CarolD

tracks.....
For anyone interested in exactly what AA is about
I suggest reading the book
Alcoholics Anonymous and then decide.

Of course AA is not the only way for people to recover.
You have read our posts....you know that

Last I noticed...you were going to NA
Are you still attending?

Toronto68

Tacks, this is a philosophical question for me. (I'm not really interested in the medical one that would inevitably come up, ie, are we born that way or is it a disease and all that jazz.) And for me it doesn't matter whether I "became an alcoholic" or "have always been an alcoholic and it only became apparent later on." I think my apathy toward that question went hand in hand with my quitting and with my staying away from alcohol. I imagine that if it mattered to me, I might still be drinking. I say that because as the years of drinking went on, so did my deliberate avoiding of the drinking reality (how it was out of hand, it was every day, would it kill me, was I ever going to stop, am I really an alcoholic, blah blah). I knew there was a problem worth addressing, but I kept buying extra time. And with that kind of thinking, I would also have been able to justify to myself that maybe I wasn't really an alcoholic, because I didn't necessarily fit the bill of what an alocholic is according to my understanding or common understanding or myth. When I reached the point of quitting, there was no interest in those points of debate anymore, I had given up. There was no room left to point at any "causes" either. I owned the problem, so that I could have my hands on the solution.

From an academic perspective, it might be interesting to know what the reality is (do we become or do we simply be, always), just as it is usually interesting to know that the stars we see in the sky are not what they seem like way down here. (A twinkling star may not be - or have been eons ago - an inviting place.) But what we really feel is what we live with, and what's good for us is not sufficiently obvious to us all the time.

Do you think it's possible that your interest in whether we only become alcoholic carries with it a desire that you can evolve into a non-alcoholic - and that you can drink again? Even though you are making it clear that you are disgusted with the idea of drinking? That would be a common debate that people have with themselves, if that is the case.

Sorry if this reply is not on the same wavelength as you, and I can try harder next time if need be.

least

All I know is that I used to be a cucumber and now I'm a pickle, albeit a non-pickled one.

tmbg

I wasn't an alcoholic for most of my life. It took some major life trauma to get me to the tipping point, so to speak.

DayTrader

Millions of people, over seventy five years have witnessed tens (maybe hundreds) of millions of others, first hand, straighten out mentally and physically when the spiritual malady was overcome.

Unfortunately, we've been successfully conditioned, especially here in the US, to look for solutions that cost money, seem like the easiest route and treat symptoms before we even think about looking down the road less traveled let alone start walking it.

I've been part of both crowds and everyone is free to make up their own minds as to what to do with their life. I'm just glad I didn't have to die before I considered trying something I didn't want to do or necessarily believe in out of the gate. That was my history - if it didn't make sense I wouldn't even try it...thankfully I don't live that way anymore (much )


**Tacks, I'm sorry your thread got derailed. I think our question is a very good one and I hope you get more answers and insight into what you're seeking. From this post on, I'll stay on point in this thread.

JoeEngr

From my experience and what I learned in AA, alcoholism is progressive by nature so it may appear that one "becomes" an alcoholic. For me, I finally accepted that it didn't really matter whether I was born an alcoholic or became one, the end result was the same, and I can't un-become one .

CarolD

JoeEngr....

Welcome to our SR alcoholism Forum
Thanks for joining with us....

LexieCat

Yeah, I think I had a tendency to "overdo" from the beginning, but I KNOW I wasn't an alcoholic until I drank daily for long enough that it became what I needed to survive. Not every alcoholic is a daily drinker, and I believe those who say they were alcoholic from the first drink.

When I came into AA, I could exercise a modicum of control for discrete periods of time, but not indefinitely, nor reliably. And, for me, the most important aspect was that the thought of living without drinking was, well, unthinkable.

I think the disease (and I do believe it's a disease--or close enough to it to pass for one) manifests differently, and to a different degree, in various people. I think for everyone who is alcoholic, it gets worse, not better, over time, unless it is treated. I also think there are alcoholics who are not (yet) what the BB refers to as "real" alcoholics--I think it's an unfortunate term. The BB refers to others as "potential" alcoholics, but also suggests that AA is the place for them, as well--to recover before it reaches the point of utter disaster. I'd use the term "alcoholic" to describe anyone who cannot (and should not try to) drink normally. Some are just further along than others.

TheEnd

I don't think anyone is born an alcoholic. How can you be born addicted to something that you have never tried??? Take for instance a crack baby, now there is someone who was born that way.

Some of us might have genetic predispositions that make it easier for us to become an "alcoholic", like some of us are predisposed to heart disease or cancer, but none of that genetic makeup stuff has been concretely proven with alcohol, just a lot of theories.

wren

If you don't mind me asking: how old were you when you realized that you were an alcoholic, or thought you were? And how long have you been/were an active alcoholic?

I just find it very interesting that it took so long to develop. For most people I know, it developed rather quickly. For me also.

DayTrader

http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...ook-quote.html

LaFemme

Hi Wren...I'm not tacks but I will answer your question.

I had my first drink when I wentto college (aside from the occasional taste of my parents wine)...I drank through college in a fairly typical manner except I could not stomach beer...I was never able in my whole drinking career to get drunk on beer...I just couldn't drink it. After college I worked in NYC and abroad...I was working 80 hour weeks and drank when I went out but never to excess. Towards my late 20's it started picking up a notch and by my early 30's I had a problem. Still, I would say it was only from 32 to 38 that I was a full blown alcoholic. Sure There were a couple warning signs earlier but by no means was I even a problem drinker.

skg

When I wasn't an alcoholic I drank every day. I accepted that I was alcoholic and now I don't drink at all. Things that make you go, "Hmmmm...?"


