On Ironclad Resolutions...
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On Ironclad Resolutions...
If you were to analyze why most ironclad resolutions to quit alcohol fail what would your top 2 reasons be? My first pick would be that many quit but nothing else changes, for example if you were a miserable, depressed drunk the only thing quitting will do is transform you into a miserable, depressed sober person.
My second reason would be that the resolve to stay stopped is always in a state of flux, it waxes and wanes on a daily basis. You need a way to stay centered in your resolve and to get recentered when you veer off course. Some stay centered in their resolve by using a program, meditation, prayer, exercise, daily introspection or whatever but it does seem we all need something. Any thoughts or ideas...
My second reason would be that the resolve to stay stopped is always in a state of flux, it waxes and wanes on a daily basis. You need a way to stay centered in your resolve and to get recentered when you veer off course. Some stay centered in their resolve by using a program, meditation, prayer, exercise, daily introspection or whatever but it does seem we all need something. Any thoughts or ideas...
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Solemn vows to never stop drinking and stay stopped drinking do not work because:
Knowledge about myself as a drinker, knowledge about the likely consequences, and knowledge about the disease of alcoholism will not overcome the strange mental twists, the peculiar thinking and the blank spots that bring about a return to that first drink.
And
Self control and willpower are non-existent or seriously lacking when it comes to alcohol and drinking. Yeah, sure there are times when being on guard and exercising willpower work -- but these do not work consistently.
Knowledge about myself as a drinker, knowledge about the likely consequences, and knowledge about the disease of alcoholism will not overcome the strange mental twists, the peculiar thinking and the blank spots that bring about a return to that first drink.
And
Self control and willpower are non-existent or seriously lacking when it comes to alcohol and drinking. Yeah, sure there are times when being on guard and exercising willpower work -- but these do not work consistently.
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Originally Posted by BackToSquareOne 
Some stay centered in their resolve by using a program, meditation, prayer, exercise, daily introspection or whatever but it does seem we all need something. Any thoughts or ideas...
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For me all I had to do was see alcohol for what it really is. Once you get past all the excuses(and they are all excuses) and see it has no benefits whatsoever then alcohol is as easy to avoid as a glass of paint.
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Originally Posted by BackToSquareOne
If you were to analyze why most ironclad resolutions to quit alcohol fail what would your top 2 reasons be?
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It's the most critical point most newcomers miss imo, and it's the best answer to why AA has the churn it does.
On the surface it's perfectly reasonable. If I decide I'm not going to cut my toenails too short because the last times I did that several became painful and inflamed you can bet I won't find myself hacking them to the quick and bloody in a few weeks, months or years. There's no doubt of the value of making that decision or if it will be carried out.
What would it mean if down the road I can't get my shoes on and go to work because I did that thing again that I decided not to do. And what would it indicate if I make that decison again several times a week for many years but wound up toeless as the result of not carrying out the plan that is clearly in my interest to implement?
I should be able to make that decision regarding alcohol, after all it rests on the shelf until I take it down, and no one but me sinks it. Deciding it's a good idea to not do that and carry through should be all that's required, in a perfect world.
After failing enough times people started suggesting I hit a few AA meetings and I did that, and after failing some more I read their book, and after failing some more I sat at my kitchen table and took my best guess at their steps, and after failing some more I assumed AA worked for those people but I was obviously cut from different cloth because they stayed sober and I did not.
I put that down to things that were very wrong with them and very right with me.
AA was clearly awaste of time and if it wasn't for my continuing to get into drinking trouble and needing to get the heat off I'd never have gone back.
But trouble unavoidably goes with my kind of drinking, and though I struggled like a bug in a funnel I kept being pulled back and directed by forces beyond my control into AA contact.
Doing this time what I hadn't done before, the course of action the people who were sober had continually said was the reason they were staying sober, worked. Why that went over my head for 6 years is the real mystery.
I'm not sure if I thought I was not so bad that I needed to do something in order to recover, or if the steps looked too weak to make a difference in my case because I was way too affected. I think it boiled down to not understanding the basics of alcoholism and identifying that as something that I had even though I didn't want to have it.
Wishing it away with a lick and a prayer showed an astounding lack of understanding on my part. Common enough to be the rule, but when I hear it from new people I'm still taken back that we can repeatedly ignore what each of us should make obvious to the rest of us when so many cycle back and forth from temporary sobriety to drinking to doing the temp thing again.
Average a dozen here plus or minus every day. People with good intentions making their honest best efforts each sure it's different this time for good reasons.
