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Expecting others to change..or not to change..that is the question



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Expecting others to change..or not to change..that is the question

Old 08-04-2010, 10:13 AM
  # 21 (permalink)  
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Well, unfortunately, it's not a one-size-fits-all. If one spouse absolutely cannot be tempted by alcohol in the house than the spouses need to talk and work out a compromise.

My wife drinks every night and of course, I immediately take notice and am ever-so-slightly tempted to grab a beer myself, but I do not. I've been 17 days without a drink.

Each person and situation is different but I feel you have a right to request your spouse not drink if you feel so strongly about it.
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Old 08-04-2010, 10:55 AM
  # 22 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by AlcoholicOrNot View Post
Well, unfortunately, it's not a one-size-fits-all.

I completely agree. Something that works for me may not work for another person, and what works for them may not work for me.

Heck, even after 2+ years of sobriety, I still crave scotch anytime I smell it. My husband has a glass of my ex-favorite beverage about once a week, and I want it so bad. I can imagine how silky and smooth it would feel hitting the back of my throat and how it would burn my stomach. Then, I think about what would follow--hours of loud drunkenness, a lost day or perhaps a lost month. Maybe death. Certainly embarrassment to myself and those who love me. And, then, if I survived, making the decision to get sober again . . . or not. I square my shoulders and try to forget that I'd like a glass of scotch. It's getting easier and easier to convince myself that I don't.

It's hard, but I think of it as a character-building exercise. That's just what works for me, though. Another person might tell him he had to go outside to drink it. If I thought he would go outside to drink the scotch (and the beer and the wine and the top shelf tequila), I might try that. The thing is, I know he won't. And that's that.

Staying sober: that's what all of us here want. We all get there any way we can. Nothing in life is really one size fits all. You're so right about that.
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Old 08-04-2010, 11:40 AM
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I am the stbx spouse of a non-recovering alcoholic.

I think it is fine to have a boundary that you don't want to be around people drinking or alcohol; whatever you need to do to protect your sobriety. Which means that you can ban visitors drinking in your home, not go to bars, avoid that aisle in the store. What isn't reasonable is to demand that someone else change their behavior to suit you, especially in their home. Where you share a home, that makes for a problem.

I can explain the difficulties I am having with temptation, I can respectfully ask if they would consider not having alcohol in the home, if they won't (which is their absolute right) I can consider my living arrangements; staying out of the house doing an activity I enjoy when they will be drinking, keeping alcohol in a locked box out of sight if that would suffice for me, or if necessary, living separately permanently or until I am no longer tempted.
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Old 08-04-2010, 12:26 PM
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So here I sit a little more than two weeks sober and a little over a year working on recovery. Is there booze in my house? Yes there is some gawd awful homemade blackberry schnapps that was gift from a neighbor, a bottle of v/tasty gin with a few shots left in it, and an un-opened bottle of bottle of white wine my wife thinks she hid from me in the laundry room. There is also a couple of six packs of beer in the fridge at work. None of which really tempt me any more than the liquor store a block down the street or the dozen or so bars and conveince stores I pass each day.

I don’t mind if my wife drinks, of course drinking for her is a glass of wine every week or two. And I probably would not take kindly to being teased about not drinking or cajoled about into drinking, but there is a realization that we are separate people on (hopefully) parallel paths but none the less unique. As far as hanging with other people that are drinking, well that is like watching a TV sitcom, it is predictable and not near as funny as they think it is.
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Old 08-04-2010, 12:34 PM
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Originally Posted by discoveringme View Post
just was thinking about how we sometimes say that we cant expect others to change or not drink, just cuz we cannot. This sounds like it could be a great discussion!!
This reminds me of the best argument that I ever heard about AA vs religion;

In a religion, you can start off as a drunk or scoundrel, but they kind of expect you to change. LOL!
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Old 08-04-2010, 01:18 PM
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Nothing wrong with alcohol.......just me and alcohol.
many people enjoy a moderate level of drinking......like my wife.
A strange bunch of folk quite content to really have "one"....no i dont understand it either but there you go.

What others drink or not drink has nothing to do with me.......i ceased controlling others behaviour a long time ago...once i got busy with my own.

if i did ask my wife not to drink it would be for one reason and one reason only.
i resented the fact that i cant join her.......and if i did that im sure gonna drink anyhow......
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Old 08-04-2010, 02:37 PM
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I know people, and not relatives in anyway, that have lung diseases and are on oxygen. I smoke cigarettes. If I smoke a cigarette in their presents, I am endangering their life. The possibility of the tank blowing up. Oh, maybe my life too. (an after thought, because I'm involved, I'm with them.)

I love my wife very dearly. If she is trying to get sober and early in her sobriety and I drink in front of her, knowing she wants to drink, I am endangering her life, she is vulnerable and still weak and there is the possiblity that she might pick up a drink again and die from alcoholism.

