Mistakes
Member
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Middletown, NY
Posts: 90
There is something in the literature about not being able to transmit something you haven't got. By living a lie and bargaining about relapse by making excuses is not being rigorously honest or practicing the principles of recovery in ALL your affairs. It's up to you...
It seems obvious that you are some sort of car buff.... would you trust a mechanic with your car if you knew at times he "fixed" your car with used parts?
It seems obvious that you are some sort of car buff.... would you trust a mechanic with your car if you knew at times he "fixed" your car with used parts?
Om, Aum, Ohm...
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Punxsutawney/Pittsburgh
Posts: 4,797
Yes, if it were me, I would change my sobriety date. I'll tell you why.
Alcohol is but a symptom of our underlying condition that has been characterized in the Big Book as "self-will run riot." It's not the substance but the intention in using the substance. I have a sponsee who, on her own, reset her sobriety date because she took a handful of her mother's pills -- which turned out to be antibiotics. Did she get high? No, but she sure was hoping she had. As her sponsor, I didn't tell she had to do it, but she was practicing that pesky spiritual principle of rigorous honesty. It all begins with you and your own honesty with yourself.
For the record, I wrote several dates inside my rehab Big Book. One was for the last date I drank, another for the last day I smoked crack, and yet another for the last day I was popping pills. Eventually, when I began to understand that it's not the substance but why I use the substance, I crossed the first two out and kept the last and most recent.
To thine own self, be true. Once you can do that, you'll have your answer.
Peace & Love,
Sugah
Alcohol is but a symptom of our underlying condition that has been characterized in the Big Book as "self-will run riot." It's not the substance but the intention in using the substance. I have a sponsee who, on her own, reset her sobriety date because she took a handful of her mother's pills -- which turned out to be antibiotics. Did she get high? No, but she sure was hoping she had. As her sponsor, I didn't tell she had to do it, but she was practicing that pesky spiritual principle of rigorous honesty. It all begins with you and your own honesty with yourself.
For the record, I wrote several dates inside my rehab Big Book. One was for the last date I drank, another for the last day I smoked crack, and yet another for the last day I was popping pills. Eventually, when I began to understand that it's not the substance but why I use the substance, I crossed the first two out and kept the last and most recent.
To thine own self, be true. Once you can do that, you'll have your answer.
Peace & Love,
Sugah
Another Day in Paradise
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Upland, CA
Posts: 900
We are as "sick" as our secrets. If something is of a concern to you, then my guess is that you already have the answer as to its impact on "actual" sobriety. If a cigarette alters you and your thinking then it would play into your sobriety in my opinion. I have always heard and adhered to sobriety being linked to any substance that "alters our behavior from the neck up." That is a simple rule of thumb FOR ME.
My sobriety date is just that; mine. I got sober and stay sober for me, and as a result I know IF MY BEHAVIOR is in keeping with days sober. Sponsors are there to advise and suggest. I agree with an earlier post that as a sponsor I AM NOT INTERESTED in advising someone who is dishonest with me. Music's comment seemed to be in keeping with that thought from what I read. Relapse is an unfortunate fact for some and I have kept sponsees who have relapsed as long as they are not dishonest with me regarding that relapse. That is just my past experience.
I don't know if I am an "old timer" or not, I have 8 and 1/2 years sober, I am also 55 years old so somewhere in there is an old timer I guess. Regardless, my point is that whether it is days, weeks, months or years we stay sober for ourselves. If we get caught up in how many days we have so that we can have STATUS in the group or among friends, then I think we have missed the whole point of sobriety.
The sober life is a new and better way of living than what I had prior to being sober. The only one who knows if my sobriety is working and honest is me.
If I were in your shoes, I would start my personal count the day after the joint. THAT HOWEVER is what I would do; you are free to do what ever you feel best about.
One last comment: THE FACT THAT YOU ARE QUESTIONING IS GREAT, IT INDICATES TO ME THAT YOU ARE SERIOUS ABOUT "GETTING" SOBER.
