Tough Love or Common Sense ????
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Tough Love or Common Sense ????
Most readers have or will conclude that I am a proponent of AA's tough love philosophy but I'm really not. I believe in the AA program, way of life, and that is what I know. So that is where I start from when I post here. I push the steps and metings and reading he AA literature, especially the BB to the people I have worked with and to ppl to whom I talk to in casual converstation. There is nothing remarkable about that, most AA's do that. I try to remain tolerant and patient and to a large degree I succeed at that. Stop laughing. I try to live the program of AA to the best of my ability. Again, nothing remarkable about that. That is what AA's are supposed to do. Principles before personalities. Well that is the theory and the goal but sometimes I fall short.
That is what happened in the (excuse the reference) Wiebe threads. I fell short of the mark. I became increasingly frustrated by all the in-action going on. In-action is translated as I'll quit drinking tomorrow or next year or after just one more. In-action is translated as ppl saying 'Oh, thats OK....We all slip...you can start again...were here for you' etc. Fine sentiments and certainly friendly but not accurate because all of us don't slip, I havn't...YET. And how do you know that you can start again. My next drunk, God forbid, may be the end of me. I may not be alive to come back again. Or I may wrap my car around a tree and end up a quadriplegic. Or I may kill someone else. In-action is also translated as not telling the newcomer what the consequences are. That is what madened me in 'that other thread.'
So I got involved, many called that tough love and thought it inappropriate. Some thought the message was correct but the delivery was wrong. They were probably right, about my delivery that is. I call it plain old common sense. Someone has a drinking problem. solution? Quit drinking. That never happened and NO ONE called him on it, so I did. The people on that thread were more concerned about being his friend and themselves then giving him the straight truth. It is his decision to make and nobody can quit for him or stay stopped for him But the message should be made clear. He will kill himself or others and certainly destroy his chance of happiness unless he stops drinking. Alcoholics from my experience take a terrific beating before admitting defeat. And we/I needed to hear time after time just what could and did happen to others to realize that that could happen to me. That is the importance of 'war stories' and constatn repetition of what we were like. That sort of thing was not happening on that other thread.
Well OK, this is not AA-understood. AA is not the only way-also understood. But is this forum for people who want to quit or not? And if you want to quit alcohol wouldn't it be a good idea to actually quit drinking? Not talk about quitting but actually quit. That is the common sense part of my title. That was and is where I am coming from. Got a drinking problem? You should quit. Pick a method that suits you but quit or go finish your drinking.
Finally if I could have carried that message without pissing people off I would have. But I would rather **** someone off by telling them the truth about their condition than not saying anything at all.
I will work on how I deliver my message as I hope you will.
That is what happened in the (excuse the reference) Wiebe threads. I fell short of the mark. I became increasingly frustrated by all the in-action going on. In-action is translated as I'll quit drinking tomorrow or next year or after just one more. In-action is translated as ppl saying 'Oh, thats OK....We all slip...you can start again...were here for you' etc. Fine sentiments and certainly friendly but not accurate because all of us don't slip, I havn't...YET. And how do you know that you can start again. My next drunk, God forbid, may be the end of me. I may not be alive to come back again. Or I may wrap my car around a tree and end up a quadriplegic. Or I may kill someone else. In-action is also translated as not telling the newcomer what the consequences are. That is what madened me in 'that other thread.'
So I got involved, many called that tough love and thought it inappropriate. Some thought the message was correct but the delivery was wrong. They were probably right, about my delivery that is. I call it plain old common sense. Someone has a drinking problem. solution? Quit drinking. That never happened and NO ONE called him on it, so I did. The people on that thread were more concerned about being his friend and themselves then giving him the straight truth. It is his decision to make and nobody can quit for him or stay stopped for him But the message should be made clear. He will kill himself or others and certainly destroy his chance of happiness unless he stops drinking. Alcoholics from my experience take a terrific beating before admitting defeat. And we/I needed to hear time after time just what could and did happen to others to realize that that could happen to me. That is the importance of 'war stories' and constatn repetition of what we were like. That sort of thing was not happening on that other thread.
Well OK, this is not AA-understood. AA is not the only way-also understood. But is this forum for people who want to quit or not? And if you want to quit alcohol wouldn't it be a good idea to actually quit drinking? Not talk about quitting but actually quit. That is the common sense part of my title. That was and is where I am coming from. Got a drinking problem? You should quit. Pick a method that suits you but quit or go finish your drinking.
