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Old 08-02-2003, 04:17 PM
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Concentrating on the immediate proplem of drinking may be a common suggestion heard around some meetings.

However I know of nowhere in the AA Basic Text that says not to worry too much about coffee and tobacco.
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Old 08-02-2003, 04:49 PM
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I can tell you that I managed to stop smoking using the principles of AA.But I had been sober many years,and had hit rock bottom with it.It would have been difficult,if not impossible in early recovery.Most meetings allowed smoking in those days.

I was getting pnuemonia and bronchitis on a regular basis,because of my heavy smoking.My doctor said I could end up on oxygen.I couldn't picture riding my motorcycle,playing with my kid,doing my job,all tethered to an oxygen tank.But I couldn't seem to let it go,either.I had tried and failed too often.So I asked my HP to take it from me.This did NOT make it easy.But I have not had a cigarette since.It's been about six years,and I don't miss them at all.All things are possible when we become willing.

phoenix

(In February of this year,my son's father died of lung cancer as a direct result of smoking.He was 47 years old.It is a horrible way to die,it steals your life in slow motion,until a walk across the room is like climbing Mt Everest....only more painful by far.)
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Old 08-02-2003, 07:20 PM
  # 43 (permalink)  
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Light bulb moment!

Excellent thought Phoenix! I have been trying to apply the steps to my drinking, successfully at that, and never thought about using it to stop smoking, which I really know I need to do! Yet I have not given that an honest effort.
So I will give it a try! *sratches head, now why didn't I think of that?*
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Old 08-03-2003, 02:06 AM
  # 44 (permalink)  
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Hi Peter, my daughter mentioned often that she couldn't relate her problems to me when I was drunk. I thought I was very open and willing to talk. Only the half sober moments I have now make me see she could have been right. And, no, I never lose control to the extent that I'd walk in front of a car, but beer itself is like the car you are talking about, and if that is what you mean, you're right.
Chy & Don, my younger brother was a successfull (and some say brilliant) mechanical engineer working for Northen Telecom. Before he died from alcohal he mailed me a copy of the big book. I read it cover to cover. No Don, there wasn't a single endorsement of tobbacco anywhere in there (I know the question wasn't directed to me) but there was a case of a woman who's husband smoked and was a drunk. What I remmember from the story was that she was advised to turn a bit of a blind eye to what was killing her husband slowly, and to support him in staying away from what was destroying his life right now. I read the book 5 years ago and maybe I don't have the details right . It made a big impression on me though.
Peter, my impression of something I read 5 years ago can't possibly be interpreted as AA policy.
Thanks for the posts
Wiebe

Last edited by wiebe; 08-03-2003 at 02:12 AM.
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Old 08-04-2003, 09:14 PM
  # 45 (permalink)  
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Hi Weibe,
Just wanted to see how you were doing! Hope things are getting a little bit better each day for you.

Thinking of you.
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Old 08-05-2003, 02:17 AM
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Hello Chy.
Yes it's going better. I think about the things you said (like fear of sobriety) a lot. I'll go out and do a bit of work in an hour or so. It helps to have things to do, and I've been working on rebuilding the old network of contacts. Still working on the subject of the original post. Chy, after 20 years of booze how in the world did you manage to just stop?
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Old 08-05-2003, 08:42 PM
  # 47 (permalink)  
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Weibe,

I'll have to admit I really don't know. Just one morning at work giving Senior exams hungover again, I had time and found myself here. I realized this powerful disease was killing me slowly, and ruining my relationships, was tired of covering it up ( Only 3 people knew how bad my drinking became, Hubby and 2 kids).... I dunno Weibe I got sick and tired of being sick and tired, I truly believe my prayers were answered. Simple as that. Your time will come to Weibe, it takes some getting used to. What took so long was that fear of sobriety, but I believe someone helped me overcome it long enough to just let me see I could quit!

I'm glad to see you are trying to keep busy if it means you didn't have a beer for an hour or two or the whole day, your making progress, baby steps will get you towards sobriety too! Though some may disagree with me on this. Don't be afraid to give it up, if I can do it you will too! Hows the physical discomfort? Any better?

