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AA wouldn't work

Old 07-05-2011, 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted by yeahgr8 View Post
I sometimes get the impression that some people think that a person who drinks too much and is having consequences sits there and thinks "you know what i think ill try rehab" or "got nothing to do tonight think ill go to AA"...i was ****** when i walked into AA and looked for a sponsor to get the solution in AA...i had tried everything else...

--did you truly try everything else?? if you tried everything, I doubt AA is the only thing left out there to help. Not saying AA should be a last resort... why do people think something picked as your last resort is the best option?? i don't follow the reasoning...

But i can relate too because i walked into AA 10 years earlier and thought what a bunch of crap and when i was 21 and thought the same thing...as long as anyone isn't living their own personal living hell and can't stop drinking but for a short period of months then chill out, sit back and mull over which route to recovery (although it's beyond me why anyone would want recovery if their life isn't that bad at the moment) to inquire about...
--did you truly try everything else?? if you tried everything, I doubt AA is the only thing left out there to help. Not saying AA should be a last resort... why do people think something picked as your last resort is the best option?? i don't follow the reasoning...


--why? because I don't want things to get any worse, that's why. i want recovery to recover what I've lost... no matter if I've lost what someone considers a lot... or whether I've hit "rock bottom" or not. Is there something AA'ers find boring and less dramatic about someone not being in the complete depths of despair... dragging themselves out of the gutter to find solace in the Big Book... because it's their last resort??
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Old 07-05-2011, 12:01 PM
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Originally Posted by SoberJennie View Post
--did you truly try everything else?? if you tried everything, I doubt AA is the only thing left out there to help. Not saying AA should be a last resort... why do people think something picked as your last resort is the best option?? i don't follow the reasoning...


--why? because I don't want things to get any worse, that's why. i want recovery to recover what I've lost... no matter if I've lost what someone considers a lot... or whether I've hit "rock bottom" or not. Is there something AA'ers find boring and less dramatic about someone not being in the complete depths of despair... dragging themselves out of the gutter to find solace in the Big Book... because it's their last resort??
That just my experience, i couldn't care less who goes to AA to be honest, it's not up to me at all! Some of the posts make me smile cos i remember thinking the same thing but being in an absolute living hell, it's just a glib comment about how i get this picture that everything is ok, ill chill out and take my time with this decision whilst everything falls down around me...classic alcoholic behaviour, i did it:-)
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Old 07-05-2011, 12:05 PM
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Originally Posted by yeahgr8 View Post
That just my experience, i couldn't care less who goes to AA to be honest, it's not up to me at all! Some of the posts make me smile cos i remember thinking the same thing but being in an absolute living hell, it's just a glib comment about how i get this picture that everything is ok, ill chill out and take my time with this decision whilst everything falls down around me...classic alcoholic behaviour, i did it:-)
and i find it hilarious that people would presume my life is falling down around me while I take my time to explore my options... how disgustingly smug

and totally incorrect, in this case... if you're making that presumption about me... because i question your reasoning
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Old 07-05-2011, 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted by SoberJennie View Post
and i find it hilarious that people would presume my life is falling down around me while I take my time to explore my options... how disgustingly smug

and totally incorrect, in this case... if you're making that presumption about me... because i question your reasoning
I'm not making any assumptions about you or anyone else...i'm talking about me, i find it absolutely hilarious that i sat back and considered my options for so long...at no time even though i was searching the internet for ways to quit drinking and for other people with the same problems did i think that drastic measures were required or that i would have to go and ask help from a bunch of strangers...i thought yeah i drink too much, i'd like to quit or cut down, may as well have a look around, i even thought everyone went through that and that people who didn't were just normal squares...i didn't realise the severity of the situation, nor was i willing to listen to anyone...but thats what happened to me...
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Old 07-05-2011, 12:16 PM
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Originally Posted by yeahgr8 View Post
I'm not making any assumptions about you or anyone else...i'm talking about me, i find it absolutely hilarious that i sat back and considered my options for so long...at no time even though i was searching the internet for ways to quit drinking and for other people with the same problems did i think that drastic measures were required or that i would have to go and ask help from a bunch of strangers...i thought yeah i drink too much, i'd like to quit or cut down, may as well have a look around, i even thought everyone went through that and that people who didn't were just normal squares...i didn't realise the severity of the situation, nor was i willing to listen to anyone...but thats what happened to me...
alright, thanks for that clarification.
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Old 07-05-2011, 12:27 PM
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Originally Posted by zencat View Post
i like to use a "ray gun".
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Old 07-05-2011, 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by SoberJennie View Post
and i find it hilarious that people would presume my life is falling down around me while I take my time to explore my options... how disgustingly smug