Finally if I could have carried that message without pissing people off I would have. But I would rather **** someone off by telling them the truth about their condition than not saying anything at all.
I will work on how I deliver my message as I hope you will.
~Author of My Life~
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Doing what I thought I couldn't....
Posts: 4,796
I understand where you are coming from very much. I think for me it is a word play, simple semantics when I say I don't believe in'tough love" I still believe love is tough when necessary, love is gentle when necessary, I think the connotation of someone hearing the words "tough love" is what seems negative. I know many times in my life the way in which I approached someone although well-intended...I would lose the message by my forcefulness or other negative behaviour. And also, I think we are all just different you know? Everyone has their views and philosophy, and how they deliver it. I also know for me as an alcoholic/addict, I have to watch how I perceive things, I am either too sensitive or I am way gung-ho....that's my experience though. I do believe we all want and desire sobriety and happiness for ourselves, and for the newcomer who is suffering. I do not follow just one program, but will say I believe the 12 steps in themselves are powerful and very helpful. The first three I try to review every morning, in addition there are other tools I use. We become very passionate about this because one, we probably almost died or lost everything ourselves, we find a program that saved us...and we just want to tell someone...Please!! Listen...this DOES work!! Totally understandable to me. I feel the same way, except I don't only endorse or support AA/NA, but like I said..I think the 12 steps are an awesome tool.
Hope you don't mind Niner....sending a ***hug*** your way!!
Hope you don't mind Niner....sending a ***hug*** your way!!
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a page from the BB..
"Our behavior is as absurd and incomprehensible with respect to the first drink as that of an individual with a passion, say, for jay-walking. He gets a thrill out of skipping in front of fast-moving vehicles. He enjoys himself for a few years in spite of friendly warnings. Up to this point you would label him as a foolish chap having queer ideas of fun. Luck then deserts him and he is slightly injured several times in succession. You would expect him, if he were normal, to cut it out. Presently he is hit again and this time has a fractured skull. Within a week after leaving the hospital a fast-moving trolley car breaks his arm. He tells you he has decided to stop jay-walking for good, but in a few weeks he breaks both legs.
On through the years this conduct continues, accompanied by his continual promises to be careful or to keep off the streets altogether. Finally, he can no longer work, his wife gets a divorce and he is held up to ridicule. He tries every known means to get the jaywalking idea out of his head. He shuts himself up in an asylum, hoping to mend his ways. But the day he comes out he races in front of a fire engine, which breaks his back. Such a man would be crazy, wouldn't he?
You may think our illustration is too ridiculous. But is it? We, who have been through the wringer, have to admit if we substituted alcoholism for jay-walking, the illustration would fit exactly. However intelligent we may have been in other respects, where alcohol has been involved, we have been strangely insane. It's strong language but isn't it true?
Some of you are thinking: "Yes, what you tell is true, but it doesn't fully apply. We admit we have some of these symptoms, but we have not gone to the extremes you fellows did, nor are we likely to, for we understand ourselves so well after what you have told us that such things cannot happen again. We have not lost everything in life through drinking and we certainly do not intend to. Thanks for the information."
That may be true of certain nonalcoholic people who, though drinking foolishly and heavily at the present time, are able to stop or moderate, because their brains and bodies have not been damaged as ours were. But the actual or potential alcoholic, with hardly any exception, will be absolutely unable to stop drinking on the basis of self-knowledge. This is a point we wish to emphasize and re-emphasize, to smash home upon our alcoholic"
It is the Insanity as the above quote describes that I had to come to grips with. With me no common sense in the world would have stopped me from picking up another drink. Alcohol is strong and powerful and it twisted and conned me into believing that it made perfect sense to drink not to stop drinking.
"Our behavior is as absurd and incomprehensible with respect to the first drink as that of an individual with a passion, say, for jay-walking. He gets a thrill out of skipping in front of fast-moving vehicles. He enjoys himself for a few years in spite of friendly warnings. Up to this point you would label him as a foolish chap having queer ideas of fun. Luck then deserts him and he is slightly injured several times in succession. You would expect him, if he were normal, to cut it out. Presently he is hit again and this time has a fractured skull. Within a week after leaving the hospital a fast-moving trolley car breaks his arm. He tells you he has decided to stop jay-walking for good, but in a few weeks he breaks both legs.
On through the years this conduct continues, accompanied by his continual promises to be careful or to keep off the streets altogether. Finally, he can no longer work, his wife gets a divorce and he is held up to ridicule. He tries every known means to get the jaywalking idea out of his head. He shuts himself up in an asylum, hoping to mend his ways. But the day he comes out he races in front of a fire engine, which breaks his back. Such a man would be crazy, wouldn't he?
