Siciliano

So here is my story:

I'm 23, I started drinking, and binge drinking, with friends in one of my friends basements when I was 16. I grew up in a suburban Midwest city of 25,000ish with not much to do, so when we were bored, going to a school sporting event, dance, etc, we drank.

I got into college, and anywhere from 1-3 to sometimes 4 nights a week we'd be out somewhere, a bar, a house party, wherever. When I drink, I drink a lot. I don't sit on the couch watching the game with my buddies and just have 1 or 2, I'll have 8 and get drunk. That's just how we all were. At one point my junior year summer of college, I got drunk 40 days in a row. We had season tickets to Brewer's baseball games and, if there was a game (6 to 7 days a week, so basically daily), we tailgated. If you're not familiar with tailgating, it's basically cooking up brats and burgers and drinking before the game. After the game it would be 10PM, we'd go out to the bars. We always had some reason to go out drinking, and it was always a social reason, so I never thought twice.

After graduation, I moved to Chicago as I got a corporate position, and took a job bartending on weekends (I bartended all through college). Our bar closed at 1 or 2 depending on the night, but bars are open until 4-5AM there, so the staff always ended up going out. I found myself drinking 3 nights a week again, and when I left the position to return to grad school this past December, I had 2 months before I started classes in early February.

With the months off, I first had Christmas parties, and my friends threw me a welcome home party. Then came New Years. I left on Jan. 3rd and took a two week vacation to Aspen, CO to snowboard. In Aspen, after the lifts close, they have this tradition called Apres Ski (After Ski), where it's happy hour and everyone gets drunk, then everyone naps, wakes up and goes out all night. After Apsen, I continued my vacation with two weeks in Vegas. I went to clubs and pretty much drank all day every day. The week I got home, the Packers were in the NFC Championship vs the Bears, and then the Superbowl came. Parties all week. Basically, I had been drinking nearly every day for about 3 months straight, and mixed with the year in Chicago, was drinking pretty heavily overall for awhile. Way more than I usually did.

So, a few days before I start classes, I take one of the breaks from booze I had always taken with ease in the past. 3 weeks, a month, 2 months. I was an athlete in both high school and college, and when the season would start I would just give up alcohol to detox, drop some weight and return to my usual great shape.

Except this time was different. My hands had this constant slight shake to them when I would try to write. I got headaches, threw up, would sweat at night, and got a fever. I couldn't sleep well, my heart rate was always high, I swear my heart was beating out of my chest. My mind would race, it was hard to really think things out. I have a photographic memory, and I couldn't clear my mind on a regular basis to use it. I work with numbers, and my short term memory was noticeably off in remembering calculations.

I panicked. I called my cousin who is a pediatrician. I told him everything, and since he knew I never EVER got hang overs my entire life, was concerned because I was showing signs of mild-moderate alcohol withdrawal. After a week I was OK, and didn't drink for two months. I had lingering headaches, but besides that I pretty much forgot about it, slept normal again, etc.

My sister got married in Hawaii in mid April and we were there for two weeks. I, and everyone in the wedding party, was pretty much partying the whole time. We drank every day. When I got home three weeks ago, the day after, on came the symptoms again. This time they were worse, and a lot harder to handle. All the symptoms I mentioned, plus I swear I was seeing stuff late at night, which made the insomnia even worse. In a week and a half I was sleeping normal again, and its been three weeks as of today and I feel great again, besides these damn headaches.

Some useful information, my father left me and my family when I was young, and he died at 51 from liver cirrhosis (he was an alcoholic).

When I factor all this in, genetics, these symptoms, my own research, I get worried. I have never had cravings for the alcohol, but when my cousin/doctor starts to use words like "be careful, your body is showing signs of alcohol dependence", I go crazy. It has never been anything more than a social thing for me, and my problem has always been taking it too far, always having alcohol as part of the social equation. I wonder if this behavior has gotten me to the point of no return. I am afraid to ever binge drink again because I am wondering if my body, mind, whatever, can handle it. I refuse to ever go through those withdrawal symptoms again, twice was enough.

Any suggestions or feedback? I have plans to not drink through May, June, and part of July when my birthday hits and I know there will be a party. Did I damage my body and mind with binge drinking to the point that maybe I should rethink this and give up alcohol for a very extended period of time, or maybe indefinitely? Or am I over thinking this whole thing and those symptoms were my body tell me to take it easy?

