A Question
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: europe
Posts: 624
A Question
I'd really appreciate the answer to this question, if that's something you're feel comfortable doing. If it's unappropriate from me to ask you this I appologize.
My husband is alcoholic, has been for last 7 years, never admitted having a problem, except on few rare occasions when he hit rock bottom and ended up in hospital, but denied it quickly afterwords. This spring doctors told him his liver is very damaged and he mustn't ever drink again. He was ok for a while but started drinking again. He drinks every day, but hardly ever gets totally wasted, he's functioning under infulence. During all this time I lived through the same stuff every partner of alcoholic lives through. Lies, lies, denial, non-exsistent familly life and the rest. I aslo believe he suffers from PTSD, he admits this partialy but refuses to do anything about it. 3 weeks ago I asked him to leave, and without a word he walked out, leaving me and our 2 kids. I didn't do this to provoke some reaction from him, but because I finally realized this is not life I want for myself and our kids, and he should take responsibility for his own life.
That is our story in a nutshell. So my question is:
Is it really possible, with what doctors have told him and everything, that he can't see he's an alcoholic? Is it possible to be in denial to that extent?
I'd really appreciate the answer, I understand every person is different, but opinion of people who suffer from the same problem could help me to understand, in order to get a closure (as I'm not ever going to get it from him, being married to him is like being married to a person you don't share the language with, and can't even mimic his thought and feeling) and continue with my life.
Thank you
My husband is alcoholic, has been for last 7 years, never admitted having a problem, except on few rare occasions when he hit rock bottom and ended up in hospital, but denied it quickly afterwords. This spring doctors told him his liver is very damaged and he mustn't ever drink again. He was ok for a while but started drinking again. He drinks every day, but hardly ever gets totally wasted, he's functioning under infulence. During all this time I lived through the same stuff every partner of alcoholic lives through. Lies, lies, denial, non-exsistent familly life and the rest. I aslo believe he suffers from PTSD, he admits this partialy but refuses to do anything about it. 3 weeks ago I asked him to leave, and without a word he walked out, leaving me and our 2 kids. I didn't do this to provoke some reaction from him, but because I finally realized this is not life I want for myself and our kids, and he should take responsibility for his own life.
That is our story in a nutshell. So my question is:
Is it really possible, with what doctors have told him and everything, that he can't see he's an alcoholic? Is it possible to be in denial to that extent?
I'd really appreciate the answer, I understand every person is different, but opinion of people who suffer from the same problem could help me to understand, in order to get a closure (as I'm not ever going to get it from him, being married to him is like being married to a person you don't share the language with, and can't even mimic his thought and feeling) and continue with my life.
Thank you
Member
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Boston MA
Posts: 666
While I was drinking, nobody could tell me I had a problem. I would get angry, blame others, think that my drinking was justified because og their nosy behavior.
Deep down, I knew I had a problem, but really believed that if everyone would just get off my back I'd handle it. Slowly my life started to slip away from me.
The good news is that there is hope. Somehow (I believe it was God) things changed and I was able to stop. Check around the forum here. The same is true for countless others.
Best wishes.
Mike
Deep down, I knew I had a problem, but really believed that if everyone would just get off my back I'd handle it. Slowly my life started to slip away from me.
The good news is that there is hope. Somehow (I believe it was God) things changed and I was able to stop. Check around the forum here. The same is true for countless others.
Best wishes.
Mike
Member
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 652
If the doctors told him he has bad liverdamage and he go's on drinking...
Yeah.. l would say he is lying to himself in an unhealthy way..
Wish you the best..can't be easy for you.
Those who flee temptation generally leave a forwarding address.
- Lane Olinghouse
Yeah.. l would say he is lying to himself in an unhealthy way..
Wish you the best..can't be easy for you.
Those who flee temptation generally leave a forwarding address.
- Lane Olinghouse
Laozi Old Man
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Detroit, MI
Posts: 6,665
Originally Posted by sesh 
So my question is:
Is it really possible, with what doctors have told him and everything, that he can't see he's an alcoholic? Is it possible to be in denial to that extent?
Is it really possible, with what doctors have told him and everything, that he can't see he's an alcoholic? Is it possible to be in denial to that extent?
No matter how much factual information he has about his disease, he can not fully identify with those who have it. Even if he admits he has 99% of the traits associated with alcoholics, the 1% that he sees different about himself makes him believe (delusional thinking) that he is somehow exempt from the disease.
This is why it takes a program, fellowship and mentor to help us see the truth about ourselves. No amount of text book knowledge helps in this situation.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Pugetopolis
Posts: 2,384
Originally Posted by Boleo
YES - If he has lost the "Power of Choice" in his addiction he suffers from what Addictionologists call a Blown Insight circuit. This is a form of delusional thinking that prevents the addict from connecting the dots between his disease and himself.
