NA vs AA
AAudrey
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Stamford, CT
Posts: 209
Originally Posted by Dee74 
When you make statements like these Audrey
I feel an urge to offer a clarifying counter statement for the sake of others reading. Character flaw #5463
Whether you feel alcohol is a drug in the AA/NA context is one thing...arguing generally it's not a drug at all or not addictive would be something else.
returning you now to your previous programme....
D
I feel an urge to offer a clarifying counter statement for the sake of others reading. Character flaw #5463
Whether you feel alcohol is a drug in the AA/NA context is one thing...arguing generally it's not a drug at all or not addictive would be something else.
returning you now to your previous programme....
D
So, there's your information for your paper. As you can see, according to the general consensus, there's no difference between the two. Our traditions don't REALLY matter to the cross-addicted. the AND A ADDICTS are the majority in AA and they, as you can see, hijack the meeting. It's their way or the highway. There is no understanding on their part that I never exposed myself to drugs. I drank. I went to bars and had fun and drank. Yep, when I'm thirsty I drink!
Leave the twinkies out of it.
A work in progress
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 16,633
Audrey,
I totally agree that the focus should be on alcohol. I'm not cross-addicted, but all kinds of things in our environment affect our alcoholism. Yes, our parents (genetics and environment), our formative experiences, our jobs, our intimate relationships, our lifestyle in general. And for some people, that includes drugs. To leave it out of a story, when you are the speaker, is, IMO, leaving out an important piece. You don't dwell on it, but if it affected your alcoholism, it is part of your story and is appropriately shared.
Winding up in jail isn't part of every alcoholic's story. But for those who spent time there, it is.
Mentioning it in passing does not hijack the meeting. Traditions DO matter. I happen to think that doesn't violate the Traditions. If you are not focusing on the drugs, and are focusing on the alcoholism, you are fulfilling the PRIMARY PURPOSE.
I totally agree that the focus should be on alcohol. I'm not cross-addicted, but all kinds of things in our environment affect our alcoholism. Yes, our parents (genetics and environment), our formative experiences, our jobs, our intimate relationships, our lifestyle in general. And for some people, that includes drugs. To leave it out of a story, when you are the speaker, is, IMO, leaving out an important piece. You don't dwell on it, but if it affected your alcoholism, it is part of your story and is appropriately shared.
Winding up in jail isn't part of every alcoholic's story. But for those who spent time there, it is.
Mentioning it in passing does not hijack the meeting. Traditions DO matter. I happen to think that doesn't violate the Traditions. If you are not focusing on the drugs, and are focusing on the alcoholism, you are fulfilling the PRIMARY PURPOSE.
High on Life
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Been to Hell and Back
Posts: 1,157
Originally Posted by Spirit08
bye oscar!
So, there's your information for your paper. As you can see, according to the general consensus, there's no difference between the two. Our traditions don't REALLY matter to the cross-addicted. the AND A ADDICTS are the majority in AA and they, as you can see, hijack the meeting. It's their way or the highway. There is no understanding on their part that I never exposed myself to drugs. I drank. I went to bars and had fun and drank. Yep, when I'm thirsty I drink!
Leave the twinkies out of it.
So, there's your information for your paper. As you can see, according to the general consensus, there's no difference between the two. Our traditions don't REALLY matter to the cross-addicted. the AND A ADDICTS are the majority in AA and they, as you can see, hijack the meeting. It's their way or the highway. There is no understanding on their part that I never exposed myself to drugs. I drank. I went to bars and had fun and drank. Yep, when I'm thirsty I drink!
Leave the twinkies out of it.
You say that there is no understanding on your part, that you never exposed yourself to drugs, you drank. But what about someone else in the meeting, maybe they had that experience and benefited from someone mentioning it. Unless you have your own personal AA group, you are not the only member there and other people's thoughts and feelings matter too.
Anyway, this wasn't the purpose of this thread, it was to get people's general thoughts about subtle differences between the two. I'm sorry that you feel that your AA meetings are being hijacked, but that's probably the same way I feel about you hijacking my thread and griping about how addicts are ruining your AA meetings.