Good luck,
Jon
My sobriety date is just that; mine. I got sober and stay sober for me, and as a result I know IF MY BEHAVIOR is in keeping with days sober. Sponsors are there to advise and suggest. I agree with an earlier post that as a sponsor I AM NOT INTERESTED in advising someone who is dishonest with me. Music's comment seemed to be in keeping with that thought from what I read. Relapse is an unfortunate fact for some and I have kept sponsees who have relapsed as long as they are not dishonest with me regarding that relapse. That is just my past experience.
I don't know if I am an "old timer" or not, I have 8 and 1/2 years sober, I am also 55 years old so somewhere in there is an old timer I guess. Regardless, my point is that whether it is days, weeks, months or years we stay sober for ourselves. If we get caught up in how many days we have so that we can have STATUS in the group or among friends, then I think we have missed the whole point of sobriety.
The sober life is a new and better way of living than what I had prior to being sober. The only one who knows if my sobriety is working and honest is me.
If I were in your shoes, I would start my personal count the day after the joint. THAT HOWEVER is what I would do; you are free to do what ever you feel best about.
One last comment: THE FACT THAT YOU ARE QUESTIONING IS GREAT, IT INDICATES TO ME THAT YOU ARE SERIOUS ABOUT "GETTING" SOBER.
Good luck,
Jon
Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Colorado Prairie
Posts: 1,417
There's a lot more to sobriety than not drinking. Sobriety is about learning to play the hand you're dealt without having to use alcohol as an "Escape"
That being said, pot is just as much as an escape as alcohol. You used it to run and hide from life. That's not sobriety now, is it?
Starting over?? Starting over with what? You have 45 days sober that nobody can take away from you. Sobriety is not a race to see how fast we can rack up continuous time. It's about being the person that God put you on this planet to be.
Be proud of what you did and respect the power of substances to lure you into something you'll regret. It'll get you again next time you let your guard down.
That being said, pot is just as much as an escape as alcohol. You used it to run and hide from life. That's not sobriety now, is it?
Starting over?? Starting over with what? You have 45 days sober that nobody can take away from you. Sobriety is not a race to see how fast we can rack up continuous time. It's about being the person that God put you on this planet to be.
Be proud of what you did and respect the power of substances to lure you into something you'll regret. It'll get you again next time you let your guard down.
Today's Muse
Join Date: May 2007
Location: West end
Posts: 1,081
I think it is simple. Either you want sobriety or you don't. Smoking pot is not a sober activity IMO. Your sponsor will most likely agree if he is worth his salt. It is not okay to be sober sometimes or engage in illegal activities once in a while. There are repercussions. Why take the risk? I believe smoking pot may lead you back to drinking.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 2,126
Minority-One here...hehehe.....no, no, not to worry.....in fact I'm not going to take either side....just post my opinion...I think...lol
I'm lucky the question never arose for me; when I got sober, I got clean too. I joined both AA and NA at the same time and made the decisions to not drink and not use.....period....one date...keep it simple...lol
As a lot of folks have stated, AA is based on Honesty (and of course, Openness, and Willingness)..., but there's also words like recovery, and SOBER/SOBRIETY, which to me are subjective terms.....I'm reminded of the little phrase on the back of our annual medallions: To Thine Own Self Be True.....
"Originally Posted by tiburon88
It's up to you if you want to count it as a relapse. I know some people who have tried just smoking pot and it usually leads back to alcohol.
to which you replied ---
Isn't it more up to my sponsor than me? Just curious what you all think about that?"
I'm not sure if anybody addressed this question of yours; there was a lot of good stuff here, but I will admit that I did skim at times.....but in my opinion, of course, if you were to ask me that question [as an old-timer (20+ years used to qualify as such)], my answer would be....."No, it is NOT more up to your sponsor. To me a sponsor is a guide; a mentor. The two sponsors I've had made suggestions and told me what they did and what worked for them....but that was it."
