Dont touch my beer!
Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Philadelphia, Pa
Posts: 169
Originally Posted by jimhere 
One day you might. Meanwhile you should get on with getting done too.
Funny, I assumed I was in the 12 step forum when i responded to your comment. So really, one shouldn't have to be told about "getting done too" in this forum.
Last edited by ruch; 06-28-2008 at 03:14 PM. Reason: correcting a mistake
Today's Muse
Join Date: May 2007
Location: West end
Posts: 1,081
I get where the comment is coming from. Year after year of the same ole, same ole. We are miserable and want changes in our lives, yet do nothing about it long term. Apparently, we want a bellyful of beer more than we want to make the effort. We are the only ones holding ourselves back. I hope you take action and sustain it this time, Patrick. Your life depends on it.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Philadelphia, Pa
Posts: 169
Originally Posted by LosingmyMisery
I get where the comment is coming from. Year after year of the same ole, same ole. We are miserable and want changes in our lives, yet do nothing about it long term. Apparently, we want a bellyful of beer more than we want to make the effort. We are the only ones holding ourselves back. I hope you take action and sustain it this time, Patrick. Your life depends on it.
Today's Muse
Join Date: May 2007
Location: West end
Posts: 1,081
Maybe not, but I can not decide which words should be heard that will finally click for Patrick. Maybe those will be the words that pushes him into gear. No one knows. I had to hear harsh words before I took action. We can not decide for him. There are two type of people. Those who talk about recovery and those who make it happen. Personally, I would never assume recovery is easy for anyone. Yes, many of us achieve it, but it was never easy. The truth hurts, but often times it is what we need to hear before we are willing to take action. I'm sorry if you don't care for AA cliche. It is hard to avoid around a bunch of recovering alcoholics. I've learned to cope with it. Trust me, I hated them also, but I can understand where they are coming from and why.
Administrator
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: CA
Posts: 10,681
Please direct your comments to the original thread starter and address personal disagreements in a private message.
If the moderator sees something inappropriate she will address it when she gets here.
If the moderator sees something inappropriate she will address it when she gets here.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Pugetopolis
Posts: 2,384
Years ago I was a chronic relapser. Thirty days here, forty-five days there, in and out of AA meetings, treatment centers and de-tox facilities. One time I was at an AA meeting and when they asked if there were any newcomers I said "I'm Jim and I'm back." A fellow behind me leaned forward and whispered "When were you ever here?" Ouch, that hurt, but I knew it was true.
The day after my last drink, the first person I ever really listened to in AA looked at me across a table during a noon AA meeting and said "I Have been watching you for the last four years and if you don't get your head out of your ass you are going to die." I HEARD him.
A man I consider a mentor was known to say "Truth without love is cruelty and confrontation without a real answer is brutality." Those guys could say that stuff to me because they had an answer if I cared to have it.
In AA they say that we'll love you until you can learn to love yourself. Well, we'll love your ass to death if you let us.
Jim
As MorningGlory has said, if anyone cares to discuss why I take the stance that I do, please pm me.
The day after my last drink, the first person I ever really listened to in AA looked at me across a table during a noon AA meeting and said "I Have been watching you for the last four years and if you don't get your head out of your ass you are going to die." I HEARD him.
A man I consider a mentor was known to say "Truth without love is cruelty and confrontation without a real answer is brutality." Those guys could say that stuff to me because they had an answer if I cared to have it.
In AA they say that we'll love you until you can learn to love yourself. Well, we'll love your ass to death if you let us.
Jim
As MorningGlory has said, if anyone cares to discuss why I take the stance that I do, please pm me.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: seattle
Posts: 468
uggh....
hey homer. wishing you well still, sir.
So, as a card carying 'participant' i get a bad vibe about certian things 'members' say to relapsers sometimes.
things like "better you then me", or "hows THAT working for ya...."
Just seem to lack compassion, understanding or anything of as a result of theese steps, or practice of principals...." First hand,my experience receiving comments like that after relapse, or still seeking help at AA, it hurt me, as i have been told such things . It seems like a case of kick me when im down... rather then carying a message of hope that ANYONE can find recovery (The is the overwelming example i have seen in aa and na. )
no one could berate or shame me into quiting, i remember very clearly.
...
hey homer. wishing you well still, sir.
So, as a card carying 'participant' i get a bad vibe about certian things 'members' say to relapsers sometimes.
things like "better you then me", or "hows THAT working for ya...."
Just seem to lack compassion, understanding or anything of as a result of theese steps, or practice of principals...." First hand,my experience receiving comments like that after relapse, or still seeking help at AA, it hurt me, as i have been told such things . It seems like a case of kick me when im down... rather then carying a message of hope that ANYONE can find recovery (The is the overwelming example i have seen in aa and na. )
no one could berate or shame me into quiting, i remember very clearly.
...
Administrator
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 211,429
If tough love worked, the OP would be president of AA by now.
If he's anything like I was - it'll send him off pissed, and make him drink harder.
The trouble with telling people to drink their fill is...some will.
They'll die. Just to spite you.
D
If he's anything like I was - it'll send him off pissed, and make him drink harder.
The trouble with telling people to drink their fill is...some will.
They'll die. Just to spite you.
D
Last edited by Dee74; 06-28-2008 at 05:58 PM.