You may think our illustration is too ridiculous. But is it? We, who have been through the wringer, have to admit if we substituted alcoholism for jay-walking, the illustration would fit exactly. However intelligent we may have been in other respects, where alcohol has been involved, we have been strangely insane. It's strong language but isn't it true?
Some of you are thinking: "Yes, what you tell is true, but it doesn't fully apply. We admit we have some of these symptoms, but we have not gone to the extremes you fellows did, nor are we likely to, for we understand ourselves so well after what you have told us that such things cannot happen again. We have not lost everything in life through drinking and we certainly do not intend to. Thanks for the information."
That may be true of certain nonalcoholic people who, though drinking foolishly and heavily at the present time, are able to stop or moderate, because their brains and bodies have not been damaged as ours were. But the actual or potential alcoholic, with hardly any exception, will be absolutely unable to stop drinking on the basis of self-knowledge. This is a point we wish to emphasize and re-emphasize, to smash home upon our alcoholic"
It is the Insanity as the above quote describes that I had to come to grips with. With me no common sense in the world would have stopped me from picking up another drink. Alcohol is strong and powerful and it twisted and conned me into believing that it made perfect sense to drink not to stop drinking.
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Join Date: Aug 2002
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Posts: 233
Thanks Tina, I'm curious how you finaly did stop. I know its a tough question to answer because there is no one right answer. Self-knowledge didn't do it so how did you decide on the insanity of it all?
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Re: Tough Love or Common Sense ????
Originally posted by Ninerfan
In-action is translated as ppl saying 'Oh, thats OK....We all slip...you can start again...were here for you' etc. Fine sentiments and certainly friendly but not accurate because all of us don't slip, I havn't...YET. And how do you know that you can start again. My next drunk, God forbid, may be the end of me.
snip
Quit drinking. That never happened and NO ONE called him on it, so I did. The people on that thread were more concerned about being his friend and themselves then giving him the straight truth.
snip
I will work on how I deliver my message as I hope you will.
In-action is translated as ppl saying 'Oh, thats OK....We all slip...you can start again...were here for you' etc. Fine sentiments and certainly friendly but not accurate because all of us don't slip, I havn't...YET. And how do you know that you can start again. My next drunk, God forbid, may be the end of me.
snip
Quit drinking. That never happened and NO ONE called him on it, so I did. The people on that thread were more concerned about being his friend and themselves then giving him the straight truth.
snip
I will work on how I deliver my message as I hope you will.
I agree 100%.
I have been wrestling the fist part I've quoted for a long time now. I too have NOT slipped.... I got your back on that one!
Long before you came into the picture I DID call "someone" on their continued drinking. I said "quit or continue.. your choice, I'll be here when ready".. I knew this person was not ready, wasn't and perhaps never will but I can still be their friend.. and nothing I can say or do will keep that person from drinking, if they don't want to surrender, I no longer judge, but I can still be a friend...and that's my part in this relationship.
I to will do better on HOW.. in my delivery.
I do have a great deal of respect and admiration for you..... believe it or not!
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Join Date: Aug 2003
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Niner, reading the posts on these boards is what made me seek help to stop. I knew I had a problem for many years but I was afraid of letting go of my "friend" or "my crutch" I really didn't know how to function without it. It had lied, conned, beat me up and used me for 19 years but I still ran to it everyday to hide from my emotions.
I now read these boards as often as I can, I attend AA meetings everyday, I read everything I can get my hands on and I pray.
And I never really look at it as "stopped" I look at it as I am not drinking today. I have good days and bad days just like I am sure everyone does...we are not always happy, joyous and free. But when I have a bad day, I remember the insane thinking I used to have and then ask myself if I can not drink just for today, just for 24 hours and the thoughts to drink pass.
just a side note.... I am going to CA on Saturday for 9 days...woohooo I can't wait...I am tired of this cold Ohio weather and am ready for a break
I now read these boards as often as I can, I attend AA meetings everyday, I read everything I can get my hands on and I pray.
And I never really look at it as "stopped" I look at it as I am not drinking today. I have good days and bad days just like I am sure everyone does...we are not always happy, joyous and free. But when I have a bad day, I remember the insane thinking I used to have and then ask myself if I can not drink just for today, just for 24 hours and the thoughts to drink pass.
just a side note.... I am going to CA on Saturday for 9 days...woohooo I can't wait...I am tired of this cold Ohio weather and am ready for a break
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I dont know about that Tina, Cal might not be the place for anyone right now. Its cold and wet uphere in norcal right now.
