Addictive voice is clever and strong
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: "I'm not lost for I know where I am. But however, where I am may be lost ..."
Posts: 5,273
Originally Posted by MemphisBlues
I am really weary of this "My-program-is bigger-than-your-program" stuff.
It's all about perception I guess. That's what I like about SR.
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Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Singapore
Posts: 737
Originally Posted by kanamit 
The Beast just loves AA. In fact, all Beasts love all recovery groups of all kinds.
The only way to put your addiction in its place is to make a plan to never use alcohol or other drugs again. When you go to meetings you congregate with others who have failed to permanently leave their addictive substances behind. The treatment industry, including AA, teaches that relapses are an expected part of recovery. So to your Beast, the idea of meeting up with people who tell you you probably will drink or use again is quite a mouth-watering notion.
For more information Google "Where's the nearest meeting?". (With or without quotes should be fine)
The only way to put your addiction in its place is to make a plan to never use alcohol or other drugs again. When you go to meetings you congregate with others who have failed to permanently leave their addictive substances behind. The treatment industry, including AA, teaches that relapses are an expected part of recovery. So to your Beast, the idea of meeting up with people who tell you you probably will drink or use again is quite a mouth-watering notion.
For more information Google "Where's the nearest meeting?". (With or without quotes should be fine)
Kanamit, if I were to put it nicely, I'd say it's been quite a while since I've seen such an outright misunderstanding of the program of AA and ignorance of it's potential usefulness. However, when I see something that's helped me immensely getting slammed to the ground and sniped at every turn it's awfully hard to keep putting it nicely.
So, plainly, sod off with this anti AA rhetoric please. Seriously, get over yourself and this "my technique/program/sobriety is better than yours" superiority complex crapola. No institution, guru, or book has a monopoly on what works for some and what doesn't work for others, yet these continual negative slants and manufactured assumptions on the program of AA (and treatment in general) suggests exactly that. Your post has the potential of being terribly destructive to someone still suffering, not to mention it is flat out insulting to people who utilize the BB and AA and successfully, PERMANENTLY, stay sober.
All of this would be fine if you could keep such bitterness to yourself and simply comment on what worked for you, full stop. Instead you derail this thread with opinionated nonsense. You seem completely oblivious to the fact that everyone has the right to find their own damned way. This forum is littered with divergent personalities, folks in actual crisis that might ONLY benefit from AA, regardless of how you feel about it. In fact, there are some people in the world who might completely escape your brand of logic and indignation. Go figure. Likewise, there are some who would better utilize AVRT and find AA entirely useless. And of course there are those who need nothing but SR and a few self help books.
Thing is, these are all the people who read these forums looking for sound and helpful advice on something that's currently terrorizing their every waking moment, not to hear disingenuous rants that might end up chasing them away from the very thing they need. You handing out such ridiculous misplaced criticism - as such - is nothing more than a conscious attempt to sway suffering folks away from a choice that could potentially be the only thing to save their lives. That is more than disingenuous, it's bloody irresponsible.
If you truly need a soapbox to lay out this kind of counter productive banter, spare us inferior AA folks, just google "anti AA forums", join, and have the hell at it why dunchya. (with or without quotes should be fine)
BTW OP, sorry to derail the thread further, but the reply I quoted above was completely out of line.
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Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Rocky Mountains
Posts: 15
The fact that you reconize it as "the voice" is a big step. Does the voice have anything other to say than drink? Has the voice helped you in any other way? Maybe the voice isn't interested in your best interests.
As others above had said, AVRT can give you great tools for working with your voice and reconizing what it's only goal is. To get you drunk. It's up to YOU to listen to it or not.
As others above had said, AVRT can give you great tools for working with your voice and reconizing what it's only goal is. To get you drunk. It's up to YOU to listen to it or not.
Grateful to be free
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Arizona
Posts: 3,680
When I first started investigating recovery I recognized I had this crazy person living in my "attic" who basically lived in terror of life in general and spent it's time yelling and shreiking all the time.
It yelled so loud that it was often real hard for me to hear the reasonable calm voice inside of me. And like anyone might do who had a crazy person living upstairs, I used to try to shut it up by giving it what it claimed would help it feel better. Of course it never worked.
But here's what I noticed about my "voice in the attic" it wasn't clever at all. It's loud and annoying, but it's also stupid as crap. Like any crazy person in a moment of hysteria, it needed to be slapped in the face with reality.