I would rather be supportive to anyone that I love, family or friend, and help them, even if it means that I don't drink in front of them. I also wouldn't tease them with stories of drinking occasions.

So it is not so much what the alcoholic may expect of me, but what I would expect of myself if it is someone I love and care about.

This is a disease that is trying to kill us, there isn't any room to play any type of games with something that is life threatening.

In my own honest opinion, and alcohlic early in recovery, vulnerable and weak shouldn't have to expect or even request from a loved one, "not to drink around me and please don't keep alcohol in the house."

Maybe the individual who isn't the alcoholic can use some schooling on the disease of alcoholism.

Just my own honest opinion.

Harry
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Old 08-04-2010, 02:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Harry01854 View Post

So it is not so much what the alcoholic may expect of me, but what I would expect of myself if it is someone I love and care about.

In my own honest opinion, and alcohlic early in recovery, vulnerable and weak shouldn't have to expect or even request from a loved one, "not to drink around me and please don't keep alcohol in the house."

Maybe the individual who isn't the alcoholic can use some schooling on the disease of alcoholism.
I love this thread... it's not as relevant as it was to me when I was in early sobriety, but I have my own experience with this issue.

My wife drank around me, first day home from rehab... Did she not love me? Did she not care? Did she not understand alcoholism? Is she alcoholic herself and can't do without? Is she just selfish?

No, No, No, No, and definitely NO!

Like trucker said:

What others drink or not drink has nothing to do with me.......i ceased controlling others behaviour a long time ago...once i got busy with my own.
So.... why didn't she just stop drinking herself? Once I understood what trucker said, I quit wondering..... The answer to that question is now irrelevant because I quit asking it.... And so far, our 26 year marriage (34 year relationship) is holding up fine, despite the fact that I threw our world into turmoil just 2 years ago....

Good stuff. Thanx for this thread and all those who participate!
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Old 08-05-2010, 10:30 AM
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My husband has agreed not to bring liquor in the house (which is primarily what I drank) but nothing I say or do is going to keep him from bringing beer in the house, and I have to accept that and learn to live with it, or I could leave. If I left, I KNOW I'd drink. There is no way my recovery could withstand that sort of upset in my life. Divorce would be way more of a trigger than beer in the fridge. Or maybe if I made that big of a stink, he wouldn't bring beer home, but again, the sort of tension and resentment that would cause would endanger my recovery.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I think it would be selfish to demand he not have his beer because of my disease. He works two jobs and at the end of his really really long day he looks forward to his tv and his beer.
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Old 08-05-2010, 10:33 AM
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After reading another post by Lildawg on a very similar subject, I have to rethink my own post here. This is what lildawg posted;

"I know what you mean, Aurora. I have ignored all the booze in my house for 2+ years. I've been married to the same man for 20 years, and I know exactly how he'd react if I took the liberty of ridding our house of alcohol. I finally had to accept that it was me quitting drinking, not him. That was my first step in realizing the universe did not center around me.

Some days were incredibly hard. Many days I wished I was not married to a man who likes his drink. I got used to it, though. I think we, as humans, are adaptable creatures. Whatever doesn't kill us makes us stronger."

And then rereading what trucker posted helps me to think better about what you posted Mark75.

What has changed was about me keeping an openmind. A character defect that I continue to work on, not always succeeding. And my overeagerness, a lot of work to be done there.

I do respect these other opinions and if I do keep an an openmind, there is the great chance I might learn something new.

Although I could only hope to be the person that is my opinion, Truckers statement is so true and did shine some light on this old marblehead of mine.

I am the one that has a problem with alcohol and so it is up to me to do what is right for me, not anyone else's responsibility. Even if it means accepting and respecting the rights of others.

Practice may not make me perfect, but it should help me to stop and think before I type.

Thanks guys for all the input. Greatly appreciated.

Harry
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Old 08-05-2010, 10:36 AM
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I reconciled the issues I had my wife and her end of the night wine spritzer this way... if she were my best friend, would I demand that she not do something she enjoys very much, to close out her long day? No, I wouldn't.

Good for you Aurora, you'll be fine

Mark
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Old 08-05-2010, 10:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Harry01854 View Post

Truckers statement is so true and did shine some light on this old marblehead of mine.
Yea, he has that affect on me too...

Mark
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Old 08-05-2010, 11:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Aurora80 View Post
Or maybe if I made that big of a stink, he wouldn't bring beer home, but again, the sort of tension and resentment that would cause would endanger my recovery.
I completely agree with what you've said here. I like the words you used,too: "That big of a stink . . ." <grins>

There are times it's appropriate to make a big stink. Then, there are times when making a big stink is just going to cause a bunch of resentment. I make a point to pick my big stinks carefully. I mentally weigh what impact they're going to have on my relationship. I ask myself if I'm willing to "go there." If not, I bend with the wind and let it go.

