Hobochk

Please help- what is my higher power supposed to be? I do not covet a religious God. Any input would be much appreciated.

Mark75

There are lots of great threads here about this... also a cool thread active right now in newcomers... Atheism and AA... check them out.

No one can or should tell you what your higher power should be... seek and you will find yours.

Hobochk

Thank you! I'll go look for those threads.

NYCDoglvr

Great topic!! In terms of Christianity, I guess you'd call me an agnostic. Anyway I don't share the same beliefs others do in this program. But I've stayed sober with my own higher power.

First of all, Bill W wisely didn't want the religious part of AA to turn off alcoholics. He wisely said "a higher power "as you understand him/her" I made a tree my higher power for a while, then it was GOD = group of drunks, sometimes it's the universe. The point of all this is to shift the focus from us as in control of everything to something -- anything -- outside.

I pray to the universe, I ask the universe for help. It's worked for me for almost 20 years. Don't worry, you don't have to believe in anything (that follows when you get proof). The only thing that really matters is the alcoholic's willingness to turn his/her problems over to the higher power.

LaFemme

You have to decide for yourself who your hP is. Mine is the holy trinity, but I don't put a lot of stock in religion and dogma myself.

Good luck!

Hobochk

thanks everyone. I love reading your comments on this topic.

Beebizzy

I'm no expert on AA or the writings of Bill W, nor have I been baptised or had any religious input in my upbringing (not that I'm suggesting AA is religious).

I like reading so I've read parts of the BB - how can you not when you are exploring alcoholism? I've also read the Bible - same reason, I was a student of literature and it's an important text. But that's about it in terms of 'religious' readings.

I've never felt in control of anything in the first place and always kind of assumed there was something bigger than me going on. Maybe I stumbled on the concept of HP by mistake or something. But I didn't proactively do anything with it - that's where it ends.

I don't think I even understand what 'spiritual' means

BB

onlythetruth

The higher power concept is only relevant to 12 step programs.

There are several other recovery programs that don't use it: SMART Recovery, LifeRing, SOS. There is also AVRT which is not a program so much as a method.

Terminally Unique

AA got it from the Oxford Groups.

Oxford Group: "More spiritual than religious."

Alcoholics Anonymous: "Spiritual, not religious."

Beebizzy

Thanks AVRT.

BB

twilli59

Hobochk, you have just hit on perhaps the biggest issue in the recovery world. Bill W writes in the big book how new people would be excited, and then "their faces would fall" in disappointment when the spiritual piece was brought up. So, for me it was great to recognize right away that most everyone who has experienced the gift of recovery started right where I was - which is where you are now! It forces us to dig a little deeper into ourselves, which in itself is the beginning of an amazing journey. Use a religious God, nature, recovered people who have more power than a using addict, the power in the feelings of love and friendship, your inner conscience, your "better" self, or just the principles behing the 12 Steps if you go that route - they were just posted on another thread. It can also just be viewed as rational behavior. Cause and effect. The key is that we access something other than the brain that got us addicted. The humility and willingness that come from even being open to this search is the cornerstone for getting better. It shows we are ready to change. People's concept of a higher power almost always seems to evolve as they see how different the world looks when they live from a place centered in these principles. Good luck to you.

Zube

H-

Some people use the group of AA itself as their HP. The point of a HP is that we cannot do this alone. Tried, and failed. My HP is God, but he speaks to me through the voices of AA.

Best Wishes,
Zube

Mark75

Religious people are not automatically in any better position to "get it" when it comes to the steps... granted they may have a posture that will allow a breakthrough more quickly than a devout atheist. But it's not automatic... I really liked OTT's post(s) about locus of control in another recent thread here... and I really believe that it helps me describe my experience with the second and third steps.

Put as simply as possible... I detached from that internal "locus of control" in the second step... I allowed for the fact that if I moved over, ceded my ultimate authority in all things Mark75, I might, infact, be happy, joyous and free...

I have been "religious" at times... not evangelical or anything, not that it's bad thing... and not so much pious... but religious in a way that I found that God could support me in what I thought was best for me... ie... still holding on to that internal locus of control, just enlisting God...