Then I had to learn to tune it out, like I would an obnoxious neighbor. Listen to my own music, ignore the fighting of the neighbors upstairs, play some white noise so I could go to bed on time.
I had to learn to live my life without letting "stupid" control by choices. I mean, MY life was getting hijacked to nutso in my attic.
So, when people encouraged me in early sobriety to "get out of my head"..I knew that was right on. Sometimes it's best to not sit home in the evening and listen to nutso upstairs, or my real life room mate situation for that matter. It's better for me to get out and get on with it.
I stopped enabling the maniac in my attic (sounds a LOT like addict no?)
But MY voice was never clever at all, stupid. I never really listened to what it was saying and how stupid it was, because I was too busy trying to shut it up at all costs. Once I listened I was like "yeah, I don't think so" it was hard to take that crap seriously.
It yelled so loud that it was often real hard for me to hear the reasonable calm voice inside of me. And like anyone might do who had a crazy person living upstairs, I used to try to shut it up by giving it what it claimed would help it feel better. Of course it never worked.
But here's what I noticed about my "voice in the attic" it wasn't clever at all. It's loud and annoying, but it's also stupid as crap. Like any crazy person in a moment of hysteria, it needed to be slapped in the face with reality.
Then I had to learn to tune it out, like I would an obnoxious neighbor. Listen to my own music, ignore the fighting of the neighbors upstairs, play some white noise so I could go to bed on time.
I had to learn to live my life without letting "stupid" control by choices. I mean, MY life was getting hijacked to nutso in my attic.
So, when people encouraged me in early sobriety to "get out of my head"..I knew that was right on. Sometimes it's best to not sit home in the evening and listen to nutso upstairs, or my real life room mate situation for that matter. It's better for me to get out and get on with it.
I stopped enabling the maniac in my attic (sounds a LOT like addict no?)
But MY voice was never clever at all, stupid. I never really listened to what it was saying and how stupid it was, because I was too busy trying to shut it up at all costs. Once I listened I was like "yeah, I don't think so" it was hard to take that crap seriously.
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Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Richmond,Va.
Posts: 183
The mind will not leave it alone,the obsession is a thought that overcomes all other thoughts.You must find power to deal with this obsession,I found mine in AA,it took a lot of trying agains,but you must keep trying and not give up.
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 364
Originally Posted by Peter G
Wow it's thick around here lately.
Kanamit, if I were to put it nicely, I'd say it's been quite a while since I've seen such an outright misunderstanding of the program of AA and ignorance of it's potential usefulness. However, when I see something that's helped me immensely getting slammed to the ground and sniped at every turn it's awfully hard to keep putting it nicely.
I know what you mean. I get the same “hate mail” regarding AVRT. I also have first-hand experience with the 12 steps.
So, plainly, sod off with this anti AA rhetoric please. Seriously, get over yourself and this "my technique/program/sobriety is better than yours" superiority complex crapola. No institution, guru, or book has a monopoly on what works for some and what doesn't work for others, yet these continual negative slants and manufactured assumptions on the program of AA (and treatment in general) suggests exactly that. Your post has the potential of being terribly destructive to someone still suffering, not to mention it is flat out insulting to people who utilize the BB and AA and successfully, PERMANENTLY, stay sober.
I agree people can, and should, exercise the same free will that got them addicted to get themselves out of this mess.
All of this would be fine if you could keep such bitterness to yourself and simply comment on what worked for you, full stop. Instead you derail this thread with opinionated nonsense. You seem completely oblivious to the fact that everyone has the right to find their own damned way. This forum is littered with divergent personalities, folks in actual crisis that might ONLY benefit from AA, regardless of how you feel about it. In fact, there are some people in the world who might completely escape your brand of logic and indignation. Go figure. Likewise, there are some who would better utilize AVRT and find AA entirely useless. And of course there are those who need nothing but SR and a few self help books.
How did I derail the thread? The OP was asking about the Addictive Voice (AV) and I am securely abstinent with AVRT (Addictive Voice Recognition Technique).
Thing is, these are all the people who read these forums looking for sound and helpful advice on something that's currently terrorizing their every waking moment, not to hear disingenuous rants that might end up chasing them away from the very thing they need. You handing out such ridiculous misplaced criticism - as such - is nothing more than a conscious attempt to sway suffering folks away from a choice that could potentially be the only thing to save their lives. That is more than disingenuous, it's bloody irresponsible.