Now to the question above all other questions.....the one with which I have no personal experience.....izzit a relapse? does one change one's sobriety date?..... hmmmmm Personally, the way AA states it, AA is about recovery from alcoholism. It deals with alcohol ONLY. Everything else (drugs, marijuana, etc.) are all outside issues. So, according to AA you'd be ok, but, as you can see here (and, ...as you're probably thinking about your sponsor's response), most AAer's seem to include all drugs in their definition of sobriety (more like NA, to me, but I've always been a person that doesn't push my way on anyone, and doesn't let others push their way onto me). Therefore, most AAer's (remember, they're not AA, only members of AA) will say that smoking marijuana is a no-no, a relapse, a time to change one's sobriety date...BUT me....? I'm gonna sit on the fence and let you be true to your own self [along with your sponsor, of course, whom I'm hoping you're going to talk to..... (o: ]
No matter what your decision,,,,,keep on keepin' on.
NoelleR
DOS: 6/23/86
I'm lucky the question never arose for me; when I got sober, I got clean too. I joined both AA and NA at the same time and made the decisions to not drink and not use.....period....one date...keep it simple...lol
As a lot of folks have stated, AA is based on Honesty (and of course, Openness, and Willingness)..., but there's also words like recovery, and SOBER/SOBRIETY, which to me are subjective terms.....I'm reminded of the little phrase on the back of our annual medallions: To Thine Own Self Be True.....
"Originally Posted by tiburon88
It's up to you if you want to count it as a relapse. I know some people who have tried just smoking pot and it usually leads back to alcohol.
to which you replied ---
Isn't it more up to my sponsor than me? Just curious what you all think about that?"
I'm not sure if anybody addressed this question of yours; there was a lot of good stuff here, but I will admit that I did skim at times.....but in my opinion, of course, if you were to ask me that question [as an old-timer (20+ years used to qualify as such)], my answer would be....."No, it is NOT more up to your sponsor. To me a sponsor is a guide; a mentor. The two sponsors I've had made suggestions and told me what they did and what worked for them....but that was it."
Now to the question above all other questions.....the one with which I have no personal experience.....izzit a relapse? does one change one's sobriety date?..... hmmmmm Personally, the way AA states it, AA is about recovery from alcoholism. It deals with alcohol ONLY. Everything else (drugs, marijuana, etc.) are all outside issues. So, according to AA you'd be ok, but, as you can see here (and, ...as you're probably thinking about your sponsor's response), most AAer's seem to include all drugs in their definition of sobriety (more like NA, to me, but I've always been a person that doesn't push my way on anyone, and doesn't let others push their way onto me). Therefore, most AAer's (remember, they're not AA, only members of AA) will say that smoking marijuana is a no-no, a relapse, a time to change one's sobriety date...BUT me....? I'm gonna sit on the fence and let you be true to your own self [along with your sponsor, of course, whom I'm hoping you're going to talk to..... (o: ]
No matter what your decision,,,,,keep on keepin' on.
NoelleR
DOS: 6/23/86
same planet...different world
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Butte, America
Posts: 10,946
I think that without honesty ... there'll be no long term sobriety.
And that's what we're seeking - sobriety.
Not "days and days not drinking".
There's a world of difference between the two.
And that's what we're seeking - sobriety.
Not "days and days not drinking".
There's a world of difference between the two.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: some where / no where
Posts: 1,019
Welcome Dennis
I don't know what you should do about your sobriety date. I think there's been lots of good things said here already.
On one side of the coin, you didn't drink. The AA program deals with Alcohol not pot. On the other side of the coin, is someone who smoked pot really sober?
Let me share my experience with you. I quit drinking on sept 24, 2005. I joined AA to stay sober from drinking. I kept smoking pot everyday, but kept it a secret. As I started to get into AA, I realized I was really missing something. It was the honesty thing...Dang!!! I wanted to stay away from alcohol, be a good member of AA, but blow my mind with pot every night to "relax". Guess what? It wasn't working for me. I wasn't really sober when I was smoking pot.