No matter how much factual information he has about his disease, he can not fully identify with those who have it. Even if he admits he has 99% of the traits associated with alcoholics, the 1% that he sees different about himself makes him believe (delusional thinking) that he is somehow exempt from the disease.
This is why it takes a program, fellowship and mentor to help us see the truth about ourselves. No amount of text book knowledge helps in this situation.
No matter how much factual information he has about his disease, he can not fully identify with those who have it. Even if he admits he has 99% of the traits associated with alcoholics, the 1% that he sees different about himself makes him believe (delusional thinking) that he is somehow exempt from the disease.
This is why it takes a program, fellowship and mentor to help us see the truth about ourselves. No amount of text book knowledge helps in this situation.
That is the best clinical explanation of losing the power of choice that I've ever heard.
Heathen
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: La La Land, USA
Posts: 2,567
So my question is:
Is it really possible, with what doctors have told him and everything, that he can't see he's an alcoholic? Is it possible to be in denial to that extent?
Is it really possible, with what doctors have told him and everything, that he can't see he's an alcoholic? Is it possible to be in denial to that extent?
Member
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: KC MO
Posts: 980
I knew I was an alcoholic not long after I started drinking. I wouldn't ever admit it to anyone, but I knew it. Yes there is a time I would have kep't on drinking even if I knew my liver was going downhill. WHY? (I just really don't know) Though I would never think of suicide, thats what I was on my way to doing.
I think you did the right thing by asking him leave. You say he left without a word. So perhaps he has just given up. Letting the alcohol demon just take over everything. This is without a doubt a critical time where just maybe he will quit. But it sounds like he doesn't have any fight.
If he were to quit I hope you would work with him, because this is an illness. But he is the only one that can stop it. Him and God.
Fred
I think you did the right thing by asking him leave. You say he left without a word. So perhaps he has just given up. Letting the alcohol demon just take over everything. This is without a doubt a critical time where just maybe he will quit. But it sounds like he doesn't have any fight.
If he were to quit I hope you would work with him, because this is an illness. But he is the only one that can stop it. Him and God.
Fred
Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 146
Yes, I think most people are quite much more self-aware than others give them credit for. Just because something isn't expressed, communicated, or acted upon, doesn't mean it's not understood.
That or sometimes some of us really push it to the limit. We know we're alcoholic, but we're going to push it as close to the edge as we can tolerate without falling off. Some of us think we can survive the fall even - and many do, sometimes only to go find a higher cliff.
That or sometimes some of us really push it to the limit. We know we're alcoholic, but we're going to push it as close to the edge as we can tolerate without falling off. Some of us think we can survive the fall even - and many do, sometimes only to go find a higher cliff.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: europe
Posts: 624
Thank you all for your help.
As hard as it is for me to truly comprehend this, it sounds right. It makes me feel sooo something, I can't even name that emotion... empty? sad? rezignated? probably all of it and much more... Such a shame... I guess I was secretly hoping somewhere deep down he must know it and eventually he'll work it out... not much chance for that to happen as we live in the country people don't talk openly about thier problems, and we don't have AA or anything like it, you can just have a detox in a hospital and they send you off, no counseling or anything...
I mean I'm sure I don't want to be with him anymore, as there is nothing I can do for him and being with him is destoying me, but still I care for him and wish him well, and it's such a shame, such a shame as he used to be wonderful person and for the first 5 years of our marriage the best husband one can ask for...
Thank you for making me understand it better. I wish you all well in your own struggles.
As hard as it is for me to truly comprehend this, it sounds right. It makes me feel sooo something, I can't even name that emotion... empty? sad? rezignated? probably all of it and much more... Such a shame... I guess I was secretly hoping somewhere deep down he must know it and eventually he'll work it out... not much chance for that to happen as we live in the country people don't talk openly about thier problems, and we don't have AA or anything like it, you can just have a detox in a hospital and they send you off, no counseling or anything...
I mean I'm sure I don't want to be with him anymore, as there is nothing I can do for him and being with him is destoying me, but still I care for him and wish him well, and it's such a shame, such a shame as he used to be wonderful person and for the first 5 years of our marriage the best husband one can ask for...
Thank you for making me understand it better. I wish you all well in your own struggles.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: scotland
Posts: 1,493
sesh.thank you for your posts.unfortunalty my father drank himself into an early grave (56) he was given all the warnings.in the end he died a very painful and humiliating death.you can still care for your husband from a distance but,no you cant help him.i wish you well.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southern Colorado
Posts: 1,167
Originally Posted by sesh
I can't even name that emotion... empty? sad? rezignated? probably all of it and much more... Such a shame...
What if he is such an alcoholic that he would choose this over you, the children, the home, the job, the cars, his own life...?