I feel the same way about telling people they are powerless over alcohol and need to rely on a higher power. Please remember, this is the generic alcoholism forum. If you want a religious bias there is the 12 step forum.
If you truly need a soapbox to lay out this kind of counter productive banter, spare us inferior AA folks, just google "anti AA forums", join, and have the hell at it why dunchya. (with or without quotes should be fine)
Again, I'm confused why you think we cannot discuss various programmes and techniques in this forum.
BTW OP, sorry to derail the thread further, but the reply I quoted above was completely out of line.
I disagree but that's what discussion is about.
Kanamit, if I were to put it nicely, I'd say it's been quite a while since I've seen such an outright misunderstanding of the program of AA and ignorance of it's potential usefulness. However, when I see something that's helped me immensely getting slammed to the ground and sniped at every turn it's awfully hard to keep putting it nicely.
I know what you mean. I get the same “hate mail” regarding AVRT. I also have first-hand experience with the 12 steps.
So, plainly, sod off with this anti AA rhetoric please. Seriously, get over yourself and this "my technique/program/sobriety is better than yours" superiority complex crapola. No institution, guru, or book has a monopoly on what works for some and what doesn't work for others, yet these continual negative slants and manufactured assumptions on the program of AA (and treatment in general) suggests exactly that. Your post has the potential of being terribly destructive to someone still suffering, not to mention it is flat out insulting to people who utilize the BB and AA and successfully, PERMANENTLY, stay sober.
I agree people can, and should, exercise the same free will that got them addicted to get themselves out of this mess.
All of this would be fine if you could keep such bitterness to yourself and simply comment on what worked for you, full stop. Instead you derail this thread with opinionated nonsense. You seem completely oblivious to the fact that everyone has the right to find their own damned way. This forum is littered with divergent personalities, folks in actual crisis that might ONLY benefit from AA, regardless of how you feel about it. In fact, there are some people in the world who might completely escape your brand of logic and indignation. Go figure. Likewise, there are some who would better utilize AVRT and find AA entirely useless. And of course there are those who need nothing but SR and a few self help books.
How did I derail the thread? The OP was asking about the Addictive Voice (AV) and I am securely abstinent with AVRT (Addictive Voice Recognition Technique).
Thing is, these are all the people who read these forums looking for sound and helpful advice on something that's currently terrorizing their every waking moment, not to hear disingenuous rants that might end up chasing them away from the very thing they need. You handing out such ridiculous misplaced criticism - as such - is nothing more than a conscious attempt to sway suffering folks away from a choice that could potentially be the only thing to save their lives. That is more than disingenuous, it's bloody irresponsible.
I feel the same way about telling people they are powerless over alcohol and need to rely on a higher power. Please remember, this is the generic alcoholism forum. If you want a religious bias there is the 12 step forum.
If you truly need a soapbox to lay out this kind of counter productive banter, spare us inferior AA folks, just google "anti AA forums", join, and have the hell at it why dunchya. (with or without quotes should be fine)
Again, I'm confused why you think we cannot discuss various programmes and techniques in this forum.
BTW OP, sorry to derail the thread further, but the reply I quoted above was completely out of line.
I disagree but that's what discussion is about.
I also strongly object to the usual AA tact of “All the above refers to real alcoholics”. Your group always says that only the individual can decide whether he or she has a problem. That part I agree with. However, as soon as someone recovers by themselves, as I did, then apparently you categorically can state they were just a heavy drinker. Anyway, if you wish to dicuss that further, start a new thread. My original post was relevant but this is getting off-topic now.
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Join Date: May 2011
Location: Albany NY
Posts: 1,212
On a clear night, you can hear a Ford rusting....
....or some say, "On a clear night, you can hear a Chevy rusting". Another one of those endless debates with no clear answer, really. It all really comes down to what one's experience has been with either model.
When I was in the throes of addiction, I couldn't have cared less if it was a Ford or a Chevy and whether it had floorboards or not, I would have sold my soul to have transportation. I had nothing.
Another one of those endless debates with no clear answer is AA vs. AVRT; and once again, it really comes down to what one's experience has been with either recovery model.
To the OP, if you are opting for self-recovery, there are AVRT threads and a Rational Recovery book you can purchase to help you deal with the addictive voice, if that model of addiction is one you accept.. AVRT will get you to the point of abstinence; if you have any other issues, you are on your own with those.