My prayers are for you tonight!

Last edited by Chy; 08-05-2003 at 08:47 PM.
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Old 08-07-2003, 07:34 AM
  # 48 (permalink)  
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Hello Chy
I've learned tons of stuff reading the responses in this thread and others. For one thing the 90 days seams to be a sort of threshold or breakaway period. After that it's maintaining a built up lifestyle (one day at a time). This morning I woke up without serious shaking, and after lots of water and one of my girlfriend's fruit juices, I went to the store. My feet just happened to be going in that direction, so I went along. Yes I pray, and it seems that my Higher Power has taken the physical distress away. Now I guess it's time to stop being a wimp and do what so many people on these boards have done, QUIT. I keep thinking of Freddie Fender - "Wasted Days & Wasted Nights". He was singing about jail time, but this stuff is a volontary jail chosen on a daily basis. I choose it daily! But I WILL reach the point you have, that I'm just sick and tired of being sick and tired. Enough. Like Don suggested I'll try a whole 24 hours next time, and then another one, one day at a time.
Take care
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Old 08-07-2003, 08:53 AM
  # 49 (permalink)  
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Sounding Good

Webe

I am so pleased to read of your progress. :clap :clap :clap
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Old 08-07-2003, 10:22 AM
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Originally posted by wiebe lemstra
Hello Chy
I've learned tons of stuff reading the responses in this thread and others. For one thing the 90 days seams to be a sort of threshold or breakaway period. After that it's maintaining a built up lifestyle (one day at a time). This morning I woke up without serious shaking, and after lots of water and one of my girlfriend's fruit juices, I went to the store. My feet just happened to be going in that direction, so I went along. Yes I pray, and it seems that my Higher Power has taken the physical distress away. Now I guess it's time to stop being a wimp and do what so many people on these boards have done, QUIT. I keep thinking of Freddie Fender - "Wasted Days & Wasted Nights". He was singing about jail time, but this stuff is a volontary jail chosen on a daily basis. I choose it daily! But I WILL reach the point you have, that I'm just sick and tired of being sick and tired. Enough. Like Don suggested I'll try a whole 24 hours next time, and then another one, one day at a time.
Take care
Wiebe
Hi, Wiebe,
You sound good. At the risk of repeating myself, there are three things that people who succeed at sobriety have in common:
a commitment to sobriety;
a change in lifestyle;
they plan for urges and practice dealing with them.

This post shows me that you are building the commitment to sobriety and are making steps towards changing the lifestyle. You mention "going in that direction" of the store; that is a case of an urge manifesting itself, seemingly unconsciously, and is something you can plan for. Our daily shopping patterns are a big part of the behavior, and NOT buying alcohol was, for me, the key to NOT drinking in the first few days. Yeah, I can get a drink elsewhere if I really want to, but I might as well not make it easier by having it in the house!
"There will be no alcohol in my body or in my house." I actually said this out loud as I went to the grocery store, until it became a fact rather than just a hope.
While the 90 day milestone was significant, I didn't really notice it at the time. The most significant one for me was the 72 hour one. When you get there you've really broken a physiological cycle in your body. You've changed your blood sugar patterns, you've started a new sleep cycle, and your body is no longer producing the various enzymes and such that have been required to process a continuous stream of alcohol and carbohydrates. 24 hours is a huge step, and 72 hours is when sobriety really "clicked" for me.
By the way, five days after my 72 hours I decided to have a beer. I consciously focused on how it made me feel as alcohol reentered my body. My IMMEDIATE reaction was that I wanted another one. So my rational mind kicked in and said "you obviously like alcohol TOO much for just one."Moderation was obviously not for me, and that was the last drink I've had.

It's great watching as you make these decisions, Wiebe. We're all pulling for you here!

Don S

ps--you're not a wimp.
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Old 08-07-2003, 08:58 PM
  # 51 (permalink)  
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Weibe,

As I often hear, give sobriety a try if not fully satisfied we'll refund your misery and hand you a drink as a bonus!