I smoked my last joint on Jan 2, 2006. I told my sponsor, and asked him what he thought I should do about my sobriety date. He said it's up to me. It might have been different if I just tried a joint...but I was depending on pot to carry me through.
I decided to celebrate the date that I became free from all mind altering substances. I call Jan. 3rd my sobriety date. Sept 24th is still a special day for me as it was the day I began my recovery. It's sort of neat to have two special dates, but Jan 3rd is my actual sobriety date. I celebrate my AA "birthdays" on Jan 3rd.
It's up to you, and I wouldn't judge you if you chose to keep your sobriety date. For some people, pot isn't a big deal. If you feel guilty, it leads me to believe it's a big deal for you. I'm glad you are speaking to your sponsor about it. My only advice is to listen to your sponsor, and listen to your heart.
chip
I don't know what you should do about your sobriety date. I think there's been lots of good things said here already.
On one side of the coin, you didn't drink. The AA program deals with Alcohol not pot. On the other side of the coin, is someone who smoked pot really sober?
Let me share my experience with you. I quit drinking on sept 24, 2005. I joined AA to stay sober from drinking. I kept smoking pot everyday, but kept it a secret. As I started to get into AA, I realized I was really missing something. It was the honesty thing...Dang!!! I wanted to stay away from alcohol, be a good member of AA, but blow my mind with pot every night to "relax". Guess what? It wasn't working for me. I wasn't really sober when I was smoking pot.
I smoked my last joint on Jan 2, 2006. I told my sponsor, and asked him what he thought I should do about my sobriety date. He said it's up to me. It might have been different if I just tried a joint...but I was depending on pot to carry me through.
I decided to celebrate the date that I became free from all mind altering substances. I call Jan. 3rd my sobriety date. Sept 24th is still a special day for me as it was the day I began my recovery. It's sort of neat to have two special dates, but Jan 3rd is my actual sobriety date. I celebrate my AA "birthdays" on Jan 3rd.
It's up to you, and I wouldn't judge you if you chose to keep your sobriety date. For some people, pot isn't a big deal. If you feel guilty, it leads me to believe it's a big deal for you. I'm glad you are speaking to your sponsor about it. My only advice is to listen to your sponsor, and listen to your heart.
chip
Follow Directions!
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Fredericksburg, Va.
Posts: 9,730
First things first, there are no rules in AA!
This is me:
Now if I decided to smoke a doobie I would reset my sobriety date, the reason being is being completely honest with myself I know damn well the only reason I smoked that number was because I needed a beer!!! In other words I would be lying to myself if I said "I smoked the number because I wanted to smoke a number to get high, the thought of it being a substitute for a beer to get high never crossed my mind!"
A huge part of sobriety is achieved by and is "Rigorous Honesty".
Pick up the last coin you got and read what it says.... "To Thine Own Self Be True."
By coming here and asking that question you have your answer! Are you being true to yourself?
The number of days since ones last drink in my opinion does not equal all the time to the number of days sober.
SugerSpun said it well:
Before you talk to your sponsor look at yourself in the mirror and ask yourself "Was I sober when I smoked the dope?" Tell your sponsor you did that and what you think you should do about your sobriety date.
If you are comfortable with not changing your sobriety date.... don't! If you are uncomfortable with keeping it then change it. Your sobriety date is determined by you.
"To Thine Own Self Be True."
This is me:
Now if I decided to smoke a doobie I would reset my sobriety date, the reason being is being completely honest with myself I know damn well the only reason I smoked that number was because I needed a beer!!! In other words I would be lying to myself if I said "I smoked the number because I wanted to smoke a number to get high, the thought of it being a substitute for a beer to get high never crossed my mind!"
A huge part of sobriety is achieved by and is "Rigorous Honesty".