So something you read here turned the trick, thats great. I hope you never forget. The insanity of this thing. I recall reading the second step for the first time and being highly offended cause it just presumed I was insane. It didn't even suggest it. It just said. Came to believe..........could restore us to sanity. Actually the god part got my attention first, didn't like that then came the insanity part. But how I drank qualified for the term insane. And what happened when I got really going was sometimes bizarre. But give up my drinking? 'How can a silly liquid be the culprit?' Well, my body is ALLERGIC to it. 'What the hell are you people talking about? I'm not an alcoholic, you might be, but I'm just misundertood or something like that.' These were some of the conversations exploding in my head when I was new. So back to the point, how does common sense get thrugh to an insane person? For that matter how does 'tough love' get through to an insane person.
I'm not even sure the person has to be 'rready' to hear the message. I think you have to be out of hope and willing to try something differnt. Remember how scared you were at your first meeting? Not sure if you were or weren't an alcholic, but finally sure that something was definately wrong AND you needed help. I'm going on about AA here. I'll stop for now
So something you read here turned the trick, thats great. I hope you never forget. The insanity of this thing. I recall reading the second step for the first time and being highly offended cause it just presumed I was insane. It didn't even suggest it. It just said. Came to believe..........could restore us to sanity. Actually the god part got my attention first, didn't like that then came the insanity part. But how I drank qualified for the term insane. And what happened when I got really going was sometimes bizarre. But give up my drinking? 'How can a silly liquid be the culprit?' Well, my body is ALLERGIC to it. 'What the hell are you people talking about? I'm not an alcoholic, you might be, but I'm just misundertood or something like that.' These were some of the conversations exploding in my head when I was new. So back to the point, how does common sense get thrugh to an insane person? For that matter how does 'tough love' get through to an insane person.
I'm not even sure the person has to be 'rready' to hear the message. I think you have to be out of hope and willing to try something differnt. Remember how scared you were at your first meeting? Not sure if you were or weren't an alcholic, but finally sure that something was definately wrong AND you needed help. I'm going on about AA here. I'll stop for now
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Join Date: Aug 2003
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Well Niner, I was scared at my first AA meeting, but I knew I was an alcohlic, I just didn't see how insane my thinking had become. Talk about a wake up call...LOL
Where in N CA. I going to be in Suisun City. Its got to be warmer there...its like 20 here today which is heat wave cause it was 9 yesterday...lol
Where in N CA. I going to be in Suisun City. Its got to be warmer there...its like 20 here today which is heat wave cause it was 9 yesterday...lol
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Wow, well you wont need a coat then. Maybe an umbrella. I used to live in Fairfield, still have relatives there. Pretty sure the weather is nasty there right now. But it is not your kindof cold.
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Join Date: May 2003
Location: Northern CA
Posts: 1,432
Originally posted by nohiogal
Well Niner, I was scared at my first AA meeting, but I knew I was an alcohlic, I just didn't see how insane my thinking had become. Talk about a wake up call...LOL
Where in N CA. I going to be in Suisun City. Its got to be warmer there...its like 20 here today which is heat wave cause it was 9 yesterday...lol
Well Niner, I was scared at my first AA meeting, but I knew I was an alcohlic, I just didn't see how insane my thinking had become. Talk about a wake up call...LOL
Where in N CA. I going to be in Suisun City. Its got to be warmer there...its like 20 here today which is heat wave cause it was 9 yesterday...lol
I live about 20 miles east from Suisun City. Yep, it's been rainy but nothing like Ohio! Days in the 50's, nights in the 40's, sunny between the storms and 'breezy' for the weekend. Bring a sweater and a raincoat and you'll be fine!
Your Northern California weather report....
Don S
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Join Date: May 2003
Location: El Paso, Tx
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Originally posted by Ninerfan
Remember how scared you were at your first meeting? Not sure if you were or weren't an alcholic, but finally sure that something was definately wrong AND you needed help. I'm going on about AA here. I'll stop for now
Remember how scared you were at your first meeting? Not sure if you were or weren't an alcholic, but finally sure that something was definately wrong AND you needed help. I'm going on about AA here. I'll stop for now
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Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Stoddard, NH
Posts: 10
WOW
This is a great thread. I don't know where to begin. I know I will miss something but I have learned that is ok.