In all seriousness, your doing well believe it or not, progress in mind or actions is still progress. You'll get there! Your still in that "fear of sobriety stage" I think. That's ok
too. I'm confident your gonna make it because I know you want to, it takes some getting used to and then one day you WILL have that single 24 hours, and before you know it your in double digits!

Keep praying. Since you don't have an AA near by if you haven't already found it here is the Serenity prayer we say before each meeting:

"God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I can not change, the courage to change the things I can and the wisdom to know the difference."

Works for me all the time! Keep reading that dusty Big Book too!
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Old 08-08-2003, 08:41 AM
  # 52 (permalink)  
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Hi Don, I think you may be right about the 72 hours. That will be the next big hurdle. There's a huge heat wave here in Holland right now, (totally muggy) and the sleepless nights can wait awhile until it gets a bit cooler, but it's on the agenda.
Chy, if I make it for 3 days I doubt if I'll want the misery back. I was planning to find the copy of the big book my brother sent me, but kept forgeting, and after reading your post I dug it out of the bottom of a closet. It was pretty dusty.
Thanks
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Old 08-08-2003, 11:45 AM
  # 53 (permalink)  
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Yuk! Hot and muggy, I can't bare the humidity! It's 103 but a dry heat here. Looking forward to the cooler days slowly approaching!

Glad you found the BB. Hope you will find the words to help you get through your first 24 hours. I'm rooting for you!
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Old 08-08-2003, 12:47 PM
  # 54 (permalink)  
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Wiebe,
Glad you found that copy of the BB. Basically, do what it says and find yourself an online sponsor (they ARE available), go to some online meetings (they are available too) and you're part of AA. Actually, follow the BB and you are part of AA I could send you some links to pursue if you want 'em....... [email protected]

One doesn't think of Holland as having heat waves! I doubt you guys are prepared for yoursl Ick! It's only 83 here and we have the a/c's on It's usually in the high 90's with high humiditiy and we still have the a/c's on
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Old 08-08-2003, 07:29 PM
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Excellant idea Moot! Now why didn't I think of that. Mooty when you get a chance would you email me the online meeting link? Thanks my friend. How are you doing? Visitor gone yet?
Glad your getting around again!
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Old 08-09-2003, 03:30 AM
  # 56 (permalink)  
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Hello Chy and Moot. I've sent an e-mail to your address asking for the links. Absolutely great idea (I hope)! I seam to remember that AA membership was possible through the mail if there wasn't a group in the area, so why not online? Do you have to be completely stopped before joining, or are there no hard rules on that? My program of slowing down is working well (helped in part by this stupid heat wave). No, Holland doesn't usually have these, and almost no-one has an airco in their house. My girlfriend and I tried not to move too much and I worked on not choking on a hot beer that came out of the fridge a few minutes before. Phew ! Hope it goes soon. Looking forward to waking up and drinking tons of water while attending an online AA meeting. I'll start reading the BB again right after this post. I gather that both of you are still struggling too, so strength to you.
Thanks for the posts,
Wiebe
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Old 08-09-2003, 08:08 AM
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Originally posted by wiebe lemstra
Hello Chy and Moot. I've sent an e-mail to your address asking for the links. Absolutely great idea (I hope)! I seam to remember that AA membership was possible through the mail if there wasn't a group in the area, so why not online? Do you have to be completely stopped before joining, or are there no hard rules on that? My program of slowing down is working well (helped in part by this stupid heat wave). No, Holland doesn't usually have these, and almost no-one has an airco in their house. My girlfriend and I tried not to move too much and I worked on not choking on a hot beer that came out of the fridge a few minutes before. Phew ! Hope it goes soon. Looking forward to waking up and drinking tons of water while attending an online AA meeting. I'll start reading the BB again right after this post. I gather that both of you are still struggling too, so strength to you.
Thanks for the posts,
Wiebe
Hi, Wiebe,
Hey, this heat wave could be a great opportunity. I've been reading about temperatures in Europe that sound pretty awful--100F in London? Yuck! Where I live (near Sacramento, CA) our average high temperature is 93F in July, and we just had 17 days over 100F--which was not a record--but the humidity is 10 - 20%. That makes the heat bearable, but we all are well trained about the health effects of searing temperatures.