I don't know, just looking for answers, I googled a lot of things looking for them and this site kept popping up. A real life answer rather than an article to read sounds like a better idea to me, any feedback is appreciated.

artsoul

Welcome Siciliano - Your symptoms were classic for alcohol withdrawal and you have reasons to be concerned.

I could go without alcohol for periods of time, too, but once I started drinking I always wanted to keep going ("just one more and then one more and.....").

I'm glad you're here and thinking about your issues with drinking. Getting support is really crucial to anyone working on staying sober.

Siciliano

Thanks art for the response.

Yea, that's what I'm wondering. The extended periods of drinking I've ever had have always been brought on by some type of event, and me choosing to always add alcohol to it. What I am wondering is what happens if I go out for drinks with my sister or friends, or whoever, and wake up the next morning with those damn withdrawal symptoms? Or, as you say, it progresses into something I can no longer control?

These are the things that worry me. I have always been in control, and I feel like when I got hit with that withdrawal (then got hit again), and had lingering mental effects, that I am slowly losing control. I keep reading that alcoholism is progressive, and to use an analogy, if the train I'm on is riding on those tracks, I'm jumping off of it now.

Zencat

Welcome to SR Siciliano.

When drinking started to cause emotional/mental/physical health problems for me, I began working an addiction treatment program. With with some sober time the symptoms of alcohol abuse/dependance begun to subside. Also my treatment plan addressed, all the problematic emotions like worry, agitation, restlessness, guilt and what have you that is a bummer.

After a wile I was feeling hopeful and committed to recovering from alcoholism. What I needed was to develop a new way of living addiction free. So far my treatments are working and life has become a whole lot simpler and way more enjoyable.

So welcome to a better life alcohol free.

checkmate1

Welcome to SR......

The symptoms you are describing are of alcohol withdrawal.......It will only get worse as time goes on. You might take a few months off and return to drinking in a similar manner and the withdrawal symptoms will just return with a vengeance. Alcoholism is a progressive disease and the longer you're drinking it just gets worse and worse. Once your dependent on that drink to stop the shaking that's we're hell begins.

The only way you can live a healthy life once dependent on alcohol is to abstain........

CarolD

Welcome to our Alcoholism Forum....

You are wise to be concerned...alcohol is a liquid toxin
and yes...it does effect everyone who drinks it.

You might find this interesting.....

Alcohol Chemistry and You

Bikeguy

Sounds like classic withdrawal symptoms to me, the bad part is the longer you keep drinking the worse and longer they will get. I was to the point I was having daily withdrawal which I "fixed" by drinking during the day. Believe me that is no way to go through life. Do yourself a favor and stop now, the sooner the better. Don't mess around with detox either, please consult a doctor as it can be dangerous. Take care of yourself and good luck.

Oh, it is possible to have fun on your birthday without drinking, try it once you might be pleasantly surprised.

Siciliano

Well, I will never drink like that again. If I have some type of event like that (wedding trip, etc), I just need to take it easy. The thing is, I'm really close with my family (there are 8 of us, 5 girls, 3 guys, ranging from 23 to 38, two sets of twins). I have a twin sister, and when we plan our birthday its always something like a cruise on the river, where there is alcohol (otherwise known as a booze cruise), a trip to Vegas, a ride down to Chicago. I would basically become the DD on my own birthday if I didn't drink, or have to tell me sister that because I'm not drinking this year I'm not coming. She would accept and support that, but that would suck to miss time out with her.

I guess I am going to experiment. I haven't drank in nearly a month, and it's not like when I drink I wake up and feel the need to have a drink at 9am. I only drink when I'm out, but I do admit I drink way too much and basically abuse it. If I wake up the next morning and have even an inkling of a withdrawal symptom anywhere close to what I went through, I guess for my own health and safety it will be time to just give it up.

That's my question, and maybe I'll have to bring that up with my doctor. Can I get drink every once in awhile and, if I do, still have to suffer through withdrawal, or was the withdrawal a result of a few months or abusing alcohol? Because what happened this past few months was not my normal behavior. Yes I drink, and probably too much than what is healthy, but I never have drank that much over that long of time.

Boleo

Simple answer - if "I refuse... ever again" works for you, you are not alcoholic.

LillieB

Siciliano, Just a quick note. Be very wary when someone who does not know you makes a judgement about your situation based on a 4 word sentence. There is not a soul on this board whom can judge your situation based on 3 posts and anyone who has the audacity to should be warned that they are not doctors. I understand the damage that binge drinking has on ones body and mind and did quit years ago because of it. You are not alone in your thinking.

