bugsworth

I was at a meeting last night and heard the following slogan...

"Religion is for people who are afraid of going to Hell, Spirituality is for people who've been there"

argggg...this one really gets under my skin...

can anyone explain to me how this is anything other than arrogant?

stone

Bugs...that's the one slogan I like! LOL

Take what you need hun.

Why is it arrogant?

bugsworth

Stone, it seems very elitist to me. As if the suffering of an alcoholic is any greater than "ordinary" peoples suffering.

In addition aa has tried to seperate itself from "religion"....calling it a "spiritual" program thus implying some superiority over "religious" people with this slogan.

Kinda makes my skin crawl...

sugErspun

posted too soon.

anyhoo.

I don't find that slogan in any AA literature.

There are many AA members who are religious. 'Spiritual' - is more along the lines of not being tied to any particular set of beliefs.

bugsworth

sug, I doubt it is in the literature, lets face it so much of aa is not in the literature.

sugErspun

Ahh...the problem indeed.

In my experience - if it's not in the book, be careful.

Dee74

I'm sure no-one at AA would use that in an arrogant way Bugs...

D

bugsworth

Dee you are probably right...after all sobriety is not about spiritual one-up-manship, that would just be an arrogant ego game.

sugErspun

oh...

I see where this is going. I will back out and let you have at it.

I thought maybe the discussion would be about the 'slogan' you heard...

Thanks for your input Dee.

Astro

I've seen it printed in the book "The Spirituality Of Imperfection", a wonderful read for anyone in recovery. I happen to like the saying, to me it suggests humility and being brought to my knees. But like Stone said, take what ya want and leave the rest!

bugsworth

It is...that's why I posted it...

Do you like the slogan sug?

CarolD

My pet peeve is in the literature.

I simply refuse to trudge

sugErspun

No I don't care for it, in fact there are very few slogans that I like or find useful (usefullness has a direct influence on my opinion of something).

I find the statement in question to be very 'generalized', about both religion and spirituality.

nandm

For me it isn't about one upmanship it is about finding a way to live. I couldn't do it with organized religion but spirituality works for me. My pet peeve is those that try to convert everyone to their religion, that is what I find arrogant, as who is to say that their religion is any better than anyone elses. At least with spirituality I don't find people play the arrogant game, they tend to be accepting of others differences.

bugsworth

sug, I have to agree with you...I too find many of the slogans useless.

My sponsor loved them...to the point she lost all grasp of the English language...lol

a slogan a day keeps the thinking away....

bugsworth

nandm, I couldn't agree more. Nothing is more frustrating than a zealot pushing their brand of religion.

I like you, tend to turn towards people who are accepting of others differences.

Jfanagle

I have always thought of beliefs based in spirituality as rather a "generic" concept of the accepting the existence of a power greater than ourselves and the connection that one tries to make with a higher power.

Religion also applies the same concept, but seems to have "particular" and specific rituals and rules for seeking that contact, each religion being somewhat unique and therefore attractive to those for whom those ways are best suited.

SPIRITUALITY is like tissue for cleaning up ones person

RELIGION is more like Scott tissue or Kleenex brand tissue.

They all do the job and without them we would be worse off!!

I have always interpreted the quote in question as reminding me that spirituality will lead me back into the light and sometimes my failure to live up to a particular religious code or set of rules and behavior MAY make ME believe that I am on my way to hell. I think the quote/slogan was used to demonstrate to the "fallen" previously religious person that there is a way back from our depths if we will apply a spiritual approach to our lives. In my opinion any truly religious person needs to be spiritual in order to follow his or her particular religion.

Just my thoughts,

Jon

bugsworth

Thanks Jon. I love hearing different opinions!

Religion lite? lol

Astro

Ahh, but Carol, doesn't that mean to walk with a purpose? I like to think I do that every day in recovery!

Jfanagle

bugsworth,

Just remember "If we weren't all crazy we would go insane."
Jimmy Buffet

It is all fun.

Jon