That's very different than what has to happen in a successful 2nd and 3rd step.

But, who or what to cede ultimate authority to? A crucial question for step three. I have heard many people say that it can be anything, just not "me"... The idea that it has to be a diety is false and made by people who are either afraid or way under informed...

Just not me. Simple.

My higher power... well I am catholic, and like LaFemme, the Holy Trinity is, by definition, my higher power. Where do we find the Holy Trinity? I find and relate to it in everything, and more importantly, in everyone... There is power and light. But I can't find it if I don't look for it, and,.... if I block it with myself, LOL.

Terminally Unique

I remember those "Step 2" meetings, and since it comes straight out of the "Twelve Steps and Twelve Traditions," there was always the suggestion to use the group as your higher power. Whenever I heard that, I would look around the room, then at the giant 12 Steps on the wall, and think to myself "well, that's certainly not going to happen, I will not be turning my will and my life over to the care of these folks."

Granted, anyone who actually reads the "Twelve Steps and Twelve Traditions" can readily deduce that Bill Wilson only expected the group idea to be a starting point.

Terminally Unique

I don't think it can be "anything" - at the very least, it has to be able to do what is implied in the Steps. Light bulbs, radiators, doorknobs, bedpans, coke cans, and table legs aren't going to cut it, IMO. Pantheists might argue that since G-d and the universe are one and the same, though, that the doorknob is part of G-d.

Mark75

Well, I never took any of those suggestions seriously... but I didn't need to. I knew that the whole "a doorknob could suffice as a higher power, since it wasn't me" thing was bullsh1t... that's ridiculous...

I find "God" in the rooms, definitely... "He" is there within each of us... That's my concept... But no, I don't see the group of drunks as my higher power... He's there, but He is not them...

I am not necessarily troubled by the situation you describe... Consider a low bottom drunk who has lost everything and everyone, who's only next step down is death, or worse... There is an urgency... if group of drunks will suffice until that person can develop his or her own relationship with their own higher power... so be it...

twilli59

If you're working the AA program - which is only one option, there are many others - the Step 3 decision does not involve analyzing - it involves action. What you decide to do to access your higher power is to do the bigges step in all of the 12, in my opinion - Step 4. That inventory brings you closer to your higher power. For me, it's working with honesty, willingness and humility. When I got stuck on 3, I was told if I was even willing to concede that I wasn't God, then move to 4 and gain more power. It's a matter of doing the steps and not getting caught up in intellectualizing. Step 4 changes a lot of people's lives in epic ways. Even outside of the "program" most recovering people have to do some sort of honest assessment and usually have to address the wreckage of the past. The steps are a series of prayers/meditations that give you the courage to take the actual action steps (4 & 9). I got hung up on the prayer/meditation part. I was WAY overthinking it. It was the inventory and the amends that got me centered. That's the power of AA in my opinion. Action over thought.

Terminally Unique

I understand the purpose of the steps, I'm just not too keen on people obfuscating this with suggestions of light bulbs, doorknobs, radiators, and bedpans as Higher Powers. Try replacing "God as we understood Him" with "DOORKNOB" in the 12 Steps to see how ridiculous that suggestion actually sounds.

Mark75

LOL, yea, I am guilty of that for sure.... I also agree with you about the action taken in step four... it was "epic". And not as painful as people imagine... it's actually a gift.

Hobochk is struggling with this whole thing. Hopefully our discussion has helped.

Hobochk

BB, chapter 13, Personal Stories, I just listened to it on my Ipod. "If you think you're an atheist, an agnostic, a skeptic or have any form of intellectual pride which keeps you from accepting what is in this book, I feel sorry for you."

I realize this is a personal story, and this person is entitled to believe such things. I am in no way rejecting what is in the book. I love this book, I can relate to it like no other. I can overlook the Christian overtones. This threw me, "I feel sorry for you." I don't think I can go it alone, and I do not reject what's in the BB, just becase I don't worship a religious God.