Bouleversee

Hey Siciliano,

I don't know the answer to your question about whether you could avoid withdrawal by permanently cutting back on your drinking, but it's definitely a smart idea to talk to your doctor about this. To echo what others have said, alcohol withdrawal usually gets worse each time you go through it, and if you were to experience withdrawal symptoms again, it's possible they could be life threatening.

If you want to read more about binge drinking and withdrawal, I'd recommend Googling "Kindling in Alcohol Withdrawal" by Howard C. Becker and "Cognitive and emotional consequences of binge drinking: role of amygdala and prefrontal cortex" by David N. Stephens and Theodora Duka, which goes into the mental impairment multiple withdrawal episodes can cause (sorry, I'd give you the links, too, but my post count isn't high enough to put links in messages).

Another thing to think about if you're debating whether to quit or not: just because you don't crave a drink at 9am and only drink at social occasions, doesn't mean you're not an alcoholic/don't have a problem. I'm not saying you *are* an alcoholic (I really don't know--only you can be the judge of that), but I think it's a dangerous myth that socially acceptable drinking and problem drinking are mutually exclusive, because they're not. They often go hand in hand, especially in circles full of heavy social drinkers.

Also, it seems like you can quit drinking when you want, but can you moderate when you want? Once you start drinking at a social outing, can you stop drinking after a couple drinks/before you're drunk or are you unable to stop until you're drunk? Additionally, does your social drinking ever lead to negative things happening, blackouts, etc.?

Anyway, with all of that said, I actually relate a lot to what you've written, and am in a similar situation to you with my drinking right now. I'm also in my 20s (I'm 25); I also enjoy drinking heavily, but have (so far) always been able to go back to abstaining/moderating for long periods of time; and there is also alcoholism in my family which I'm sure means I have a genetic propensity for it. I've never experienced withdrawal symptoms, but I've started to notice other red flags that have made me wonder whether I should jump off the train now, as you put it, rather than wait for it to reach its destination.

Which is irrelevant to your situation, but I guess I just wanted to say, for what it's worth, that I understand the position you're in of being young and not wanting to screw over your health while also not wanting to miss out on the fun of social drinking--and feeling like you don't have enough "evidence" to make your final decision one way or the other. I'm not really in a position to give advice (which of course I say after I just finished giving you advice, lol)--some of the things I said to think about are things *I'm* still mulling over, to no avail--but there was something about your post that struck a chord for me and compelled me to say something.

I hope you can get something from the responses you've received on this board, and even if you can't, best of luck to you. Take care of yourself, and update us on how things go, if you can. (Also, feel free to PM me if you ever need to talk more about this with someone.)

Siciliano

In reference to the first part I bolded, you are correct, and as I consider myself an intelligent person, I began to notice this with myself and am really looking into that in my own life.

As for the second bold, I'm not really sure how to answer that, can I? Yes. Do I? No, usually not. I guess just answering that question made me do about the 10th double take since I've read the responses on these forums.

And yes, three weeks and some odd days since I last drank, my brother's girlfriend is turning 21 tonight, he called me twice already asking if I'm going and it's only 10:30 AM. I really don't want to sit on this any longer, I was going to wait until July to drink anything again (my Mom and Dad are from Gioioso Marea, Sicily, wine is on the table for every meal since I was young, and when I turned down wine when I came over for Easter and Mother's Day they were wondering what was wrong, haha) but I guess the experiment begins tonight, all I want to know is, were the withdrawal symptoms a result of the extended drinking that I don't normally do, or will they come back after one day? If they do, than I'm done, simple as that. I can't go through that again, it was horrible.

I'll let you know how that goes, and thanks for the response and insight.

Siciliano

Thanks Lillie.

Siciliano

*An edit to the second bolded part, I didn't answer all the questions.*

As for the second bold, I'm not really sure how to answer that, can I? Yes. Do I? No, usually not. I guess just answering that question made me do about the 10th double take since I've read the responses on these forums. Do I blackout? Never, I never drink to the point of blacking out. Have negative things happened? Well, yea, I got a DUI when I was 21, besides that I can't really say anything really bad happened, but yea that really sucked.