I went to rehab then to AA and I have my life because I work my program.
I was terrified at my first meeting, I thought they might ask me to leave. They didn't, that was 4812 days ago.
I was insane being I still picked up the first drink thinking I could stop.
And the one thing I have learned is yes I haven't had a slip...YET. I have to remember I have a lot of YETS, if I don't drink I won't need to worry.
Then I know I can not make anyone else sober or happy...that you must do yourself. I can not judge, I will be your friend and try to support you but you have to do the work.
For me the key is I do not drink today...just for these 24 hours.
Keep It Simple.
Thanks for my 4812 days of sobriety.
This is a great thread. I don't know where to begin. I know I will miss something but I have learned that is ok.
I went to rehab then to AA and I have my life because I work my program.
I was terrified at my first meeting, I thought they might ask me to leave. They didn't, that was 4812 days ago.
I was insane being I still picked up the first drink thinking I could stop.
And the one thing I have learned is yes I haven't had a slip...YET. I have to remember I have a lot of YETS, if I don't drink I won't need to worry.
Then I know I can not make anyone else sober or happy...that you must do yourself. I can not judge, I will be your friend and try to support you but you have to do the work.
For me the key is I do not drink today...just for these 24 hours.
Keep It Simple.
Thanks for my 4812 days of sobriety.
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Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Riverside, Ca.
Posts: 388
Niner
I was sent to my first meeting at age 18 by the court system, at the time I didn't think much of it, I definately was not ready.
but at 38 I went on my own, I had just got out of a detox center and went straight to the meeting, I was scared, and confused, somehow a part of me instinctivly told me to stick with the winners, I started hanging with the guys that had been sober for many years, and were happy. after a week or two I got a sponsor,
he was a kind, and very intelegent man, like I said he was a kind man, and he cared enough for me that if I was screwing up he would let me know. he has since moved away, but i am still gratefull for his years of wisdom in the program, and that he was smart enough to tell me the truth no matter what I thought about it.
Jay Walker
I was sent to my first meeting at age 18 by the court system, at the time I didn't think much of it, I definately was not ready.
but at 38 I went on my own, I had just got out of a detox center and went straight to the meeting, I was scared, and confused, somehow a part of me instinctivly told me to stick with the winners, I started hanging with the guys that had been sober for many years, and were happy. after a week or two I got a sponsor,
he was a kind, and very intelegent man, like I said he was a kind man, and he cared enough for me that if I was screwing up he would let me know. he has since moved away, but i am still gratefull for his years of wisdom in the program, and that he was smart enough to tell me the truth no matter what I thought about it.
Jay Walker
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Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: The Basement
Posts: 724
I remember my first meeting. for me, it was like coming home for the first time. I was so happy because there were other people like me. I had no idea AA existed until I went to rehab and they brought a CA meeting into the rehab. There was a name for what I was doing and even better than that....there was a solution.
I never saw a light at the end of the tunnel until that first meeting. My using and drinking had progressed and progressed to the point where I lost everything and was barley functioning. I only went to rehab because I started hallucinating.....seriously.
I gladly skipped into AA, attending meetings everyday, doing service work...AA poster child. After 5 yr's I drank. That relapse is a story in itself but I did experience a few not yets. Luckily I was one of the ones that made it back. That experience was when the second step happened to me. I say happened because I kind of skipped over it the first time. I didn't believe in too much but I went on to work the rest of the steps anyway.
I came to believe after my options were played out. I was miserable sober and I was miserable drinking. I had hit an emotional and spiritual bottom that brought me to my knees. After that day I have slowly climbed out of that dark, drunk hole.
If I had to put it to one or two things that I learned from that experience, it would be the importance of humility and remaining teachable.
I never saw a light at the end of the tunnel until that first meeting. My using and drinking had progressed and progressed to the point where I lost everything and was barley functioning. I only went to rehab because I started hallucinating.....seriously.
I gladly skipped into AA, attending meetings everyday, doing service work...AA poster child. After 5 yr's I drank. That relapse is a story in itself but I did experience a few not yets. Luckily I was one of the ones that made it back. That experience was when the second step happened to me. I say happened because I kind of skipped over it the first time. I didn't believe in too much but I went on to work the rest of the steps anyway.
I came to believe after my options were played out. I was miserable sober and I was miserable drinking. I had hit an emotional and spiritual bottom that brought me to my knees. After that day I have slowly climbed out of that dark, drunk hole.