Pick up the last coin you got and read what it says.... "To Thine Own Self Be True."
By coming here and asking that question you have your answer! Are you being true to yourself?
The number of days since ones last drink in my opinion does not equal all the time to the number of days sober.
SugerSpun said it well:
What do you want? To recover or to have a larger number of days sober?
If you are comfortable with not changing your sobriety date.... don't! If you are uncomfortable with keeping it then change it. Your sobriety date is determined by you.
"To Thine Own Self Be True."
The Bullseye
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Robbinsdale, MN
Posts: 39
There's a lot to think about here. Some very harsh replies, and some more kind ones. I'm not answer surfing here, just so you all know. Just trying to get a consensus of people in the program.
I spoke to my sponsor last night. He thinks that not only was it a relapse, but I should restart my sobriety clock, start with step one again, and consider getting a new sponsor. He also said I could keep my original date and he wouldn't tell anyone if it was something I was confortable with, but told me that he would raise his hand as a newcomer if he were in my shoes. Most of the things I dreaded in response to telling him. Awesome. Almost makes me feel like buying a bottle since I screwed up good. So I guess the voice of Music was the truest one here, and the voice I was going to hear from my sponsor. Throw me under the bus is the consensus.
To be honest, I know it was a stupid thing to do. No credit can be given to me for feeling bad about it. If I was going to have a dubbie and not feel anything, I should have just bought a bottle and really had a bender damn it! I gave up dipping tobacco 1/1/08, and followed it up by working on my sobriety. I even feel embarrased that I posted here, because in my heart I knew the answer already. Now the one person who I was seeking spiritual help from now has doubts whether I should continue working with him. Maybe it's better just to do this on my own and skip AA meetings?
Honesty - I guess I was not honest with myself or to God when I put that pipe up to my lips. Damn it anyway!
I have been feeling really bad since Tuesday night. My stomach is upset, and I almost feel like I have the stomach flu. Maybe it's in response to my use, or maybe it is a stomach flu. Not exactly sure.
So, what I'm going to do is keep my sobriety date, give my sponsor the choice to keep me or not, and continue staying clean. Maybe not what you all would do, but to me it was not a relapse. I am not going to jeapordize my progress, since I recognize what I've done, and actually didn't use alcohol in the end.
I thank you for your responses.
I spoke to my sponsor last night. He thinks that not only was it a relapse, but I should restart my sobriety clock, start with step one again, and consider getting a new sponsor. He also said I could keep my original date and he wouldn't tell anyone if it was something I was confortable with, but told me that he would raise his hand as a newcomer if he were in my shoes. Most of the things I dreaded in response to telling him. Awesome. Almost makes me feel like buying a bottle since I screwed up good. So I guess the voice of Music was the truest one here, and the voice I was going to hear from my sponsor. Throw me under the bus is the consensus.
To be honest, I know it was a stupid thing to do. No credit can be given to me for feeling bad about it. If I was going to have a dubbie and not feel anything, I should have just bought a bottle and really had a bender damn it! I gave up dipping tobacco 1/1/08, and followed it up by working on my sobriety. I even feel embarrased that I posted here, because in my heart I knew the answer already. Now the one person who I was seeking spiritual help from now has doubts whether I should continue working with him. Maybe it's better just to do this on my own and skip AA meetings?
Honesty - I guess I was not honest with myself or to God when I put that pipe up to my lips. Damn it anyway!
I have been feeling really bad since Tuesday night. My stomach is upset, and I almost feel like I have the stomach flu. Maybe it's in response to my use, or maybe it is a stomach flu. Not exactly sure.
So, what I'm going to do is keep my sobriety date, give my sponsor the choice to keep me or not, and continue staying clean. Maybe not what you all would do, but to me it was not a relapse. I am not going to jeapordize my progress, since I recognize what I've done, and actually didn't use alcohol in the end.