I'm done with my paper, so it really doesn't matter anyway, can't we all just get along
Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,947
Well these discussions often get edgy... differences between NA and AA, and they are different... and of course AA's primary purpose...
It's all good, we need voices like Audrey's... AA is doing something right and has been for, what, 75 years... I honestly believe that nearly any subject is OK at AA, as long as it relates to a problem with alcohol and... that a person's share should have a message of hope and how they recovered, from alcoholism, using the the program of AA.
It's all good, we need voices like Audrey's... AA is doing something right and has been for, what, 75 years... I honestly believe that nearly any subject is OK at AA, as long as it relates to a problem with alcohol and... that a person's share should have a message of hope and how they recovered, from alcoholism, using the the program of AA.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Ireland
Posts: 1,641
Mark's little message at the bottom always stops me in my tracks.
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle"
There is a man at one of my meetings who kind of scolds people for not attending meetings. He is so convinced of this, you can hear it in his voice. He also sometimes borders on blaming relapses on the person who is just not trying!
This upsets me, because, I really am trying! We don't all "get it" immediately.
My point however is not that. He is so kind! Always the first to check up on me. Always encouraging. I am truly fond of him. He simply does not want us (newbies) to be complacent or to suffer as he did.
I know this is why he does this. He is not really interested in the complexities of the story, just wants us to "sober up already!"
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle"
There is a man at one of my meetings who kind of scolds people for not attending meetings. He is so convinced of this, you can hear it in his voice. He also sometimes borders on blaming relapses on the person who is just not trying!
This upsets me, because, I really am trying! We don't all "get it" immediately.
My point however is not that. He is so kind! Always the first to check up on me. Always encouraging. I am truly fond of him. He simply does not want us (newbies) to be complacent or to suffer as he did.
I know this is why he does this. He is not really interested in the complexities of the story, just wants us to "sober up already!"
Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 218
I have been thinking about this a lot after reading everyone's responses. I flipped my 12&12 open to pages 142-143 and found the best answers I could find as to whether or not drug addicts should be welcome in our meeting.
Interestingly, these debates have been going on since AA began. I know I can benefit by asking myself, "What would the Master do?" (12&12, Page 143).
Interestingly, these debates have been going on since AA began. I know I can benefit by asking myself, "What would the Master do?" (12&12, Page 143).
Not again
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Central NY
Posts: 1,139
Ummm...
AA; 1 hour
NA; 1 1/2 hours
AA Big Book 575 pgs
NA Book 290 pgs
AA; 12 steps
NA; 12 steps
AA; Promises relief only from alcohol, but attended by some addicts
NA; No promises, attended by addicts some who suffer from alcoholism
AA; used to encourage working with others
NA; stresses meetings and sponsors
AA; now follows NA
IMHO
Larry
AA; 1 hour
NA; 1 1/2 hours
AA Big Book 575 pgs
NA Book 290 pgs
AA; 12 steps
NA; 12 steps
AA; Promises relief only from alcohol, but attended by some addicts
NA; No promises, attended by addicts some who suffer from alcoholism
AA; used to encourage working with others
NA; stresses meetings and sponsors
AA; now follows NA
IMHO
Larry
Right Where I am Suppose to be
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 380
Who in AA or NA can afford to look down on one another For God sake , its not as if we can afford to judge anyone, & those that do cant be on much of a programme. In Ireland NA is for narcotics & AA is for alcohol simple as that.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: nj
Posts: 541
Originally Posted by TheEnd
Hey guys, I'm in the process of writing a paper comparing AA and NA for my Treatment and Substance Abuse class, and I was wondering if you guys could help me out with any differences that you noticed
Like for instance, I seem to find more AA meetings readily availabe and NA seems to comprised of much younger members.
Things like that, thanks in advance...
Like for instance, I seem to find more AA meetings readily availabe and NA seems to comprised of much younger members.
Things like that, thanks in advance...