Booze and the alcoholic go hand in hand and are nearly inseparable, you know? But to just walk away because he can't seem to get it will affect you down the road. You may want to glance at the possibility of some codependency issues just in case or maybe learn more about what exactly alcoholism is. I take it you've seen other subforums in here such as friends and family?
Pray for him and I hope you take care of yourself.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: europe
Posts: 624
Yes, definetely the betrayal is first one on the list of all feelings I have these days, I feel abandoned and disapointed too, and than I keep switching from anger to sadness and grief and back again, I'm making baby steps and I know I'll make it, as each day I breath more...
But as I'm learning to detach from him, and looking at him as this person who's troubles are beyond my control, this person separate from me wasting his life away I mostly feel sad and emtpy, sorry for him but aslo kind a numb too...
I speak to lot of people here on Family and friends subforum, and it's helping so much. I know good days are ahead of me, but I just hope future holds something good for him too.
But as I'm learning to detach from him, and looking at him as this person who's troubles are beyond my control, this person separate from me wasting his life away I mostly feel sad and emtpy, sorry for him but aslo kind a numb too...
I speak to lot of people here on Family and friends subforum, and it's helping so much. I know good days are ahead of me, but I just hope future holds something good for him too.
Is it hot here or am I crazy?
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Planet Zirchon 9 (which is near Milwaukee, WI.)
Posts: 38
Feasability and Probability.
Hello sesh,
To address your question of, "is it possible?" I take a critical thinking view of things.
Is it Feasible? - Yes
Is it Probable? - No
If he will not listen to the advice of his own doctor, he probably won't listen to you. As others have posted, some people will go to their grave drunk. Sad but true.
If you truly love him, be available to help him if he asks. If you truly love yourself, do not allow an alcoholic to run and ruin your life. I wish you strength, peace and a drama free life.
Mrak.
To address your question of, "is it possible?" I take a critical thinking view of things.
Is it Feasible? - Yes
Is it Probable? - No
If he will not listen to the advice of his own doctor, he probably won't listen to you. As others have posted, some people will go to their grave drunk. Sad but true.
If you truly love him, be available to help him if he asks. If you truly love yourself, do not allow an alcoholic to run and ruin your life. I wish you strength, peace and a drama free life.
Mrak.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Upper Kolobia
Posts: 153
You Just Described My Brother to a "T"
He's in his early 50's; years ago when I was working treatment I recognized he had the same disease I did (I got sober in 1980), and I tried to set up an intervention to get him to treatment . . .
His then-wife decided to take matters into her own hands, and he acted out, was arrested and wound up in a psych ward. My father flew down and picked him up and put him in a unit here. He stayed three or four days . . .
I've watched 20 years of hell since then for my parents, and what still eats my lunch is that my parents slip back into the same denial and enabling every time he creates a crisis. Worse, I'm the focus of their stuff, and right now I haven't spoken to them for a month because of the way I've been treated (with accusations that I'm the one being disrespectful). I'm unapologetic for taking care of myself (they went to Al-Anon for a long time, but seemed to have missed some things along the way).
The advice about taking care of yourself is golden, and you've got my permission to leave and do whatever it takes to be truly free . . . The question is whether you'll give that permission to yourself...
It's a fatal disease . . . I wish you well, seriously . . . I don't have a lot more old-timer wisdom on this one . . .
His then-wife decided to take matters into her own hands, and he acted out, was arrested and wound up in a psych ward. My father flew down and picked him up and put him in a unit here. He stayed three or four days . . .
I've watched 20 years of hell since then for my parents, and what still eats my lunch is that my parents slip back into the same denial and enabling every time he creates a crisis. Worse, I'm the focus of their stuff, and right now I haven't spoken to them for a month because of the way I've been treated (with accusations that I'm the one being disrespectful). I'm unapologetic for taking care of myself (they went to Al-Anon for a long time, but seemed to have missed some things along the way).
The advice about taking care of yourself is golden, and you've got my permission to leave and do whatever it takes to be truly free . . . The question is whether you'll give that permission to yourself...
It's a fatal disease . . . I wish you well, seriously . . . I don't have a lot more old-timer wisdom on this one . . .
Disposable Hero
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Being, ME
Posts: 3,758
Please be careful in adjusting your life to someone who is refusing
to deal with the problems of alcoholism and self destruction. You
can only change what you can and his unwillingness to get help
isn't one of them. While people are in the grips of active drinking,
reality takes a back seat and responsibilities go out the window.
Please focus on what you can do for you & pray for guidance daily.
btw~ i think it's great that you drew a line in the sand about this!
i hope you move forward & be the best woman & mom you can be.
to deal with the problems of alcoholism and self destruction. You
can only change what you can and his unwillingness to get help
isn't one of them. While people are in the grips of active drinking,
reality takes a back seat and responsibilities go out the window.