"If you want to drink, that's your business. If you want to stop, AA can help."

DayTrader

hmmmmmmm..

good one SKG. thanks for the laugh.

Zencat

All I had to do to fit in recovery was to recognize that I had a problem, that once had me. Giving oneself the alcoholic label is all fine and good if it helps. But if labels are a hindrance to recovery, then I say forget them. For me, I understand that I have an alcohol & drug addiction. Under that one understanding I have found that it covers all the labels out there and its all I need to know about labeling oneself. The good news is that no matter what ones chooses to call their addiction, recovery is possible for even for the most hopeless cases like myself.

bubblehead

This is something that confused me as well. and I don't have an answer for you. All I can do is tell you my experience.
I drank moderately for years. Maybe one or two. I'd get "drunk" on occasion, like my birthday or New Years. For me "getting drunk" was having four or five drinks.
I was in a relationship for over 4 years before we decided to move in together. Once I moved into his house, he became very controlling. Based on everything I have read, I now believe he has Obsessive Compulsive Personality disorder. By controlling, I mean down to the fact he got mad if I chewed gum or used a certain soap or hair product. It was insane.
He forbid me from drinking any alcohol at all. He would get mad if I brought home a single beer. If he brought home beer, he would drink it and then get mad at me if I had some too, and blame me for causing him to "drink too much".
So I started sneaking around doing it. It took the edge off my anxiety. It got to be 5 or 6 a day until I scared myself and told him what i was doing. He of course insisted I quit (and constantly threw it in my face thereafter). I went to the doctor and got a prescription for a low dose of Ativan to help me deal with the anxiety. I used it minimally and did not become addicted.
He got progressively more controlling and somewhat abusive. We had several big blowup type arguments. Each time we had an argument, I would binge drink 12-18, which I have never in my life done. That happened maybe 4 or 5 times. I started going to AA.
Eventually, he started abusing my pets and then we had a fight where he threw things at me. I dialed 911 and that was the end of that. I binged one more time, then moved out.
Here's the weird thing. That was a month ago. The only time in that one month have I had a desire to drink was when I went back to get the rest of my stuff and he berated me the entire time I was packing. I did not drink, just got my stuff and left. The rest of the time, no desire to drink. No craving for alcohol. I've had plenty of stress, financially and otherwise, but it doesn't make me want to drink. The thought of fogging up my day with alcohol just isn't appealing. Its very weird, almost bizarre. I have not been going to AA or doing anything other than coming here occasionally. No Ativan or any other medication either.
So am I an alcoholic? I really don't know anymore. Maybe I was just self medicating. I was only drinking heavily for a few months. It may have been alcohol abuse rather than alcoholism. Its not going to hurt me to just leave it alone either way.

stayinsober

I say read the AA book, it don't matter when you become an alcoholic.I don't remember when I became one I just know I am now. That I can NOT drink. That's the bottom line.

Isaiah

I was just talking about my drinking history at an AA meeting yesterday...

I personally believe one can become an alcoholic.

I got a late start to drinking. I was past the legal age before I'd even touched alcohol. When I did start drinking it was of the healthy sort, a glass of wine at dinner, a few glasses of whiskey with my cousin. I was into punk music, and it's not uncommon for people at concerts/shows for people to get drunk. Here and there I'd go out and get drunk, but I feel I always intended to do what I did. Even after more than enough I could ask myself "is another one wise?" and choose to go or stop.

I consider the start of alcoholic drinking the time after a broken engagement. I was in incredible emotional pain and started medicating that with alcohol. Since I never got around to dealing with the emotions, the stuck around and I continued to drink. From there I never recovered.

I do believe my alcoholism was spontaneous and at least triggered by a personal decision to use heavily. Given my family history it's quite likely I've had underlying alcoholism my whole life, but I suspect that it was me who pulled the trigger. That's simply my own personal experience though.

Isaiah

So, so, so true. I fought way too hard and too long wondering how I became an alcoholic.

I know it was because I hoped that if I found the root cause of my alcoholism, I could fix it and then go back to drinking again.

I would have to become a scientist and make some Earth-shattering discovery, I think, to really know why it happened. The easier way IS just to accept it and look at what I'm going to do and not what I did.

reggiewayne

Thanks for posting Tacks... I'll give you my take.... There was a point when we all could moderate our drinking (most of us anyway). Alcoholism is progressive. What I have done is attempted to view alcohol just like any other drug, cocain, heroin, crack, meth, etc... Could you imagine your therapist saying to you just do meth in moderation and don't ever do it when you're unhappy. No way! Why? Because we all know that meth is a highly addictive drug that can take over your life. WELL, ALCOHOL IS THE SAME THING! It is highly addictive and very powerful, the reason you can't control your drinking is because it is overpowering you (just like it did me).

IMO, it's really not even our faults that we fall prey to booze. With all of the advertising, and peer pressure, and family members that promote booze, of course we're going to try it. For me, realizing it is a dangerous drug has been a turning point. There is no more thinking "maybe I'll just have one" because I would never say "maybe I'll just have one hit of crack, or heroin, or meth"...

Best of luck!