HuskyPup

Anything one does is an action. Reading is an action, thinking is an action, deciding not to drink as a result is also an action. Education is an action that can help lead to other, healthier actions, such as diet, exercise, and helping others in whatever variety of ways: from volunteering at a center to help at risk gay youth build better self esteems, to helping the homeless learn new skills, to helping to preserve nature...I think education is what informs our actions, and is the bedrock of them. I know that in my own efforts to help others outside of my self, it has been education that has been a key factor, and also a key factor in my ongoing decision not to drink.

mhealer3

yeah, i've not personally had any benefit from the 'lessons' of peoples' relapses.
i think it's because it weakens me to even THINK about their falling.
therefore i have 2 keep my mind on their success stories(however short-term),
it's just the way i roll.
much more Peaceful for me that way, less fretful. therefore more successful.

Terminally Unique

How much "action" is there in rehab except for smoking cigarettes, watching lectures, having group discussions, and going to AA meetings? Certainly not much working with others. How can you possibly work with others when you can't even keep yourself sober? All that happens outside of rehab.

Taking5

The first place I heard that was at an AA meeting. The second was at a funeral as has been mentioned already. The third was here. I really do not like it.

Also as Kellye said "relapse is a part of recovery", is pure BS. Relapse is a part of the disease. I think this saying gives people permission to relapse. I don't like it either.

onlythetruth

I agree with you about the "relapse is part of recovery" statement--I don't agree with it either. I think the intent of the idea is probably to reduce the shame of relapse because so many do have that experience. But it can be a destructive idea, too, leading people to think that they HAVE to relapse, or even that someone who quits and never relapses wasn't really addicted, because if they were, they wouldn't have been able to do it without relapsing.

In fact, I had a little of that in my own situation. A few years after I quit drinking my brother told me that he didn't think I had ever been addicted to alcohol. I was a bit stunned hearing this from the person who was saving my butt from drunken escapades when we were still in our teens, so I asked him why he thought this. He told me that if I'd really been addicted I would have had at least one relapse! He thought it was "too easy"! Weird.....

Terminally Unique

Most newcomers don't stick around for long, and very few get to the one year mark. Some will come and go like a metronome, with regular relapse/retread cycles for years. Because of this, over time, a group will tend to build up a number of "regulars," and those are the people that you will usually see.

TheEnd

From these statements it's obvious that you don't have a high opinion of treatment and that's perfectly fine. However, there is a phrase "Don't knock it, until you try it" that rings loud and clear when talking about rehab. Rehab is something you have to experience and go through before you have an idea of what goes on. Movies and books don't give you a true picture of what it's all about, don't believe everything you see on T.V, it's not reality.

People that go into treatment and come out thinking that they could have read a couple of books and went to a couple of meetings and still had the same quality experience are the ones that wasted their precious time and money.

Like I said before "You get out of it, what you put into it".

However, this thread wasn't initially about treatment, or some may die, relapse is a part of recovery or funerals or anything else that has funneled into this thread.

It was about how my thinking has evolved since the point of when I started treatment, till where I am at now. When I see people who wanted sobriety so badly, and I look at them now struggling, it saddens me, but makes me realize that I am where I want to be, and I will do anything to stay here.

If that doesn't resonate with some of you, that's cool, but this really isn't a debate. Everything doesn't have to turn into a debate on this forum. What are we really arguing, my way is better than your way. We are a collective group working toward one goal. Lets not lose sight of that.

HuskyPup

Yeah, it is odd. There has been nobody new in any of the groups I have gone to, so far, or they just stay quiet. The beginners group is the one with the oldest average age/# of years per member. I think one thing I find frustrating is that I wish there were some more other newcomers to talk to, but after the meetings, it generally just breaks into groups of those who have known each other a long time, and striking up conversation seems to have become harder over time, as opposed to easier, like the more people get to know me, the more skeptical they become.