Please focus on what you can do for you & pray for guidance daily.
btw~ i think it's great that you drew a line in the sand about this!
i hope you move forward & be the best woman & mom you can be.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: scotland
Posts: 1,493
sesh,im right in the middle of trying to disattach from my mum,shes 61 and a barely functioning alcoholic.her marbles are starting to go,luckily i live 400 miles away so the only contact most of the time is the phone.after her ranting and raving for no reason and basically losing the plot on the phone the other day i have deiced not to call for a while.she never calls me anyway and ive sort of come to the conclusion that because she is in complete denial and totally in her cups then there is nothing i can do at the moment,so why keep calling her just to come off the phone bewildered and hurt? this happened many times i know when i was drinking and the shoe was on the other foot.but i dont have to put up with it.its tough but at the end of the day ive worked d$mn hard to get to where i am just now and until my mum asks for help (if she ever does) then im just going to take a step back.for my own sanity.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: europe
Posts: 624
Thanks Charmian, I know how that must feel for you. My dad was alcoholic too. Died ten years ago at the age of 53. Never stoped drinking. His health was detoriating for years utill he finally drunk himself to grave. But living with him (he was functioning alcoholic) I never asked myself about his denial or anything like it, I just though that's the way he is, as I never really new any better. I hated him during my puberty because of it, but later on I just kind a felt sorry for him. For me family was my mum and my brother, and he was just this person who couldn't/wouldn't catch up. My mum's unconditional love and trust in me and my brother made up for almost all of his shortcomings. She never left him, but wasn't a codependant really, she just let him be, never argued with him, just got along with her life (without romantic involvement with him or anyone else), I guess she sacrified herself to her kids by not leaving him, as I figure she felt if she left him, me and my brother would suffer more...
And how about me marrying an alcoholic than? Same type of alcoholic too. I guess I could make some shrink very busy... But to my defence I can say my husband wasn't A for first 5 years of our marriage or maybe I wasn't aware of it...
So I want to give my kids life different from mine. leaving my AH feels right, and I don't second guess my decision, but honestly in all fairness I don't know which way they'll end up less damaged. It is all just sooo f***** up.
Tonight I asked my daughter (11) how she feels about her dad not living with us anymore. She said: it's same really. I asked her what does she mean. She said: He was here only to sleep at night and sometimes for lunch, so it makes no difference really.
It broke my heart.
I just feel me and my kids are sooo betrayed. Robbed of a chance of a family and healthy life. We, two of them especially, will have this burden to carry around to the rest of our lifes.
It's just so wrong. I worry about my kids so much that I feel I can't breath anymore.
And how about me marrying an alcoholic than? Same type of alcoholic too. I guess I could make some shrink very busy... But to my defence I can say my husband wasn't A for first 5 years of our marriage or maybe I wasn't aware of it...
So I want to give my kids life different from mine. leaving my AH feels right, and I don't second guess my decision, but honestly in all fairness I don't know which way they'll end up less damaged. It is all just sooo f***** up.
Tonight I asked my daughter (11) how she feels about her dad not living with us anymore. She said: it's same really. I asked her what does she mean. She said: He was here only to sleep at night and sometimes for lunch, so it makes no difference really.
It broke my heart.
I just feel me and my kids are sooo betrayed. Robbed of a chance of a family and healthy life. We, two of them especially, will have this burden to carry around to the rest of our lifes.
It's just so wrong. I worry about my kids so much that I feel I can't breath anymore.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: scotland
Posts: 1,493
yeh,mum and dad both alcoholic,swore blind i wasnt going to drink like they did,,,hhhmmm.got 7 months sober,thank God! you sound like you have aplan,its heartbreaking but you have to do what is right for you and your kids.i wish you well sesh.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: europe
Posts: 624
Thanks charmian.
I also swore never ever to be in any kind of relationship with alcoholic. So what I'm going through feels like a cruel joke life has played on me, just to prove me I have no power in that is going on in my life. But I have set my mind to prove it wrong.
I congratulate you on your sobriety, you should be very proud of yourself. I'm sure you are to stay winner here, as you broke free regardless of how hard life has been trying to teach you it can't be done.
Wish you all the best, and hope you'll always remember life is what you make of it.
I also swore never ever to be in any kind of relationship with alcoholic. So what I'm going through feels like a cruel joke life has played on me, just to prove me I have no power in that is going on in my life. But I have set my mind to prove it wrong.
I congratulate you on your sobriety, you should be very proud of yourself. I'm sure you are to stay winner here, as you broke free regardless of how hard life has been trying to teach you it can't be done.
Wish you all the best, and hope you'll always remember life is what you make of it.
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