With the humidity you're describing, alcohol could actually be lead to serious health problems. Remember, it increases body heat and acts as a diuretic--making you pee away body fluids that you need right now! Plus, your kidneys and liver are working overtime in the heat. So cutting back to as little beer as you can stand would be in your body's best interests right now! Plus, then you could figure out how little beer you feel you "need" and try cutting that amount even more.

Folks here might find it interesting if you posted parts of the BB which you find useful, or which you'd like more info on. I'm not in AA, so it would be educational to me to watch you go through that learning process. You might also check out some of the links at the bottom of the page of AA alternatives. If you have questions about SMART Recovery, which I've used, let me know. There are useful tools in all the programs. One thing they all share is tricks for making early sobriety more successful.

Stay cool, move slowly, keep your salt intake up, and drink plenty of water!
Don S
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Old 08-09-2003, 08:42 AM
  # 58 (permalink)  
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weibe, I just sent you off those links. I'm not sure which are good or not because I got them through an email to me. I know the ones I added are good tho.

chy........ I lost your email addy! Pls send again??? ::::::: blush :::::::::
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Old 08-09-2003, 09:07 AM
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"I seam to remember that AA membership was possible through the mail if there wasn't a group in the area, so why not online? Do you have to be completely stopped before joining, or are there no hard rules on that"
-------oopsie, forgot this....

Here's a link to the AA webpage itself....... I'm sure they could driect you (through email maybe) to 'loner" groups. I've not yet found any loner groups. But then, I haven't tried the AA main site either.........
http://www.alcoholics-anonymous.org/

Re completely stopping before joining..... absolutely not! All that is required for AA membership is a desire to stop drinking!

Re what Don said........ definately have a look around! Check out SMART and the other "alternative" resources. The link to alternative resources is at the bottom right of the opening page of this website. I like AA and recommend it highly. Don likes SMART. Who's to say what's right (subliminal message "AA's right AA's right" ) Truthfully, one of the great things about AA is that it's free(great for me, at least, cuz I'm broke), except for Sober 24 (not an official AA site), which I sent you.
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Old 08-09-2003, 10:37 AM
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Originally posted by MootPoint63
"I seam to remember that AA membership was possible through the mail if there wasn't a group in the area, so why not online? Do you have to be completely stopped before joining, or are there no hard rules on that"
-------oopsie, forgot this....

Here's a link to the AA webpage itself....... I'm sure they could driect you (through email maybe) to 'loner" groups. I've not yet found any loner groups. But then, I haven't tried the AA main site either.........
http://www.alcoholics-anonymous.org/

Re completely stopping before joining..... absolutely not! All that is required for AA membership is a desire to stop drinking!

Re what Don said........ definately have a look around! Check out SMART and the other "alternative" resources. The link to alternative resources is at the bottom right of the opening page of this website. I like AA and recommend it highly. Don likes SMART. Who's to say what's right (subliminal message "AA's right AA's right" ) Truthfully, one of the great things about AA is that it's free(great for me, at least, cuz I'm broke), except for Sober 24 (not an official AA site), which I sent you.
Hi, Moot,
I'd find it useful if you'd post those links here, and I don't think the moderator would mind. They'd be great to have as references. I have always assumed that AA has online meetings, but don't know how to refer folks to them.
It's hard to imagine a recovery group that would have abstinence as a prerequisite! It is obviously the goal of all of them (not Moderation Mgt, of course, but that isn't really a "recovery" group). But if only sober people could attend sobriety meetings, they'd have a pretty small turnout....:-)
Turning the desire to stop drinking into a firm commitment to do so is the first step. Without that commitment--if you are ambivalent about quitting--you are likely to keep giving yourself permission to drink.
To my knowledge, all recovery groups (except RR) are free.

Don S
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