BackToSquareOne

That's interesting, if you were told to not think of the word "kangaroo" or to remember the same word the effect would be the same. In the same sense replacing your drinking with meetings where all you talk about is not drinking seems questionable. Instead of doing it you're talking about not doing it. I could be way off base but that was my perception.

Terminally Unique

Just because HAMS uses the term "Harm Reduction" in their name does not mean that they have anything to do with stopping disease epidemics. They don't actually do anything that requires that sort of footwork.

sugarbear1

I find strength in numbers. Phone calls, meetings, hanging at a coffee shop. I never drank in those places. Evenings spent online......never alone.....

Jfanagle

I respect and gain insight from all of the comments on this thread. I have read some material regarding AVRT and I hope I understood the basic concept. I got sober with AA and I have stayed that way for a few years now, but I always wonder why after the initial year or so it has been relatively easy for me to stay sober with a meeting every now and then once or twice a month and then sometimes one a week but always sporadic and really when I want to catch up with friends in the program.

I guess why I felt motivated to write today, is that AA or AVAT seem to begin with the premise that the subscriber has acknowledged a problem that if approached casually will result in dire consequences. This HAMS seems much more focused on a "rational person" who like using seat belts or condoms, (the websites examples) can formulate the resolve too simply "act with common sense." Devote ones self to positive actions, but perhaps not everyone needs abstinence. That part makes me leery. Every alcoholic that I have known would rather at the beginning of the program of AA become a moderate drinker, rather than stopping.

If I had been in that frame of mind, heck I would have gone to the movies 13 years ago instead of my first AA meeting! I believe that it is somewhat dangerous to tell the alcoholic that we just need you to act a little more reasonably. In my mind, and please correct me if I misunderstand the AVRT premise, but both AA and AVRT assume that the alcoholic should not drink.

Again, obsessing with not drinking seems to occur in most new members of AA, but if they move past NOT doing something to DOING something, such as living and adapting to life challenges then it all seems to end in the same place, to me at least. Is that approach much different than AVRT? I am asking so that I can better understand.

Thanks for letting me empty my mind on paper,

Jon

Jfanagle

how do you delete double posting?

Terminally Unique

AVRT is predicated entirely on a plan for lifetime abstinence, across the board. The reason is that this forces a breakdown of the addictive mindset, essentially partitioning the ego in two — the addicted part and the human part. Without this plan, and this resulting breakdown, the rest of the AVRT 'tools' don't really make any sense. Someone who wants to 'drink moderately' or get drunk occasionally isn't going to like AVRT at all, which is why these HAMS people 'adapted' it.