA. I have no personal frame of reference on whether said analysis is accurate or not.

Of course AA works for some people, while other programs work for other people. Whatever works for one person is what that person should focus on.
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Old 09-26-2012, 07:27 PM
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From my observation:

Alcoholics, problem drinkers, heavy drinkers, etc, who don't want to quit 100% for them self have 0% chance of staying sober, while every drinker who wants to quit 100% for them self has about 100% chance of eventually getting sober.

Some people I've seen who fall into the Don't want to quit for themselves are: Stopping only when they get caught; Stopping to get someone or something off their back; Want to just cut down; Want to still drink on special occasions; Still romanticize alcohol; Can't see themselves living without alcohol; Stopping for someone else; Don't want to change old habits.

Everyday you can choose to be one of the 100% who don't drink today or the 100% who do drink. It's all up to you.
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Old 09-26-2012, 11:05 PM
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I suppose that the statisticians would consider me to be an AA failure because I dropped out soon after completing my 90 in 90. For all any AA study knows, I'm the same as someone who left and went back to the bottle. But those three months there helped get me off on the right foot and I've been sober since, for almost 4 years. The program ultimately wasn't for me because I didn't feel that I fit in for a variety of reasons - that discussion is outside the context of this thread. I do think, however, that the program ultimately helped me get on my feet again towards a successful recovery so far, and I am confident that I have taken my last drink. Couldn't imagine going back to the bottle ever again. It's infinitely easier for me to rationalize not drinking now than drinking again.

The final point is that if I had a brother who was in my shoes from four years ago, I would wholeheartedly tell him to do 90 in 90... this from an AA dropout who remains sober but would be considered an AA failure statistically.
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Old 09-26-2012, 11:51 PM
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Originally Posted by livingsober View Post
I suppose that the statisticians would consider me to be an AA failure because I dropped out soon after completing my 90 in 90. For all any AA study knows, I'm the same as someone who left and went back to the bottle. But those three months there helped get me off on the right foot and I've been sober since, for almost 4 years. The program ultimately wasn't for me because I didn't feel that I fit in for a variety of reasons - that discussion is outside the context of this thread. I do think, however, that the program ultimately helped me get on my feet again towards a successful recovery so far, and I am confident that I have taken my last drink. Couldn't imagine going back to the bottle ever again. It's infinitely easier for me to rationalize not drinking now than drinking again.

The final point is that if I had a brother who was in my shoes from four years ago, I would wholeheartedly tell him to do 90 in 90... this from an AA dropout who remains sober but would be considered an AA failure statistically.
That's so true...There are a few people on this site like that. I understand AA is not for everyone...And why you don't fit in doesn't matter to me. I am curious though...If you want to answer....Did you ever do the 12 steps with a sponsor?
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Old 09-27-2012, 04:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Titanic View Post
What is the actual recovery rate for alcoholics who WORK the AA program? Other alcohol recovery programs? Are there any published, professional studies about recovery rates?
welp, i think you can read and read on the www about success rates of every recovery method out there. but finding statistics from the recovery program itself, whether it be GA,CA,NA, AVRT, RR, SAA, OEA, or what have you, you will prolly be hard pressed to find statistics from the programs themselves on their recovery rates.

here is a fact: whether it be AA, AVRT,RR, or whatever other method of recovery, every person who hasnt had a drink today is 100% successful. we only have today.

now on to the real issue:

why is this question asked?
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Old 09-27-2012, 05:10 AM
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I'm kind of like livingsober. I went to AA in the summer of 2011 and made a decision to moderate in fall of 2011. I ultimately decided to quit all alcohol on my own in the summer of 2012 forever. I did not have an AA sponsor or work any of the steps, but attended daily meetings and read the big book.

AA was an ENORMOUS inspiration to me. I picked up the phone and called their hotline one day and they were THERE for me instantly. They got me to a meeting and the man who had answered the phone was waiting there for me with a hot cup of coffee!

My point is , I am eternally grateful to AA and consider myself an AA success story
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Old 09-27-2012, 05:35 AM
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Because I wanted to learn more about alcoholism and how different programs stack up, tomsteve.

One can pick out a song from Top 40 music or one from a particular genre (or band).
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Old 09-27-2012, 06:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Titanic View Post
Because I wanted to learn more about alcoholism and how different programs stack up, tomsteve.
I think you would be doing yourself an injustice if you didn't at least try them all. The only reason I didn't try AVRT or SMART is because AA worked for me. It may sound strange but I've heard the same thing from other members...I knew when I walked into my first AA meeting I was right where I was supposed to be. Find what you feel right with and ride it!
I will say one thing I've noticed on this site....I've seen people that have gone the AVRT route because it sounds like an easier path to take...No meetings....Promise yourself you are done and you never drink again...I see a lot of people with a few months sober saying how great it is and then they are gone. I think if it was that easy AA would have closed it's doors....My homegroup keeps growing....I see new people every day.
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Old 09-27-2012, 06:25 AM
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I've seen a lot of claims, some referring to "research" others not. As some have pointed out - there is NO way to do an objective, controlled scientific study. Another thing to keep in mind when looking at "statistical studies" - there are three kinds of liars: liars, damn liars, and statisticians.