and totally incorrect, in this case... if you're making that presumption about me... because i question your reasoning
No one was speaking of you directly SJ, you presumed quite a bit within your reply. It's pretty disgustingly obvious that yeaghr8 was communicating his own experiences.

As for the things people are saying about AA and why it works for them... as is stated in the BB, the part of AA that leads to sobriety - for most - is when the person coming to AA HAS tried everything else, and everything else availed them nothing and helped in no way, shape, or form. When the bottom comes for some of us, there are no more "options to explore", because the bottomed out drinker has been there and done that and all it led to was more dangerous drinking.

Personally speaking, I DID try everything over the years. Short of a labotomy and shock therapy I've tried it and worked it, for years... SMART, rational recovery, psychiatry, CBT, everything. Also, years ago had I been thrust into AA I would also have run from the building, thinking they were all losers, clowns, and Jesus freaks. Since then, my personal experience has shown me that finding my inner child through other means, working on conflict resolutions, taking meds, whining about my childhood to some 100.00 per hour knucklehead, e.t.c... it did absolutely nothing to get me sober. In some instances these programs made me worse off.

Simply put, and I'm speaking of no one but myself, I found AA after about 7 months of sobriety (the white knuckle kind), at 44, after hitting an absolute bottom. Again, I'm talking about the kind of bottom where "exploring ones' options" is no longer an option. With me, and a good many others involved in AA, there were only 2 options left;

1. get proper help quickly,
2. die an agonizing, insane, alcoholic death slowly (or quickly, as in my case).

With nowhere else to turn I finally looked up and said "my will can not battle this bottle anymore, I need help". Eventually I gave AA a proper shot, and left my judgments in the trash bin with my last bottle of vodka. I listened, I read, I did the work asked of me. I didn't open my mouth to whinge and moan, never once presumed enough arrogance (after being such a total drunk a$$ for most of my adult life) to levy criticisms or presume wisdom over a program that has helped other hopeless alcoholics who walked in my shoes and had all-too similar experiences to my own. I simply shut my bloody trap, let go of my ego and opinions, turned it over, and surrendered.

Since then AA is the only thing that has kept me from putting bottle to mouth for as long as I have, since I started drinking 25 years ago. If you still have room to explore other options I am bloody happy for you. Explore away and I hope you find/found something that fits your disposition. I pray you don't ever get to the point where you've run out of options, and that if you do, AA will be there to help you as it has me.
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Old 07-05-2011, 01:03 PM
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Originally Posted by binderdonedat View Post
No one was speaking of you directly SJ, you presumed quite a bit within your reply. It's pretty disgustingly obvious that yeaghr8 was communicating his own experiences.

As for the things people are saying about AA and why it works for them... as is stated in the BB, the part of AA that leads to sobriety - for most - is when the person coming to AA HAS tried everything else, and everything else availed them nothing and helped in no way, shape, or form. When the bottom comes for some of us, there are no more "options to explore", because the bottomed out drinker has been there and done that and all it led to was more dangerous drinking.

Personally speaking, I DID try everything over the years. Short of a labotomy and shock therapy I've tried it and worked it, for years... SMART, rational recovery, psychiatry, CBT, everything. Also, years ago had I been thrust into AA I would also have run from the building, thinking they were all losers, clowns, and Jesus freaks. Since then, my personal experience has shown me that finding my inner child through other means, working on conflict resolutions, taking meds, whining about my childhood to some 100.00 per hour knucklehead, e.t.c... it did absolutely nothing to get me sober. In some instances these programs made me worse off.

Simply put, and I'm speaking of no one but myself, I found AA after about 7 months of sobriety (the white knuckle kind), at 44, after hitting an absolute bottom. Again, I'm talking about the kind of bottom where "exploring ones' options" is no longer an option. With me, and a good many others involved in AA, there were only 2 options left;

1. get proper help quickly,
2. die an agonizing, insane, alcoholic death slowly (or quickly, as in my case).