The reality of the continual stream of misery we see here should be a clue. I wonder how most can miss what's under our noses each and every day? How huge and continuing a force can denial be? If 200 decide not to drink for sure and one pulls it off with a simple decision, why would so many believe they are certainly going to be that one? If they were gambling with a dime I could understand taking those odds, but much more is on the table.
On the surface it's perfectly reasonable. If I decide I'm not going to cut my toenails too short because the last times I did that several became painful and inflamed you can bet I won't find myself hacking them to the quick and bloody in a few weeks, months or years. There's no doubt of the value of making that decision or if it will be carried out.
What would it mean if down the road I can't get my shoes on and go to work because I did that thing again that I decided not to do. And what would it indicate if I make that decison again several times a week for many years but wound up toeless as the result of not carrying out the plan that is clearly in my interest to implement?
I should be able to make that decision regarding alcohol, after all it rests on the shelf until I take it down, and no one but me sinks it. Deciding it's a good idea to not do that and carry through should be all that's required, in a perfect world.
After failing enough times people started suggesting I hit a few AA meetings and I did that, and after failing some more I read their book, and after failing some more I sat at my kitchen table and took my best guess at their steps, and after failing some more I assumed AA worked for those people but I was obviously cut from different cloth because they stayed sober and I did not.
I put that down to things that were very wrong with them and very right with me.
AA was clearly awaste of time and if it wasn't for my continuing to get into drinking trouble and needing to get the heat off I'd never have gone back.
But trouble unavoidably goes with my kind of drinking, and though I struggled like a bug in a funnel I kept being pulled back and directed by forces beyond my control into AA contact.
Doing this time what I hadn't done before, the course of action the people who were sober had continually said was the reason they were staying sober, worked. Why that went over my head for 6 years is the real mystery.
I'm not sure if I thought I was not so bad that I needed to do something in order to recover, or if the steps looked too weak to make a difference in my case because I was way too affected. I think it boiled down to not understanding the basics of alcoholism and identifying that as something that I had even though I didn't want to have it.
Wishing it away with a lick and a prayer showed an astounding lack of understanding on my part. Common enough to be the rule, but when I hear it from new people I'm still taken back that we can repeatedly ignore what each of us should make obvious to the rest of us when so many cycle back and forth from temporary sobriety to drinking to doing the temp thing again.
Average a dozen here plus or minus every day. People with good intentions making their honest best efforts each sure it's different this time for good reasons.
The reality of the continual stream of misery we see here should be a clue. I wonder how most can miss what's under our noses each and every day? How huge and continuing a force can denial be? If 200 decide not to drink for sure and one pulls it off with a simple decision, why would so many believe they are certainly going to be that one? If they were gambling with a dime I could understand taking those odds, but much more is on the table.
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On September 5, 2010 I took a vow never to drink again. That vow, or resolution if you want to call it that, lead me to SR and my recovery. But it is the actions I've taken to support that vow that have kept me sober over 15 months, not the statement itself.
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Well, technically speaking...if it is truly "ironclad", then it won't fail. The problem is with resolutions that appear ironclad, but are in fact full of holes.
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How many drunks have said "I PROMISE I'll never drink again"
First of all, how do you know what you'll do in the future. Here's what works: "I won't drink today". If you're depressed go to a shrink ... having a second mental illness like depression or bipolar is more common than not.
First of all, how do you know what you'll do in the future. Here's what works: "I won't drink today". If you're depressed go to a shrink ... having a second mental illness like depression or bipolar is more common than not.
Its_me_jen
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Salina, Ks
Posts: 8,547
All of the times I promised I'd never drink again .... I meant it. I just wasn't willing to do the work to stay stopped and I believed the lies my disease told me.
The longer I stay sober the more it feels like a lifelong resolution. It worries me when I start thinking like that because I know I still have to keep working at it. Continually growing.
The longer I stay sober the more it feels like a lifelong resolution. It worries me when I start thinking like that because I know I still have to keep working at it. Continually growing.
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Originally Posted by soberlicious
Well, technically speaking...if it is truly "ironclad", then it won't fail. The problem is with resolutions that appear ironclad, but are in fact full of holes.
Originally Posted by Morning After Resolution
Oh boy, I'm hung over and heaving again. That's it, never again!
[Sometime Later...]
OK, the hangover is over, let's rethink this never again thing... maybe that was too hasty and drastic. Perhaps something a little more reasonable will do... such as...
"I will quit drinking for (some length of time)."
"I will quit drinking until (some bad situation improves)."
"I will quit drinking but continue using another substance."
"I will drink less."
"I will drink only at certain times or places."