I thank you for your responses.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 2,126
Just wanted to add one little tidbit.....consensus? that's kinda like majority ain't it....? lol
I have a principle that I really love regarding 'majority' and it could be used in regards to 'consensus' too.....
Just because the majority (consensus) says something, doesn't make it true; it could just be that all the fools are on the same side......
Now, now, folks......don't git yer knickers in a twist....just joshin' but I truly love that principle.....
NoelleR
I have a principle that I really love regarding 'majority' and it could be used in regards to 'consensus' too.....
Just because the majority (consensus) says something, doesn't make it true; it could just be that all the fools are on the same side......
Now, now, folks......don't git yer knickers in a twist....just joshin' but I truly love that principle.....
NoelleR
Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 486
Relapse is not just a physical action, it is a mental one as well.
If you are still talking about "enjoying a bottle" or drinking because you screwed up then maybe reviewing the first few steps isn't such a bad idea. I guess that really depends on who you are working the program for.
Remember, you will get out of AA exactly what you put into it.
If you are still talking about "enjoying a bottle" or drinking because you screwed up then maybe reviewing the first few steps isn't such a bad idea. I guess that really depends on who you are working the program for.
Remember, you will get out of AA exactly what you put into it.
The Bullseye
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Robbinsdale, MN
Posts: 39
Originally Posted by tennis71 
Relapse is not just a physical action, it is a mental one as well.
If you are still talking about "enjoying a bottle" or drinking because you screwed up then maybe reviewing the first few steps isn't such a bad idea. I guess that really depends on who you are working the program for.
Remember, you will get out of AA exactly what you put into it.
If you are still talking about "enjoying a bottle" or drinking because you screwed up then maybe reviewing the first few steps isn't such a bad idea. I guess that really depends on who you are working the program for.
Remember, you will get out of AA exactly what you put into it.
It`s ok to stay sober
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Central NC
Posts: 20,902
tell your sponsor,change your sobriety date, and pick up a white chip
do not listen to those who tell you otherwise
this is a program which demands rigorous honesty,and you might as well start now-it is also a life or death matter in the big picture,you can see the big picture can`t you?
I did the same thing in 1987
my sponsor found out by gossip,he told me this-
you either pick up a white chip or find another sponsor,I`m too busy to have you embarking on my sobriety..I don`t play those games
I picked up a white chip,and quit smoking dope
Maybe not what you all would do, but to me it was not a relapse. I am not going to jeapordize my progress, since I recognize what I've done, and actually didn't use alcohol in the end.
it was a relapse or a slip,any way you put it..
looks like you ain`t thru drinking to me ...go get you a bottle and finish the job
do not listen to those who tell you otherwise
this is a program which demands rigorous honesty,and you might as well start now-it is also a life or death matter in the big picture,you can see the big picture can`t you?
I did the same thing in 1987
my sponsor found out by gossip,he told me this-
you either pick up a white chip or find another sponsor,I`m too busy to have you embarking on my sobriety..I don`t play those games
I picked up a white chip,and quit smoking dope
Maybe not what you all would do, but to me it was not a relapse. I am not going to jeapordize my progress, since I recognize what I've done, and actually didn't use alcohol in the end.
it was a relapse or a slip,any way you put it..
looks like you ain`t thru drinking to me ...go get you a bottle and finish the job
Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 26,425
Dodge Ram,
You've had a lot of people share experience strenght and hope with you. Also perhaps some "advice".
:ghug3
Any path you choose to take, you can always change your mind....as long as you don't drink.
Hope you can come back to this site and share with us as you go along. I value your experience as it helps me.
Thanks.
You've had a lot of people share experience strenght and hope with you. Also perhaps some "advice".
:ghug3
Any path you choose to take, you can always change your mind....as long as you don't drink.
Hope you can come back to this site and share with us as you go along. I value your experience as it helps me.
Thanks.
Administrator
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 211,436
looks like you ain`t thru drinking to me ...go get you a bottle and finish the job
this attitude always stuns me.
I'd say more...but I like it here @SR
D
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