getr345

A few months ago I was contacted on a social networking website by an old friend who had read a posting of mine on said social networking website announcing an anniversary of my own sobriety and he asked me how I did it, could I help him... and so started a long conversation through email where I offered help, and he appeared to want the help. It felt really good and I felt like I was helping a friend in need. Months went by and he would tell me of his progress, etc, just what you would expect. We even got together once. I believed he was trying to stay sober and when he said he had 60 day, 90 days etc, I believed him, no reason not to I thought. His wife even emailed me to thank me for giving her and their family hope for him. In recent months, contact dwindled and I suspected he may have been drinking again but life just kinda goes on still I had a nagging feeling he was still in need of help and checking up on so I emailed him from time to time to encourage him etc he always seemed receptive and today was really no different. He told me today that he is the best liar in the world and if he told me the truth about his drinking I would not want to help him anymore. That he fooled me fooled his wife fooled everyone. I challenged him to tell me the truth that I could handle it and would understand it. He first told me an anecdotal story and then I asked him to tell me how he lied to me, how he fooled me.

Bombshell...

He admitted to have never stopped drinking a single day we were in touch in the past 5 months and that everything he told me was a lie, all made up. All of it. That he still drinks to excess every day, thinks nobody knows and that he really has no idea how to stop.

Thoughts, opinions please.

suki44883

Once bitten, twice shy?

atalose

It's not that he has no idea how to stop, he just hasn't decided too. He's told you the truth, believe him then decide if keeping this “friend” who lied to you then bragged about it in your life or not.

You can't help someone who doesn't want to help themselves.

getr345

So what should I do?

How should I feel, react?

What is appropriate?

suki44883

Well, we can't tell you how you should feel. You feel however you feel about it. So far as how should you react, well...what do you think? What was the first thing you thought when you read what he said?

Not knowing the guy, I don't know what is appropriate. I mean, friendship requires trust. True, he eventually came clean, but why do you think he did that?

If it's not putting you out any to continue an email friendship with him, and you still feel the desire to do so, I don't see any reason not to. You could offer suggestions, like attending AA or whatever, but I don't think I'd be able to trust him again. Is it really worth it?

Freedom1990

I can carry the message. I am not expected to carry the alcoholic.

I will say I was one of the biggest liars in the world when active in alcoholism. I was a liar too for a long time after I sobered up!

I used to get stark raving livid over people who lied after I first sobered up.

I didn't realize it at the time, but what I was seeing was a reflection of me, and you can bet your bottom dollar I did not want to acknowledge that.

I'd suggest a mini 4th and 5th step with your sponsor.

That works for me. :ghug3

suki44883

I'm not in AA, so I'll defer to Freedom on that. Sounds like she knows what she's talking about.

getr345

I feel like if he thinks he can trust me enough to come clean and I don't push him away or out him to his wife that maybe I could actually help him now when he sees I will not do that. I AM mad, I do feel manipulated and I told him I would not lie for him if his wife asked me directly, but maybe now that he has been honest with me and I'm still around he will feel he can continue to be honest with me (finally be honest with somebody about his problem)....and maybe I can help him? He apologized. He said he is literally crying out for help, and that is what I see, a cry for help...

suki44883

Then do what you can to help him.

getr345

I don't know if I really can but I can choose to continue to be his friend and offer sound advice and share my own experience etc and be there for him. I can choose to support him because he needs somebody (anybody) that understands what he is going though. Or I can choose not to. I know I cannot fix him and he's ultimately on his own but I wonder how common this type of scenario is (both in the real world and online) and what the best reaction is, my best play?

suki44883

You sound like a very good-hearted person. He is lucky to have you as a friend.

Toronto68

Get, I'm not really sure why you put it that way "best play"). You have a really clear and direct style, but are also sensitive. That's something he kind of squandered, unfortunately (I don't know how long I would put up with that). But it sounds like you are actually asking for what the best thing to say is, when your normal self already knows (right?). I guess maybe you are splitting yourself into the person with feelings and the person who wants to help? Does it make sense to tell him that he has to be honest with you and that you would be willing to help if he agrees to follow that rule? There is no guessing on this, but I am wondering if it would take him years to reach a point where he went back to the Inbox and digested just what exactly he had done to himself and the friendship all that time he was being duplicitous. I think (another guess) it would probably hurt you to leave him be and reach his own recognition, if it does not kill him first, but I don't know how much more effective you can be for him online at this point if there is not a really bonfide certitude that he is not crossign his fingers while talking to you. I honestly don't know which is the better thing for him. But the answer is somewhere earlier in this paragraph, I hope!