Originally Posted by Ironclad Resolution
OK, the hangover and detox are over. My head is clear, but I can still remember why I should never drink. Therefore, no matter how hungry, angry, lonely, tired, sad, depressed, ill, destitute, suicidal, or forgetful of why I quit in the first place I may become, I will never drink or use again, and I will never change my mind.
Its_me_jen
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Salina, Ks
Posts: 8,547
ironclad
inflexibly entrenched and unchangeable; "brassbound traditions"; "brassbound party loyalists"; "an ironclad rule"
wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn
-----
My question would be .... is anything really unchangable?
inflexibly entrenched and unchangeable; "brassbound traditions"; "brassbound party loyalists"; "an ironclad rule"
wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn
-----
My question would be .... is anything really unchangable?
where the light is
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 2,763
Active alcoholism, I think, is a form on mental illness (obsession). Also results in depression, anxiety, etc. A resolution will not "cure" mental illness.
AA is a spiritual solution. Counselling is more tied to changing the way you think about things. I did both.
I think a better resolution is "I resolve to get help."
And there is no shame in getting help especially with something this destructive.
AA is a spiritual solution. Counselling is more tied to changing the way you think about things. I did both.
I think a better resolution is "I resolve to get help."
And there is no shame in getting help especially with something this destructive.
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Join Date: May 2011
Location: Albany NY
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Does anyone remember the movie "The End" with Dom Deluise and Burt Reynolds?
That is the movie where Burt Reynolds wants to die but can't do it himself, so he gets Dom Deluise on board to kill him when he's not looking.
There is a scene where Burt Reynolds goes out into the ocean to drown himself and has a sudden epiphany that he doesn't want to die. As he struggles for breath and begins his swim back, he begins to make deals with God. If God allows him to live, he will give all his earnings away to help others. As he progresses to shore and becomes more confident he will make it and live, the deal changes. He then says he will give away 80% and keep 20%. Then it goes to 60/40 in God's favor, then 50/50, then 60/40 to 80/20 in Burt Reynolds favor.
I'd say that was pretty much like me in the days before I entirely committed to sobriety. I was kind of good at playing a mental "Let's Make a Deal" in order to get my fat out of the fire.
Like DoggoneCarl said above, it is the work in getting sober that counts.
I got sober one day at a time; others commit to sobriety for life, but no matter what method one chooses, there are no deals to be made - only action and work. When it comes to booze, once you start moving those goal posts and putting off to tomorrow what needs to be done today, you have already started losing ground.
And it doesn't matter how much time sober you have under your belt, once you let those little thoughts of drinking slip in through the cracks in your mind, you have to beat them back with a huge sledgehammer. Nope - you can't make any deals with the drink at all.
Just my opinion....
That is the movie where Burt Reynolds wants to die but can't do it himself, so he gets Dom Deluise on board to kill him when he's not looking.
There is a scene where Burt Reynolds goes out into the ocean to drown himself and has a sudden epiphany that he doesn't want to die. As he struggles for breath and begins his swim back, he begins to make deals with God. If God allows him to live, he will give all his earnings away to help others. As he progresses to shore and becomes more confident he will make it and live, the deal changes. He then says he will give away 80% and keep 20%. Then it goes to 60/40 in God's favor, then 50/50, then 60/40 to 80/20 in Burt Reynolds favor.
I'd say that was pretty much like me in the days before I entirely committed to sobriety. I was kind of good at playing a mental "Let's Make a Deal" in order to get my fat out of the fire.
Like DoggoneCarl said above, it is the work in getting sober that counts.
I got sober one day at a time; others commit to sobriety for life, but no matter what method one chooses, there are no deals to be made - only action and work. When it comes to booze, once you start moving those goal posts and putting off to tomorrow what needs to be done today, you have already started losing ground.
And it doesn't matter how much time sober you have under your belt, once you let those little thoughts of drinking slip in through the cracks in your mind, you have to beat them back with a huge sledgehammer. Nope - you can't make any deals with the drink at all.
Just my opinion....
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Originally Posted by NYCDoglvr
First of all, how do you know what you'll do in the future.
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Originally Posted by BackToSquareOne
If you were to analyze why most ironclad resolutions to quit alcohol fail what would your top 2 reasons be?
1 - I didn't really want to quit.
2 - I didn't really want to be sober.
I'm not being snarky about it. It was just really true. Sure I didn't want to be HUNGOVER or a NEGLIGENT PARENT or IN POOR HEALTH or other things. But I didn't want to be sober, either. I wanted to be able to drink without consequence which is entirely different.
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