I am AA recovered, and after growing up in an alcoholic home and experiencing my own bout of alcoholism, I found I had an "attitude" disease in addition to the compulsion to drink. I found AA to be a perfect fit for me. AA has the Big Book you can read as well, and meetings you can attend for support. I spent years not going to AA because of my preconceived notions about it. I was pleasantly surprised that it wasn't what I expected it to be.
Contrary to opinion stated above, I consider myself fully recovered. I haven't had a drink in almost 18 years, and have no compulsion to drink. That is what the AA program did for me.
Usually when one continues to go to meetings or post on forums in spite of the fact that they are recovered, it is usually an extension of doing service work. I love paying forward what was so freely given to me. Doesn't mean I'm not recovered.
I really have no idea where that "relapse is a part of recovery" statement comes from. When I think of AA, I think of it as the model that says "there is no such thing as a hopeless drunk". How is that be a bad thing?
When I was in the throes of addiction, I couldn't have cared less if it was a Ford or a Chevy and whether it had floorboards or not, I would have sold my soul to have transportation. I had nothing.
Another one of those endless debates with no clear answer is AA vs. AVRT; and once again, it really comes down to what one's experience has been with either recovery model.
To the OP, if you are opting for self-recovery, there are AVRT threads and a Rational Recovery book you can purchase to help you deal with the addictive voice, if that model of addiction is one you accept.. AVRT will get you to the point of abstinence; if you have any other issues, you are on your own with those.
I am AA recovered, and after growing up in an alcoholic home and experiencing my own bout of alcoholism, I found I had an "attitude" disease in addition to the compulsion to drink. I found AA to be a perfect fit for me. AA has the Big Book you can read as well, and meetings you can attend for support. I spent years not going to AA because of my preconceived notions about it. I was pleasantly surprised that it wasn't what I expected it to be.
Contrary to opinion stated above, I consider myself fully recovered. I haven't had a drink in almost 18 years, and have no compulsion to drink. That is what the AA program did for me.
Usually when one continues to go to meetings or post on forums in spite of the fact that they are recovered, it is usually an extension of doing service work. I love paying forward what was so freely given to me. Doesn't mean I'm not recovered.
I really have no idea where that "relapse is a part of recovery" statement comes from. When I think of AA, I think of it as the model that says "there is no such thing as a hopeless drunk". How is that be a bad thing?
Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Indianapolis, IN
Posts: 889
I find it so crazy how similar we all are. I completely relate to this post. The negotiating, the minimizing, the bargening, etc.. I do it all. AA would call it the mental obsession AVRT calls it the addictive voice, I think they're pretty much the same thing.
We alcoholics are (at times) consumed with this compulsion to drink. No matter how many times it burned us we always come to the conclusion that drinking is a good idea. I know, for a fact, that in the coming days / weeks I am going to be telling myself the exact same thing you wrote in your post.
The bottom line is we alcoholics sometimes, just have to "take the punch". It sucks, it's hard, it feels impossible, but we must "take the punch".
We quit for a reason. If we've ever made a decision to quit anything, it's pretty clear that we have an issue with the thing we are quitting.
Just hang in there. "This too shall pass"...
We alcoholics are (at times) consumed with this compulsion to drink. No matter how many times it burned us we always come to the conclusion that drinking is a good idea. I know, for a fact, that in the coming days / weeks I am going to be telling myself the exact same thing you wrote in your post.
The bottom line is we alcoholics sometimes, just have to "take the punch". It sucks, it's hard, it feels impossible, but we must "take the punch".
We quit for a reason. If we've ever made a decision to quit anything, it's pretty clear that we have an issue with the thing we are quitting.
Just hang in there. "This too shall pass"...
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 364
I know it doesn't say that in the BB but I have heard it from AA members before. Anyway, that's good that it doesn't.
I wasn't AA bashing. I was making the point that from AVRT's perspective all recovery groups are pointless and potentially harmful. The same goes for SMART, etc.
If I offended anyone, I apologise. It was intended as information on AVRT. Nothing more.
I wasn't AA bashing. I was making the point that from AVRT's perspective all recovery groups are pointless and potentially harmful. The same goes for SMART, etc.