I think the initial glow of the welcome is wearing off, and though it is nice to hear stories from the old and wise, I do feel a bit out of place, like the only one with less than a decade, at times. Or 5 years. Ok, maybe I exaggerate, but the lack of new faces is getting to be kinda weird, to me.

I have also never seen a person relapse, either, at any meeting, and talk about it. The members seem as permanently ensconsed as statues, at times.

Mark75

Then they are lucky to have you there, HP.

HuskyPup

True, without somebody there still recovering, it might get a bit boring!


I was also thinking: It would be interesting to see a group in which the majority of people were new to recovery...maybe this is the appeal of rehab centers, to some extent.

On a side note, I have often thought that a wilderness survival based rehab for adults would be a fun idea, you see this for younger people, generally age 25 and under, but never for adults.

Maybe if I get my masters in psych, I will move back to the wilds of Michigan, and start one, using the idea of self-sufficiency, meeting challenges and growth among the organizing principles. Hmmm, I think I will expand on this in another thread, sometime. Gears are turning, upstairs.

Terminally Unique

I've been inside the belly of the beast, so to speak, but I'm glad that you were able to get something worthwhile out of the experience.

c49

I run, bike, walk, rollerblade, do cartwheels along the road... just kidding about the walking....

Always within 10 feet of each other on the backroads is some empty beer can or cheap vodka. They remind me of my former Hell. NEEDING to chug a half pint of Karkov vodka because I only had a few $$ left in my pocket to buy it and I needed to keep the detox from starting. Chugged and tossed out the window along some country road. That was Hell.

Thankfully that was years ago too. I look at those empty bottles and cans along the roads and feel sorry because I remember that pain that they are feeling. THAT sorrow keeps sober.

Mark75

I am totally with you on the wilderness survival idea... Love that stuff. I think too, that it is empowering, group and individual.

The UP of MI would be awesome, or ME (my favorite) or perhaps MT... Google the Bob Marshall Wilderness in Montana...

Mark75

Oh c49999.... I bike, lol, as if you couldn't tell. There is one route I take along some country roads... There is an alcoholic that travels the same road... Almost every day there is another empty 5th of cheap vodka along the road. In a brown paper bag, in varying degrees of decomposition... That's how I know when there is a new one. I think I even figured out which house he or she lives in... So very sad, how lonely it must be.

Nightsd

If I had never gone to at least a detox facility, I doubt I ever would have been strong enough to go through it at home. I just can't see myself ever doing that. Rehab is good for some people. It takes them out of what is sometimes a vicious situation and allows them to get their heads on straight before going back. Some people need the structure and support to get their heads straight.

stugotz

One thing rehabs do when you leave is hand you a meeting list. Hmmm....

soberlicious

Other people's relapse/pain/suffering does not keep me sober. To suggest that another's pain could somehow benefit me bothers me. alot.

to the original post...
I have been to that place. My thinking was so distorted that the decision to end my life was a relief, even brought me a sense of peace and calm. I know this might be difficult for some to understand and it is especially painful for my family to hear, but it's true. Drinking alcohol caused me to quite literally lose my mind.

NYCDoglvr

Oh, this is so true especially since there's a bit of time between me and my last drink. It's easy to cut back on meetings, to take sobriety for granted and I could certainly relapse again. I know I have another drink in me, but do I have another recovery?

Sidney14

I do to a D&A group therapy and over the last 11months of my sobriety have seen people relapse and come and go. Some nights the therapy groups feels like a waste of time especially when everyone is doing great........it sounds horrible but I agree with previous comments that I get more out of it when soemone majorily relapses in a bad way or from someone just starting out in recovery,,,,,,,,,i,e it reminds me to of how bad it was and can still be....and motivates me to stay strong and determined.......

SixStringZen

I don't quite understand why drawing strength from a tragic event is bad? My mother died of cancer...it motivates me to get a colonoscopy....how is that offensive? I'm not glad it happened...I wish it hadn't....but it would be tragic for me to learn nothing from it...