Member
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: nj
Posts: 541
Originally Posted by Hollyanne
IMO, to exclude drugs from AA would probably exclude half the members at this stage.
Id!
Id!
Not again
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Central NY
Posts: 1,139
Is it just me, or was the topic- what are the differences between AA & NA. Seems it's digressed into why some "pure" alcoholics resent the dualy addicted from attending the meetings. When it clearly states "the only reqiurement for membership is a DESIRE to stop drinking"
Not to mention I thought most meetings requested that the discussions be confined to our problems relating to(read caused by) alcohol. Sharing our experience, strength and hope. Usually "drunk-a-logs" are frowned upon, so I can't see why detailed drug escapades would be tolerated.
I have a life long friend, who was a raging, beligerent, sloppy, falling down drunk, who also smoked marijuana. He now has 3yrs sober thanks to AA.had he been excluded from attending I believe he would be dead by now. Thankfully the meetings in my area are a bit more tolerant of others misgivings.
Larry
Not to mention I thought most meetings requested that the discussions be confined to our problems relating to(read caused by) alcohol. Sharing our experience, strength and hope. Usually "drunk-a-logs" are frowned upon, so I can't see why detailed drug escapades would be tolerated.
I have a life long friend, who was a raging, beligerent, sloppy, falling down drunk, who also smoked marijuana. He now has 3yrs sober thanks to AA.had he been excluded from attending I believe he would be dead by now. Thankfully the meetings in my area are a bit more tolerant of others misgivings.
Larry
Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Northern California
Posts: 204
Apologies to the OP, as this doesn't relate to your paper, but since you said it was already done, I'll chime in on that other thing.
I can relate to Spirit's anger. I live in a town where drugs, esp meth are prevelant and sometimes I have felt like I didn't belong in an AA meeting because I had no drug stories to tell. In a particulary cranky mood, I once said in a meeting that my name was ___and I was JUST an alcoholic. I got over it for a while, then travelled to Australia for two months where I never heard drugs mentioned in meetings and when I got back it was bugging me again.
I've talked to my sponsor about this and I came to realise that what is really upsetting me has nothing to do with respect for AA's traditions. My issues with people who have used drugs are all about me. Namely- and yes this is hilarious- I feel like they're cooler than me. I wasn't reckless or a law breaker when I was young but really wished I was. The kids who did drugs in school didn't include me, I wasn't cool enough and I am still carrying around that resentment.
I'm not saying anyone else's feelings are based on the same thing, but maybe some personal investigation is warranted.
I can relate to Spirit's anger. I live in a town where drugs, esp meth are prevelant and sometimes I have felt like I didn't belong in an AA meeting because I had no drug stories to tell. In a particulary cranky mood, I once said in a meeting that my name was ___and I was JUST an alcoholic. I got over it for a while, then travelled to Australia for two months where I never heard drugs mentioned in meetings and when I got back it was bugging me again.
I've talked to my sponsor about this and I came to realise that what is really upsetting me has nothing to do with respect for AA's traditions. My issues with people who have used drugs are all about me. Namely- and yes this is hilarious- I feel like they're cooler than me. I wasn't reckless or a law breaker when I was young but really wished I was. The kids who did drugs in school didn't include me, I wasn't cool enough and I am still carrying around that resentment.
I'm not saying anyone else's feelings are based on the same thing, but maybe some personal investigation is warranted.
High on Life
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Been to Hell and Back
Posts: 1,157
Originally Posted by Ninsuna
Namely- and yes this is hilarious- I feel like they're cooler than me. I wasn't reckless or a law breaker when I was young but really wished I was. The kids who did drugs in school didn't include me, I wasn't cool enough and I am still carrying around that resentment.
I'm not saying anyone else's feelings are based on the same thing, but maybe some personal investigation is warranted.
I'm not saying anyone else's feelings are based on the same thing, but maybe some personal investigation is warranted.