Best to just find something that works for you and give 100% to that and not worry about other approaches. As long as it works for you, you're golden. As an analogy: I have allergies. My Dr. tried many meds to get them under control. None worked till he hit on the one that worked for me. I can't fault the meds that didn't work for me. They work for a lot of people, just not me. Once I found the med that aleviates my allergies I had my relief. No need to worry about the other meds. Just keep taking the one that works for me and no more suffering.
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Old 09-27-2012, 06:28 AM
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Great post Charon!
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Old 09-27-2012, 06:29 AM
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There will never be reliable statistics on this issue.
It is a personal journey.
My father is 83yrs old.
After a particularly spectacular implosion of his life, business, sanity, etc., he was helped limping from the ashes and started a new life 20yrs ago.
No recovery program. Just a helping hand from family and friends and the local doctor. He has not drank since. There is alcohol often in the house, which angers me. I drank that alcohol when I was there. I too fell apart. I pulled myself out of the quicksand. I got a little house nearby, started attending AA and slowly, over a couple of months, stopped drinking. That was nearly 2 years ago.
Are we both a success?
I don't know.
We could be both plastered tomorrow.
As said above, the chances of succeeding are zero, if one does not try.
I do say a prayer every night for addicts, alcoholics and people with mental health issues. It is an incredible battle to overcome an invisible torment.
Statistics are pointless.
SR probably has an extraordinary success rate.
By simply giving people a window into the world of recovery.

Too end on an annoying cliche, "It is an inside job".
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Old 09-27-2012, 06:33 AM
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I do want to clarify,
I didn't start drinking in my parents' house.
I got a pretty good start all by myself before moving in with them.
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Old 09-27-2012, 06:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Hollyanne View Post
I do want to clarify,
I didn't start drinking in my parents' house.
I got a pretty good start all by myself before moving in with them.
:rotfxko:rotfxko:rotfxko

now that was a great laugh to start the day.

always good to not take oursevles too seriously and sometimes find the humor in it.
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Old 09-27-2012, 06:55 AM
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Don't know the percentage, but I've never met someone who actually worked the 12steps and continued to work them and then gone back out and relapsed. Those who relapse in AA seem to do so because they stop doing the work or never did it in the first place. My experience is that a spiritually fit alcoholic doesn't get drunk.
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Old 09-27-2012, 06:56 AM
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Amen
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Old 09-27-2012, 07:04 AM
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I just focus on my own personal stats. In the end, that's all that matters.
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Old 09-27-2012, 10:15 AM
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Originally Posted by miamifella View Post
As has been pointed out there is a lot of difficulty in determining a success rate for any recovery program. Who is counted part of the program? What is success?
I agree. I used to believe that only 1 in 20 would make it to what I considered successful recovery (lifetime sobriety). However, I now see where something like half of those in recovery are achieving their goals. The real problem is that most of those in recovery have short term goals.

Many people simply have alcohol-issues. ie; lost license, lost job, lost spouse... etc...

They only get into recovery in thew first place because outside circumstances are pressuring them into it. They set a short and/or medium goal of getting their stuff back and than work a program just hard enough/long enough to achieve their goal.

My observation has been that at least half of them make it. Then stay sober a few more months on top of that to prove to themselves that they are winners. Unfortunately, after some waiting period, most end up going back to their old ways of living, socializing and drinking. Starting the whole vicious cycle all over again.

Do we count these people as successful or as failures?
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Old 09-27-2012, 10:30 AM
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I'm trying to find the source that had statistics saying that the recovery rate is about 5% whether you're in a program or not.
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Old 09-27-2012, 11:01 AM
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Out of the twenty five core members of my Homegroup when I first attended 35 years ago I know of 10 others who are still sober and active in AA. One woman has struggle most of that time but now has three years. Three I know died. Two passed on sober. the rest have moved or moved on and I don't know where they are.

So, I don't know the answer to your question. I just know that AA works if you work and live the 12 steps.
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Old 09-27-2012, 11:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Sapling View Post
From what I have seen in my 15 months in AA.....People that work the program as laid out in the book.....100%
Well said. AA worked for me because I worked for it.


All the best.

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