Originally Posted by Aurora80 View Post
I can't speak for anyone else, but I think it would be selfish to demand he not have his beer because of my disease. He works two jobs and at the end of his really really long day he looks forward to his tv and his beer.
I agree with you. My husband works twelve hour days. He's outside a lot of the time, and we are well into the hottest months of year. It's not like he's going to get drunk and beat me up or say mean things. He's going to have a few beers while he watches the news. That's it. I can live with it.

Two decades of marriage has taught to carefully pick the points on which I won't compromise. This one just doesn't merit a line drawn in the sand. That said, every marriage is different. Every household is different. What works in Casa Lildawg may not work anywhere else on earth.
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Old 08-08-2010, 03:56 AM
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One of my closest friends; who is aware that I am not drinking anymore and am in a recovery program DRUNK DIALED me last nite. I could tell within 15 seconds that she had had more than a few. This is very rare for her but I still could not get off the phone fast enough. I will see her this a.m. and really feel like saying something to her about it. I mean of all the people she could have D.D'd she picked me???????? I can't help but be hurt and mad at her for calling me when she knows what is going on with me. I would not eat a huge slice of chocolate cake in front of her if she was trying to lose weight!!!
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Old 08-08-2010, 05:26 AM
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Hunt, having drunk dialed my own share of.times, I always thought the other person didn't know (wrong but true), maybe your friend didn't think you would.be able to tell?
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Old 08-08-2010, 07:29 AM
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Hunt,

Look at it this way--you got to be reminded of one more reason not to be drinking.

Go easy on your friend. You know how alcohol screws up our good judgment. If she came over to your house, sober, and proceeded to pull a bottle out of her bag and drink it in front of you, THAT would be deliberate. As it was, she was probably sufficiently impaired that she wasn't even thinking about its being a problem for you.

You might just gently tell her that it bothered you that she called you that way, and that you'd appreciate her not calling you when she's been drinking. Don't be surprised if she gets VERY defensive, though. People get defensive when their acts while intoxicated are pointed out.
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Old 08-08-2010, 08:32 AM
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Hunt, drunks are an inconsiderate lot. They're having fun, so surely everybody is going to find them terribly charming and humorous. As LaFemme said, the drunk dialer may have thought you wouldn't be able to tell she was drunk.

It's hard to tell you what to do because I don't know the relationship, or how important it is to you. For most of us, there are some friends we just lose because we no longer drink. The reason is they no longer feel comfortable around us.

I had a friend, a drinking buddy, with whom this happened. When I'd been sober about a year, she showed up at my house around Christmas/New Years, stumbling drunk with her new drinking buddy in tow. They stayed about 15 minutes. I didn't say anything negative to them, but I could tell they were just uncomfortable. I didn't speak to her again until the following October when she knocked on my door about 12:30 a.m. She was just as drunk as she'd been at Christmas/New Years. She wanted me to come to her house and meet her new boyfriend. I already had on my pajamas but was not in bed. I politely refused and didn't say a word about her condition. I have not spoken to her since.

If Drunk Dialer's call made you uncomfortable, and obviously it did, perhaps ask her why she called you. Tell her you'd appreciate her calling someone else when she's drunk . . . unless she needs a ride home or is in trouble. Judge how firm or gentle you make this request by the nature of the friendship. If it's one you're pretty sure will end anyway, go ahead and be firm. If it's one in which you think Drunk Dialer dialed without really thinking, gently try to make her think.

I hope this helps. I would be frustrated, too.

Remember: You can't control what Drunk Dialer does. You can control what you do. You always have the power not to answer the phone.
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Old 08-08-2010, 11:46 AM
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Originally Posted by discoveringme View Post

What do you all think about these situations?
IMO it is about boundaries and spiritual fitness. I had to set tight boundaries in my early days of sobriety because I was not spiritually fit enough to survive being around wet faces and wet places.

Now that I am spiritually fit, I can be around them if I have a valid reason to be there. I now view bars, restaurants that serve alcohol and wet parties as if there were a sigh out front saying "Danger - Falling Rocks".

I go into this zone to get my work done, but I don't hang around to see what will happen after that.
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Old 08-09-2010, 10:20 AM
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Thanks all...my friend and I will be ok. She rarely drinks but has an alcoholic husband who drinks day and night. I love her and have forgiven her...we all make mistakes and let's face it...I have DD'd too!!! I don't really know what happened Saturday nite but the amout of support she has given me outweighs this one "ooops" by a mile.

Besides...it DID give me yet another reason to stay sober...she sounded ridiculous!!!!! Love to my SR friends!!!
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