Terminally Unique

It will never be in favor of quitting, alcoquit, because the addictive voice is the expression of your addiction, in your mind's eye and ear. Its sole purpose is to maintain and perpetuate the addiction.

You are not alone in this, alcoquit. The addictive voice (AV) uses your own thought patterns against you, and will argue both sides of all arguments. It cannot be reasoned with or otherwise be disputed away, because regardless of what you say, it will always land on its feet, so to speak.

I'm a fairly logic-driven person by temperament, and on more than one occasion, usually when I had a vacation or extended time off by myself coming up, my AV has chimed in and said "You know AVRT so well by now, TU, you can just drink and chain smoke during your vacation, and then quit again when it is over. You won't have to waste time re-learning AVRT. It will be easy."

Yes, on the surface, that sounds somewhat reasonable, but if I were to do that, I would awaken the Beast (addictive desire) full force, and there is no guarantee that I would decide to quit when the vacation ended. I went back to smoking once after 2½ years of not smoking, thinking I would have 'just one' cigarette, or enough to get me through a particular crisis, and it took me three more years to get around to quitting again.

Anyway, you say AA is not for you. AVRT is another option. It is a learned skill, and it has a unique style of ending the inner debate, and of neutralizing the addictive voice, ironically, by no longer fighting it. This is not the best place to discuss how it works, but if you are interested in learning more about it, there is an active discussion thread on AVRT in the secular connections forum.

Terminally Unique

It is not just a literal voice, Threshold, and is not always experienced as a voice. The addictive voice of AVRT is "any thinking, imagery, or feeling that supports, or even suggests, the possible future use of alcohol or other drugs -- ever."

That picture in your mind's eye of a beer on the beach is the AV. That thought that you can go back to drinking moderately or have 'just one' is the AV. That feeling that since you have not felt the physical desire for 'X' amount of time, that you can now drink again with impunity, is the AV.

That said, all humans hear voices, and much of our thought process would not be possible without language. That is what makes us different from animals. Try thinking without using an English 'voice' in your head, Threshold, and see how far you get. I know for a fact that you are hearing my voice in your mind's ear, right now, or at least what you perceive to be my voice, as you read this very sentence.


The Beast of AVRT is just the desire for the drink/drug. It is universal among addicted people, for without that desire, there would be no addiction.

"My disease" of 12-Step lore is the Beast of AVRT.

Terminally Unique

SMART Recovery encourages this sort of thing, but with AVRT, we don't shoot down arguments or debate with desire, or the expression of that desire (the AV). Rule one of AVRT is don't dispute, don't debate, don't argue, don't respond.

Threshold

Thanks for clearing that up. I hear people refer to the "voice" so much and what it says that I assumed they meant a "voice".

I don't experience my addiction as a disease nor does "beast" fit my experience, though it does help me better understand discussions here when I understand what people mean when they use those terms.

my urge to use is pretty much on the same order as having to pee. It doesn't talk to me, it just feels like the thing I should do to address some feeling/discomfort. So I have to learn new, purposeful ways of addressing that feeling/discomfort/urge.

I am most likely to use when I run out of energy or ideas about what would better address the situation.

I haven't studied AVRT, so maybe that fits into the "beast", it's just not a word I would have chosen to describe the feeling.

Terminally Unique

When you get an urge to pee, does your brain not show you a picture of a toilet or bathroom in your mind's eye? Do you not think "I have to pee, I need to find a bathroom?"

If we were to draw an analogue, the urge to pee would be the Beast, and the picture of the bathroom in your mind, or the thought that you need to find one, would be the AV.

Mark75

I picked this out from that link you gave TU:

Playing the tape out, I guess.

Playing the tape out... A tool we hear a lot about. I use it occasionally, but it's far from a favorite of mine... Too complicated. Early on I really didn't know what I waned, and as I sure as hell wasn't too interested in this never drinking again thing... Then the beast is engaged... So yea, I see that, the opposite of AVRT, yea.

In AA, playing the tape out can bring all sorts expectations, resentments, self centered ideas... Much better to invoke step 3.

Terminally Unique

Thinking through the drink is the oldest trick in the book, and has probably been tried by every single problem drinker since time immemorial. As far as AVRT is concerned, there is no thinking through the drink, because if you aren't going to drink again, then what is there to think through?

By the time you get to thinking through the drink, you're obviously planning to drink, because otherwise, you wouldn't need to think through the drink that you won't be having. Thinking through the drink necessarily suggests the possibility of drinking, and hence, by definition, is AV.

This is not to say that thinking through the drink or playing the tape all the way to the end won't work for some people, it is just not AVRT. In my case, I had a nasty habit of "forgetting" what would happen, or why I had stopped in the first place, so even if I did think it through, well, you know...

Xellios

I had a very similar experience recently, but I gave in. It was one of the worst mistakes of my life but that being said, I believe that it was also my bottom. After a week long binge I became almost deathly ill from withdrawal. My step mother told me that I could have easily wound up in the ICU. For me the cravings really start around the 30 day milestones. I was 61 days sober when I last relapsed. Its an endless cycle. Do whatever you can to get your mind off the craving, because we all know what happens when we give in and go down that road.

CarolD

Welcome to our recovery community Xellios ....

Glad to know you are off on a new start...all my best....

CarolD

Hmm...
more posts removed....more complaints over the arguementive tone of this
thread....and I guess some members did not read Dee's post.

Perhaps he was too subtle? I'm not.

This thread is over and done with...take the fusses to another site

new members and suffering members are being ignored in favor
of ego puffing Some posts are full of mis information under the
flag of "just what I heard".
.
That is not recovery of any sort.