With nowhere else to turn I finally looked up and said "my will can not battle this bottle anymore, I need help". Eventually I gave AA a proper shot, and left my judgments in the trash bin with my last bottle of vodka. I listened, I read, I did the work asked of me. I didn't open my mouth to whinge and moan, never once presumed enough arrogance (after being such a total drunk a$$ for most of my adult life) to levy criticisms or presume wisdom over a program that has helped other hopeless alcoholics who walked in my shoes and had all-too similar experiences to my own. I simply shut my bloody trap, let go of my ego and opinions, turned it over, and surrendered.

Since then AA is the only thing that has kept me from putting bottle to mouth for as long as I have, since I started drinking 25 years ago. If you still have room to explore other options I am bloody happy for you. Explore away and I hope you find/found something that fits your disposition. I pray you don't ever get to the point where you've run out of options, and that if you do, AA will be there to help you as it has me.
Well, that's about enough for me. Thanks.

I figured I'd give a forum like this a try... thinking the diversity here would be just the thing... a place where people of different philosophies and backgrounds could be supportive. What a crock.

When people start telling me to dumb myself down and give up... something's just not right about that.

There is one thing I know, I am not nor will I ever be powerless to help myself....

Good luck to everyone here.
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Old 07-05-2011, 01:23 PM
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Originally Posted by SoberJennie View Post
Well, that's about enough for me. Thanks.

I figured I'd give a forum like this a try... thinking the diversity here would be just the thing... a place where people of different philosophies and backgrounds could be supportive. What a crock.

When people start telling me to dumb myself down and give up... something's just not right about that.

There is one thing I know, I am not nor will I ever be powerless to help myself....

Good luck to everyone here.
No one is telling you to do anything. In the end, you drink too much, and how you deal with that is your own made bed. And where AA is concerned, if you take "giving up" to mean giving up on yourself you completely miss the point of what's been said, and what the 12 steps are all about. But that's neither here nor there, and you likely wouldn't understand it anyway, until you're prepared to listen without judgment and sans over-reaction. Fact is I've seen nothing but folks simply sharing with you their/our experiences in the hopes you might glean some personal truth from having read about them.

And frankly, for you to call this forum and/or the folks here a "crock" is more than slightly insulting. This forum alone helps greatly to keep people sober - some are sober today only because of this forum, completely sans AA. It helped me before I grabbed the BB, and still does, even after I discovered the 12 steps. There are plenty of divergent personalities here, many of whom are sober as judges in the absence of any regimen at all. THAT is what this forum does, and THAT is no crock and no small thing. IMO the only person here being judgmental and abrasive is you.

Good luck wherever you end up hanging your hat, I hope you win your battle with booze no matter the weapon you decide upon.

I'll leave you with this parting phrase, one that my own sponsor told me not 2 weeks ago when I was being overly dramatic about something... "Get over yourself already".
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Old 07-05-2011, 02:08 PM
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Nice. What wisdom. And ultimately uninspiring... The lesson here seems to be once the downtrodden get sober via AA they'll sometimes wear AA blinders forever...
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Old 07-05-2011, 02:43 PM
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Originally Posted by SoberJennie View Post
Nice. What wisdom. And ultimately uninspiring... The lesson here seems to be once the downtrodden get sober via AA they'll sometimes wear AA blinders forever...
I fought using AA for years because I thought "they" were too narrow-minded.
When I finally tried everything else I could possibly think of, I tried their steps. They didn't exactly work for me right away, so I gave up completely.

Low-and-behold, when I surrendered ALL of my expectations, the promises described in the Big Book started to kick in like a turbo-charged engine. Not only did I get all of the promises, my experience matched the Big Book description almost verbatim.

It's hard to argue with results. Specially such prolific results. The question you need to ask before bashing AA is "How's your way working for you?"
If it is working? When it comes to AA - fogetabotit!