AAudrey
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Stamford, CT
Posts: 209
Never said I was intolerant peeps; never said I a pure alcoholic either. Not one to get defensive, however, the purpose of my posts was to shine the light on the fact that REMEMBER, WE DEAL WITH ALCOHOL, cunning, baffling, powerful! NEWCOMERS NEED TO IDENTIFY WITH ALCOHOL and if you're a DRUG ADDICT TOO you need a desire to stop drinking. The speakers here don't just MENTION drugs. It's so bad that I once said, OUR PRIMARY PURPOSE IS TO STAY OUT OF THE BATHROOM AND AWAY FROM MEDICINE CABINETS.
Drugs do what they're supposed to do and are an entirely different animal. Drugs are OBVIOUSLY addictive and there are NORMIES out there who can drink alcohol SAFELY. Who smokes crack safely? Takes herion safely? That's just stupidity IMO. Once again, there's a TREATMENT CLOUD over AA. If you want to stop DRINKING; WE can show your how. LEAVE THE TWINKIES OUT OF IT.
Drugs do what they're supposed to do and are an entirely different animal. Drugs are OBVIOUSLY addictive and there are NORMIES out there who can drink alcohol SAFELY. Who smokes crack safely? Takes herion safely? That's just stupidity IMO. Once again, there's a TREATMENT CLOUD over AA. If you want to stop DRINKING; WE can show your how. LEAVE THE TWINKIES OUT OF IT.
AAudrey
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Stamford, CT
Posts: 209
Seems to me there's a lot of judgment going on in here and intolerance; a lack of understandng and I'm not the one dishing it out. Just saying...I don't talk about my Fathers Mothers brothers sisters drinking or my ex husband's addiction when in AA. THERE'S ANOTHER FELLOWSHIP FOR THAT! AND THAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN NA AND AA. If y'all want to be narrow minded and not open to ideas other than your own, I understand. AA was never meant to be all=inclusive and the moderator posted what Bill W. wrote about UNITY AA is disunited. JUST BEING HONEST
perhaps a group concious is in order; unfortunately I'm the minority and THE CONCEPTS don't REALLY matter either in this thread.The thread is
under ALCOHOLISM.
start another in NA and let's seehow many people post comments about drinking. who goes to NA with a desire to stop drinking?
perhaps a group concious is in order; unfortunately I'm the minority and THE CONCEPTS don't REALLY matter either in this thread.The thread is
under ALCOHOLISM.
start another in NA and let's seehow many people post comments about drinking. who goes to NA with a desire to stop drinking?
12-Step Recovered Alkie
Join Date: May 2010
Location: West Bloomfield, MI
Posts: 5,797
Originally Posted by Spirit08
who goes to NA with a desire to stop drinking?
Man oh MAN I wanna answer that soooooooooo bad.....
...step away from the keyboard....step away from the keyboard.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Ireland
Posts: 1,641
Hi Spirit,
Just something to think about;
Prescription drugs ARE legal. People have surgery, and are unable to come off the "drugs" afterward.
Poitin (Putteen), is an Irish moonshine. It is ILLEGAL. It is alcohol as is moonshine, white lightening etc. It is a BIG problem in rural areas. In people who would laugh if you offered them "drugs". It has catastrophic effects. It is a generational tradition. There are people who swear by it's medicinal properties. It has been given to many a farm animal. A little for the farmer, a little for the cow!
Just thought you should think about that. Or as they would say in some places, "Put that in your pipe and smoke it!" (not crack-pipe)
Also, crack or "craic" in Ireland means "fun".
OK now I am rambling.
Just something to think about;
Prescription drugs ARE legal. People have surgery, and are unable to come off the "drugs" afterward.
Poitin (Putteen), is an Irish moonshine. It is ILLEGAL. It is alcohol as is moonshine, white lightening etc. It is a BIG problem in rural areas. In people who would laugh if you offered them "drugs". It has catastrophic effects. It is a generational tradition. There are people who swear by it's medicinal properties. It has been given to many a farm animal. A little for the farmer, a little for the cow!
Just thought you should think about that. Or as they would say in some places, "Put that in your pipe and smoke it!" (not crack-pipe)
Also, crack or "craic" in Ireland means "fun".
OK now I am rambling.
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