Forward we go...side by side-Rest In Peace
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Serene In Dixie
Posts: 36,740
Chill with the personal attacks and baiting of other members.
As our Adminstrator Morning Glory asked...use PM.
Please do share your personal experiences with
alcoholism and your recovery.
There is not one member here who wants another
to die from alcoholism. If what I share
does not click with someone....perhaps yours will.
Thanks for remembering why we are here.
As our Adminstrator Morning Glory asked...use PM.
Please do share your personal experiences with
alcoholism and your recovery.
There is not one member here who wants another
to die from alcoholism. If what I share
does not click with someone....perhaps yours will.
Thanks for remembering why we are here.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,697
"Kind" words did not help in getting me sober. In fact - most of those in my life didn't have many kind things to say to me, if they were talking to me at all. I heard a lot of stuff (from non-alcoholics) like:
"You can drink all the time for all I care- just get out of my life"
"Here's another bottle, since you care more about that than you do me".
I think we all know the routine. The really harsh stuff is yet to come Homer
"We the jury find you guilty.."
"I am taking the kids and leaving for good"
"You killed 3 people in a car accident last night..you don't remember?"
To the OP - do you want to stop drinking? Are you ready to take a little responsibility in doing so? I see a lot of care in different forms in this thread - yet, where are you?
From your previous posts, it seems you are gonna drink no matter what anyone in these forums said.
If you want to know how I stopped - PM me. I can tell you precisely what I do. If not - do something, somehow...it doesn't sound like you are enjoying life very much.
It is possible to live a very fulfilling life without alcohol...
"You can drink all the time for all I care- just get out of my life"
"Here's another bottle, since you care more about that than you do me".
I think we all know the routine. The really harsh stuff is yet to come Homer
"We the jury find you guilty.."
"I am taking the kids and leaving for good"
"You killed 3 people in a car accident last night..you don't remember?"
To the OP - do you want to stop drinking? Are you ready to take a little responsibility in doing so? I see a lot of care in different forms in this thread - yet, where are you?
From your previous posts, it seems you are gonna drink no matter what anyone in these forums said.
If you want to know how I stopped - PM me. I can tell you precisely what I do. If not - do something, somehow...it doesn't sound like you are enjoying life very much.
It is possible to live a very fulfilling life without alcohol...
Member
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Santa Fe, NM
Posts: 107
These attitudes are precisely why I have issues with 12-step programs, though I remain a faithful member as NA/AA is the only program that has worked for me, personally. The fact that we worship a text from almost a hundred years ago is reflected in the guilt and shame-based statements so many old-timers claim to utter out of genuine concern. Seriously, why is it any skin off someone's back if a person relapses? He or she has his own higher power and it is not in the hands of another human being... hopefully those you "tough love" show you more respect when you falter... It's a cunning, baffling disease.
Guest
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Southern New Hampshire
Posts: 746
Originally Posted by Liberty47
These attitudes are precisely why I have issues with 12-step programs, though I remain a faithful member as NA/AA is the only program that has worked for me, personally. The fact that we worship a text from almost a hundred years ago is reflected in the guilt and shame-based statements so many old-timers claim to utter out of genuine concern. Seriously, why is it any skin off someone's back if a person relapses? He or she has his own higher power and it is not in the hands of another human being... hopefully those you "tough love" show you more respect when you falter... It's a cunning, baffling disease.
These days I'm kind of into caring about people, so yes, It is skin off my back in the sense that I know how dying from alcoholism feels like, and I know a solution that has worked pretty damn well in my life and the lives of countless other.
Your post contains generalizations that don't apply to all of us. I don't worship the BIg Book, the steps, my sponsor or meetings. I have a relationship with the power they guided me to, This power has removed my problem. I have recovered from alcoholism. If i live by these principles I will never drink again, so I am not overly concerned about being respected by folks I have spoken my conscious to.
Administrator
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 211,429
Welcome Liberty 47
Opinions are what this place runs on - we're all free to give them and all free to disagree.
It won't be news here, but for what it's worth, I by and large agree with you - I must say tho that it will always be 'skin off my back' when someone relapses.
I have no doubt we all want to help.
For me, I try always to remember the way I felt as an active alcoholic - I needed support not vituperation; I needed to know others didn't give up on me even tho I was a cigarette paper away from giving up on myself....I needed a firm hand sure (some might argue I still do LOL) - but not a
monolithic one.
whatever works for you is the best programme right?
D
Opinions are what this place runs on - we're all free to give them and all free to disagree.
It won't be news here, but for what it's worth, I by and large agree with you - I must say tho that it will always be 'skin off my back' when someone relapses.
I have no doubt we all want to help.
For me, I try always to remember the way I felt as an active alcoholic - I needed support not vituperation; I needed to know others didn't give up on me even tho I was a cigarette paper away from giving up on myself....I needed a firm hand sure (some might argue I still do LOL) - but not a
monolithic one.
whatever works for you is the best programme right?
D
1 bite&all resistance crumbles
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: IRELAND
Posts: 2,208
Originally Posted by Dee74
I must say tho that it will always be 'skin off my back' when someone relapses.
My back does not have enough skin to *also* be concerned with those who cannot or will not recover. I have to be there - and I am = for the still suffering alcoholic who wishes to recover.
Randomly drunkenly posting on SR does not qualify as a wish to recover. Getting off your butt, and out of yourself, and doing ANY program shows willingness
JMHO
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