I think a big part of what I am struggling with is the culture of where I'm from. I grew up in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, where there, and the state as a whole has the most bars and taverns per capita than anywhere in the country. And, speaking of DUI's, the laws are very lax here because of the culture. When I moved to Chicago, I had a conversation with a co worker about the DUI laws, and there it is a misdemeanor on the first one, and a felony on the third one. In Wisconsin, the first is a municipal ticket, equivalent to a speeding ticket, the second is a misdemeanor, and the FIFTH is a felony. We are the only state with anything close to those laws, and we were the last to bring the DUI blood alcohol level down from .10 to .08.

So is there something wrong with me, the culture here, both, or neither? I think sometimes I am wayyyy too analytical.

Zebra1275

Welcome to SR, Siciliano.

I don't know if you are an alcoholic, only you can answer that question, but your drinking is heavy in my opinion.

So, your father died at 51 from liver cirrhosis, what do you think his drinking was like when he was 23?

Alcoholism is very progressive, and if you are having withdrawal symptoms at 23, what will these symptoms look like when you are 33 if you keep drinking the way you do? Or at age 43? Or at age 51?

Siciliano

Very good point across the board, if I haven't made it clear, I am in a stage where my conscience, intelligence, and behavior are all colliding to make me question what the heck is going on.

And yes, I don't doubt that my drinking is heavy, or healthy, I am trying to figure out if it is over "the line", past a phase (college, etc), and into something more. Like I said, I've always been in control, but when the withdrawal symptoms came I really started to question that control and began looking into things, like I said, based on genetics, etc.

As for my father, although he left when I was young, I've heard many stories. He used to drink gin and tonic, and when noon hit, he had to have a drink. Do I know much about his drinking habits at 23, 33 etc, no, but I understand the genetic link to alcoholism is something I need to pay attention to. Also, I am paying attention to anything that I find to be progressive, I haven't seen anything yet.

As always, thank you for your feedback, it helps more than you know.

TwelveSteps

Please google "kindling and alcohol." See if it rings a bell. Here is a place to start:

http://pubs.niaaa.nih.gov/publicatio...22-1/25-34.pdf

GG

Eddiebuckle

Siciliano,

The one thing that struck me about your post was the sense that you suspect it might be how you drank that may have caused the symptoms, and that had you drank in a different fashion you would have never experienced them. I am not a Dr, but given your symptoms and fathers history, its quite possible that no matter how you drank, you would ultimately end up in the same place.

Your cousin is right - you really need to be careful. If you are an alcoholic, this is a one way street. You can stop many times in your drinking career, but you never turn back the clock or undo the progress of the diease. The fact that you are experiencing neurological symptoms should be a huge red flag. Seizures and worse occur with alcohol withdrawal for some, you may well be one of the unfortunate in that regard.

At the end of the day, you and you alone will have to decide how to proceed.

grateful101010

Some people are destined to die young because they inherited a fatal disease for which there is no treatment or cure.

You inherited a fatal disease from your father. You had a 50% chance of it (50% of the male children of male alcoholics are alcoholics. ) There's no cure, and there is only one treatment - abstinence from alcohol.

Bouleversee

So how'd the experiment go? Hope you're okay!

The rest of this response will probably be moot if you've decided to quit, but if you're still waffling ...

... a second experiment you could do is to see if you can moderate consistently. I don't want to undermine what other people have said about quitting completely, since abstinence is always the safest option and trying to moderate (if you really are an alcoholic) can be like playing with fire. But, if you're not convinced that you need to quit, trying to stick to moderation can reveal a lot about your drinking that you might not have realized before (since generally, alcoholics can take extended breaks from alcohol, like what you've been doing, but alcoholics can't permanently moderate).

Doing the moderation experiment is where I'm at right now with my drinking. I've found that I *can* do it (I've stuck to 1-3 drinks per week for a little over 5 months now), but though it isn't hard, per se, I've also found that it's often really not as enjoyable as drinking too much. I still miss heavy drinking and frequently find myself thinking, "Well, maybe in a few months I can go back to it ..." which is worrisome, since that kind of thinking would be considered having a mental obsession with drinking (a big component of alcoholism). That's one of the main things that's been making me think I should just quit. And I wouldn't have realized that had I not tried to cut back on my drinking.

Anyway, again, I'm not trying to promote moderation as a long-term solution to a drinking problem, especially since there are so many stories of alcoholics who drank heavily in their youth, moderated for 10-15 years, then slid into full-blown alcoholism. But if you're thinking of continuing to drink anyway, attempting moderation could be illuminating.