CarolD

Do not help him financially ..should that request be made.

When I try to help someone get sober...it helps me
usually more than it helps them....
I also have no expectations when I share with them.

I do the message...plant the seeds
how it works out is not up to me.

Hope you find peace with this situation...

Taking5

Ask him if he wants help. Weather or not you can provide help is irrelevant. His answer may indicate what type of help he is open to (AA comes to mind) or if he just wants to continue to drink.

sunrise1

Weren't we all liars, of some sort in some stage of our disease?

zoomer

They have hospital and rehabs and AA out there to help the alcoholic, along with websites like these. It's not fair to him to have him count only on you, you have to point him in the right direction. It sure would give my ego a boost it I could help every alcoholic I came in contact with all by myself. Try talking to the wife about other ways to go about helping her husband because your way is not working. I'm sure you mean well and have done some good,but you also might be stopping him from seeking help that he truly needs.

shaun00

Go figure..........a dishonest alcoholic..

do not be discouraged........he is sick
i doubt whether it felt good to lie to friends and family.

i believe ..(if he is alcoholic). .......he suffers from a grave illness of the mind and body...in short......he has NO choice.

if you can help him.......and he wants it......DO IT.
just try to put your feelings to one side.....remember he is probably slowly dying..

can you introduce him to SR???

thisisme

I respectfully disagree.
You can show them the path but they must have the internal fortitude to follow it and that desire comes from within.

getr345

Carol, I would never give him money, I'm a dupe here not a dope.

What I did give him was my friendship, my time, my caring, my understanding, my emotions, my honesty (maybe that is what I feel most betrayed about, sharing my story with him only to have him be full of ****) and I lastly I gave him my best effort & advice. I really felt there was a genuine connection there and it felt very real, it felt like I had the Midas touch or something, like all I had to do was talk with and share with an alcoholic/addict and if they were willing to help themselves, I could help them do that, that I could help an entire family in need. My true best friend, an alcoholic, quit drinking a month after I did, and I have no doubt he is stone cold sober to this day, a miracle which seems even more impressive in light of this BS situation.

As for my "best play", or what to say, or how to feel... I have already responded to him and I am feeling what I feel about it organically, I just wanted to see what people here with more experience would say is best (or normal or appropriate) so I can compare the two to get a sense of if what I did and do is proper in the eyes of those who have more experience dealing with this kind of thing. Basically, I told him I was hurt and felt duped and that he owed me an apology. He apologized. I told him I would not lie to his wife for him if she asked me directly if he ever really did stop drinking but that I would not out him on my own out of anger or to get revenge or whatever. He had asked me not to tell her. I told him I understand that alcoholics lie and why and that I could relate, that I did my share of lying and manipulating, that I get it. I told him he needs to be honest with me moving forward or I can just move on. He said he would be honest with me.

I have recommended this site in the past to him, doubt he ever followed through to check it out. I recommended AA but he claims to hate AA, says he can't relate to all these so-far gone alcoholics, which I am learning more and more he is one of. I feel so bad for his wife and kids, they are being lied to even worse and to this day and beyond. And of course he is lying to himself, and is killing himself.

It's profoundly sad and eye opening for me.

As for why he did it, I imagine he needed to buy more time at home, to protect his disease and his drinking from whatever pressure it was under, so he saw an opportunity and figured if he got in contact with me and pretended to his wife to have found (and made a unique connection with) some quit-drinking buddy-guru he could keep the lie going a few more months, continue to drink as he pleased in secret, and get people off his back for a while who might have been getting closer to the truth or closer to following though on some consequences. You see, he thinks that nobody knows he drinks constantly (I told him many in recovery come to find out that people knew and that they were fooling nobody but themselves, damn is he deep in the **** huh?) ...so maybe he figures if people thinks he quit, he could pull that off because people can't tell when he drinks anyway...

shaun00

Sometimes all you can do is stand back and let the chips fall..
Sometimes it takes more deep desperation for the mind to open a little..

Alcoholics are like whirlwinds....
I worked with a young alcoholic years ago that ended up with him stealing my tv..lol..
i was as mad as the devil after for weeks....

sometimes all we can do is pray for the still suffering..