P.S. I never surrendered my thinking. I still read Kierkegaard and Nietzsche.
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Old 07-05-2011, 02:43 PM
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Lol don't worry binderdonedat i was inspired but then again i have been sober a while now...would have told you to **** off before (and me now) in the "good old days";-)
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Old 07-05-2011, 04:06 PM
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Boleo, thanks for asking... "my way" is working well. I've prepared myself well the past couple of years to come to the quitting point I'm at presently. I've used the following programs: AA (although not of my own choosing... it was somewhat vicariously soaked up through my mom), SMART, then onto Moderation Managment, and then WFS. I've belonged to a few forums. I use nutrition and exercise, along with yoga and meditation. I read everything I can... I would call myself a lifelong learner, and I'm college educated as well. I have a high IQ... even though AA'ers would say it's a hindrance, I thank God/Higher Power/or my genetics for blessing me with that... because had it not been for my intelligence and determination to succeed, a few tragic events in my life probably would have wiped me out entirely... I'm stubborn as well and my perseverance alone might be my biggest asset.

I've been sober for 8 months once, 30 days, 20 days, 11, and presently I'm 8 days sober. However, I do know I'm now sober for good (knock on wood... I'm not perfect).

You could say "my way" is a combination of programs along with a "stepped" approach.
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Old 07-05-2011, 04:14 PM
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Originally Posted by SoberJennie View Post
Nice. What wisdom. And ultimately uninspiring... The lesson here seems to be once the downtrodden get sober via AA they'll sometimes wear AA blinders forever...
Honestly I hope someday you will be comfortable enough to look back here and see how you have read into this what is not being said at all. At any rate, I know 10 years ago I sounded almost identical to you, and as yeahgr8 said, so do I, my 10 year younger self would have told me to go **** myself with a lot less tact than you have.

I will say that hopefully things work out differently for you and you never have to see the side of this disease that I have lived this past decade. Because no matter what you believe in or not, know this: if you have a problem with booze, it gets exponentially worse for as long as you are still drinking. Whatever your decision is, and whatever program suits your needs and requirements, do the work and we'll see you on the other side

In the meantime, there is a great article on AA you can read here 12 Steps to the 12 Steps | The Fix

It's from an agnostic, non believing, opinionated alcoholic, and it speaks to many of the things you are belaboring here, with some very enlightening explanations on a few of the larger myths revolving around this program.

Good luck.
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Old 07-05-2011, 04:20 PM
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Originally Posted by binderdonedat
Because no matter what you believe in or not, know this: if you have a problem with booze, it gets exponentially worse for as long as you are still drinking.
I took a drawn out (although well researched) stepped approach to arrive where I'm at presently.... and this is my latest revelation. I do know this is true for me. So, if we can agree on anything, it's this.

Peace.
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Old 07-05-2011, 04:37 PM
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Originally Posted by SoberJennie View Post
I took a drawn out (although well researched) stepped approach to arrive where I'm at presently.... and this is my latest revelation. I do know this is true for me. So, if we can agree on anything, it's this.

Peace.
Well that is nothing short of Uber-awesomeness, and in the end, whether it's this program or that, it all starts with the awareness of how much drinking can harm you.

My hopes are for your success, truly. BTW that's a real cutey-pie you have as a profile photo.
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Old 07-05-2011, 04:41 PM
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Originally Posted by binderdonedat View Post
Well that is nothing short of Uber-awesomeness, and in the end, whether it's this program or that, it all starts with the awareness of how much drinking can harm you.

My hopes are for your success, truly. BTW that's a real cutey-pie you have as a profile photo.
Ava says "thanks" You can see more of her pin-ups on my profile page in the "My Cats" album
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Old 07-05-2011, 05:32 PM
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Originally Posted by SoberJennie View Post
"my way" is working well.
Jennie, I have no desire whatsoever to beat you up or hinder you from finding your own path. I really hope you do. Is it possible that, in 5-6 years of research and a shelf full of recovery books that hasn't resulted in lasting sobriety, your way is perhaps not working very well? I'll leave it at that.
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Old 07-05-2011, 05:54 PM
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Originally Posted by SoberJennie View Post

I've been sober for 8 months once, 30 days, 20 days, 11, and presently I'm 8 days sober. However, I do know I'm now sober for good (knock on wood... I'm not perfect).
From your post, I can't help but see some progression in your relapse rate. I might add something similar happened to me, just before I changed my mind about AA.
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Old 07-05-2011, 05:56 PM
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LOL, well Boleo was it that easy to spot?? Just so you know, I was moderating during that time...

Why obviously didn't work, and that's why I'm sober now.
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