If I had to put it to one or two things that I learned from that experience, it would be the importance of humility and remaining teachable.
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Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Melbourne victoria
Posts: 1,975
I must say that AA saved my life ! I had heard of it , but never found out anything about it , til , at my wits end, i rang them. I must say , I have never looked back!
I am only up to working step 3 , and it is wonderful! I had a real " light bulb" moment regarding steps 1 and 2 , about 3 weeks after I got sober, I was in a meeting, and suddenly " got" the point of the " first drink" concept , and it was a big relief ! Like a weight had been lifted. my cravings have disappeared , but I still sometimes think of having a drink, but it is fleeting, I just think what 1 drink will lead to.
While I am fairly new to AA, ( 79 days today) I am now on the journey, as opposed to just " not drinking " and I love it .
I have a wonderful woman for my Sponser, and an " oldtimer" ( 32 years sober) who has taken me under his wing, and is very wise, and encouraging!
So I am a very grateful member ! lol
HUGX
Lee
I am only up to working step 3 , and it is wonderful! I had a real " light bulb" moment regarding steps 1 and 2 , about 3 weeks after I got sober, I was in a meeting, and suddenly " got" the point of the " first drink" concept , and it was a big relief ! Like a weight had been lifted. my cravings have disappeared , but I still sometimes think of having a drink, but it is fleeting, I just think what 1 drink will lead to.
While I am fairly new to AA, ( 79 days today) I am now on the journey, as opposed to just " not drinking " and I love it .
I have a wonderful woman for my Sponser, and an " oldtimer" ( 32 years sober) who has taken me under his wing, and is very wise, and encouraging!
So I am a very grateful member ! lol
HUGX
Lee
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Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: California
Posts: 233
Lee that sounds like an unbeatable combination you've got going for you. I like that part about being on a journey rather than just staying sober. That is how I felt. And we were in it together. All the people that came in the fellowship at about the same time I mean. Thats when I felt the closest I've ever felt to another human being. It is a different feeling today, still good but different. I'm used to being sober now, it is what I do and it seems natural now.
Jay's sponsor reminded me of my sponsor, I really have to call or just drive by his house. He really put himself out for me. He has always been there for me. There are so many things he told me that I still remember, the one that comes to mind just now is 'If you want a friend you have to be a friend.'
And nana thanks for joining in. You may not rremember everything you want to say but you sure can count. LOL
Jay's sponsor reminded me of my sponsor, I really have to call or just drive by his house. He really put himself out for me. He has always been there for me. There are so many things he told me that I still remember, the one that comes to mind just now is 'If you want a friend you have to be a friend.'
And nana thanks for joining in. You may not rremember everything you want to say but you sure can count. LOL
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Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 93
Whoops I tripped over, who left that there? Minds me of the guy who thought if it was broke, you hit it, still broke? Hit it harder. Still broke? *()&*(^)(&*^
Hello? this is a forum for Alcoholism. AA is -----> that way. With great respect for your systems of belief and way of life, I want you to openly acknowledge that AA isn't the be all and end all of sobriety. Just like I openly do about what helps me keep sober. If you can't do that, then I believe you shouldn't be posting here. In effect you're pushing unwanted beliefs onto ppl who really don't want them. I don't want to debate about it, why don't you post in the AA forum?
Now please, I want to nip this all in the bud right here and now. I have friends who really don't want to see this. As much as I don't want to cause a scene, I want this sorted out here and now.
I'm personally willing to apologise to anyone who feels their nose is out of joint, and just want to get back to sharing and discussing alcoholism without all this stupid melodrama. The question is: are you big enough of a man to do it Niner?
I believe in the AA program, way of life, and that is what I know.
Now please, I want to nip this all in the bud right here and now. I have friends who really don't want to see this. As much as I don't want to cause a scene, I want this sorted out here and now.
I'm personally willing to apologise to anyone who feels their nose is out of joint, and just want to get back to sharing and discussing alcoholism without all this stupid melodrama. The question is: are you big enough of a man to do it Niner?
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Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: The Basement
Posts: 724
It's a free country and he's just talking about what works for him. I see no pushing, just sharing. On the other hand you, my dear, seem to be excluding people for not seeing things from your perspective or, for that matter, a different perspective.
What I want to know is....why does it get to you so much, especially when you're so happy. When I'm happy I could care less what anyone else does because my happiness comes from in me.
What I want to know is....why does it get to you so much, especially when you're so happy. When I'm happy I could care less what anyone else does because my happiness comes from in me.
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