If I offended anyone, I apologise. It was intended as information on AVRT. Nothing more.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 36
Originally Posted by MemphisBlues
What does the beast say about trying an Alcoholics Anonymous meeting?
. It's difficult to win over the logic. Right now I've been abstaining from alcohol and winning over the voice saying I have a disease and alcohol is not made for me (like some people are allergic to nuts so they avoid it, same thing). This way I'm able to beat the logical voice..but for how long. This early phase of being sober is costing me, I don't feel like working and my efficiency has largely dropped as my mind is entangled somewhere else.
Member
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 449
Originally Posted by kanamit
I know it doesn't say that in the BB but I have heard it from AA members before. Anyway, that's good that it doesn't.
I wasn't AA bashing. I was making the point that from AVRT's perspective all recovery groups are pointless and potentially harmful. The same goes for SMART, etc.
If I offended anyone, I apologise. It was intended as information on AVRT. Nothing more.
I wasn't AA bashing. I was making the point that from AVRT's perspective all recovery groups are pointless and potentially harmful. The same goes for SMART, etc.
If I offended anyone, I apologise. It was intended as information on AVRT. Nothing more.
The AA I was lucky enough to find - isn't what you described. And I needed some eyeball to eyeball kind of affirmation that I could stop and stay stopped. I got that. Get that and hope to God I provide that at few meetings I attend and the men with whom I go through the book.
I think it should suffice to share our experience with what works. Not with what doesn't work.
I tried intellectual masturbation to stop. It didn't work. Maybe because I'm not intellectual, but I know I certainly can't say that my intellectual masturbation = AVRT. And I'm quite familiar with the "beast". In fact, I rather like AVRT's use of the term. In my case it's quite appropriate.
Folks come here and read. They might not even post. They're looking for a solution. I envision someone like me. Drunk, knife or gun in hand, ready to take the final act but looking for a solution. A SOLUTION. Not an argument.
You've found one in AVRT. I can't describe your experience with it.
I've found one in AA. Please give me the same benefit of MY experience as I do you.
And most importantly. Let's celebrate the fact we're both safe and protected from our "beast" and sober for good and for all.
Let us, together, show the reader about to swallow some whiskey with a lead chaser that there a vast array of ways to stop the vicious cycle they're in and that they all will work if properly applied in their life. That there is a solution to be had - through a variety of ways. That if they're struggling with one program, they can choose another.
Let's be ambassadors of HOPE and not purveyors of presumption.
Deal ? You with me ?
Let's try and help some folks give up the drink for good and for all. Together.
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I don't know whether to be impressed you guys sorted this out, or what.
Please remember, regardless of what you believe, don't believe or anything else - we have rules on this site.
The predominant rule is respect for other members and their beliefs and opinions.
If you find that in any way difficult you may wish to find other forums to be a part of.
Lets not forget - at the pointy end of things, we share a common goal, guys - recovery.
D
Please remember, regardless of what you believe, don't believe or anything else - we have rules on this site.
The predominant rule is respect for other members and their beliefs and opinions.
If you find that in any way difficult you may wish to find other forums to be a part of.
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No posts that attack, insult, "flame", defame, or abuse members or non-members. Respect other members of the community and don’t belittle, make fun of, or insult another member or non-member. Decisions about health and recovery are highly personal, individual choices. "Flaming" and insults, however, will not be tolerated. Agree to disagree. This applies to both the forums and chat.
It is also our policy not to allow threads that are purely to announce that you are unhappy here and "leaving the site'" or to post threads discussing why someone left or was banned. Such posts often detract from our purpose of providing support in recovery. Posts of this nature may be removed and continued posting of this nature could jeopardize your membership. If you wish to “leave” SR or just take a break from the site you are welcome to notify your friends via the Private Message feature.
Ignore bothersome members. If there is someone on the forum that bothers you, select the Ignore option on the drop down menu under their name on the post. You won't see any posts from this member again.
No posts that attack, insult, "flame", defame, or abuse members or non-members. Respect other members of the community and don’t belittle, make fun of, or insult another member or non-member. Decisions about health and recovery are highly personal, individual choices. "Flaming" and insults, however, will not be tolerated. Agree to disagree. This applies to both the forums and chat.
It is also our policy not to allow threads that are purely to announce that you are unhappy here and "leaving the site'" or to post threads discussing why someone left or was banned. Such posts often detract from our purpose of providing support in recovery. Posts of this nature may be removed and continued posting of this nature could jeopardize your membership. If you wish to “leave” SR or just take a break from the site you are welcome to notify your friends via the Private Message feature.
Ignore bothersome members. If there is someone on the forum that bothers you, select the Ignore option on the drop down menu under their name on the post. You won't see any posts from this member again.
D
Last edited by Dee74; 05-05-2012 at 03:21 AM.
Forward we go...side by side-Rest In Peace
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Serene In Dixie
Posts: 36,740
alcoquit...
I sure hope you will continue your sober time...regardless of the
urges/cravings/voices/obcessions that are happening to you...
My early sober time was also difficult...I took about 2 months to get
back in mental and physical balance.
Plese find something that allows you to have a productive joy filled life.
I certainly have...
I sure hope you will continue your sober time...regardless of the
urges/cravings/voices/obcessions that are happening to you...
My early sober time was also difficult...I took about 2 months to get
back in mental and physical balance.
Plese find something that allows you to have a productive joy filled life.
I certainly have...
Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 106
Glad to hear you are abstaining. I understand the clever voice that tells you all that really convincing stuff. Like TU said, it does seem to use our intelligence against us and all of our emotions too. The thing I have found is to carefully pick apart its convincing lines, word by word if necessary.
It doesn't argue fairly so shoot it in the kneecaps.
What I would say to my AV if it used this tactic on me was: Eating is essential to living. I can't not eat or I will die, so I MUST to learn to do it in moderation.
Drinking alcohol is NOT essential to live, its a self serving perk. Just like peanuts are not, cheesecake is not or having a tempurpedic mattress is not required to sustain life.
Hope that bullet helped.
B
It doesn't argue fairly so shoot it in the kneecaps.
Originally Posted by alcoquit
Like I mentioned before, if I were a binge eater I won't stop eating I would learn to eat. The addictive voice says learn to drink!!!...ya it is pathetic 
. It's difficult to win over the logic.
. It's difficult to win over the logic.Drinking alcohol is NOT essential to live, its a self serving perk. Just like peanuts are not, cheesecake is not or having a tempurpedic mattress is not required to sustain life.
Hope that bullet helped.
B
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Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: « USA » Recovered with AVRT (Rational Recovery) ___________
Posts: 3,680
Originally Posted by reggiewayne
I find it so crazy how similar we all are. I completely relate to this post. The negotiating, the minimizing, the bargening, etc.. I do it all. AA would call it the mental obsession AVRT calls it the addictive voice, I think they're pretty much the same thing.
Grateful to be free
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Arizona
Posts: 3,680
Originally Posted by Terminally Unique
That's correct, Reggie. The experience is universal, and the mental obsession of 12-Step lore is indeed the Addictive Voice. I have to laugh sometimes when people say that they don't hear voices and that there is no AV.
One more reason why there are so many approaches to recovery. AVRT is meaningless to people's who's alcoholism doesn't manifest as a "beast".
Like I shared, I have a voice, but it's not clever, it's just loud and annoying.
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Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: San Diego
Posts: 4,451
It's not a literal voice, at least not for me, Threshold. It's a desire—sometimes an image, sometimes an articulated thought, sometimes just a feeling. That's the voice. I think the desire to drink, even when we know we shouldn't, is pretty universal among active alcoholics.
PS: I too find the "get out of your head" advice you mentioned earlier very helpful. Not just with drinking, but with anything stressful in life.
PS: I too find the "get out of your head" advice you mentioned earlier very helpful. Not just with drinking, but with anything stressful in life.
Grateful to be free
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Arizona
Posts: 3,680
Originally Posted by ReadyAndAble
It's not a literal voice, at least not for me Threshold. It's a desire—sometimes an image, sometimes an articulated thought, sometimes just a feeling. That's the voice. I think the desire to drink, even when we know we shouldn't, is pretty universal among active alcoholics.
And if it's not a clever voice, then how does "shooting down it's arguments" operate on an image/feeling...etc etc?
the experience of a voice isn't universal, the experience of a clever voice isn't universal and I don't think there is one size fits all recovery methods.
I'm not trying to start a fight, just to acknowledge, especially to newbies out there that there are many ways it' manifests. If you're not hearing voices, it doesn't mean that your not an alcoholic or that there's not a recovery method that will work for you.
It would be more convenient if both the syndrome and the "cure" were black and white, but it just isn't so.
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