A 12th step gone bad. (slightly long)
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Colorado Prairie
Posts: 1,417
A 12th step gone bad. (slightly long)
An 27 year old drinker has been in and out of our meetings for the last year. He comes in and tells us of his mysery and sticks around a couple weeks and vanishes again for about a month and tells us his story and swears to try again. It lasts about 2 weeks and repeats itself. The last time he came in I spoke with him after the meeting. He admited to living under a bridge down by the river and didn't have a job. I took him in with some strict rules and a time limit. One of the rules was to get a job. 2 Days later he was working. We set him up a savings account at a local bank and he was saving his checks. He was required to read the first 164 and attend meetings with me three times a week. He did! One month went by and he had enough money to get his own place. Not a nice place, but a start.
He came home Friday, took a shower and said he was going out to visit some people. That was the last I saw of him. Friday night at 11:00 at night I heard my truck start and drive off. That was also the last I had seen of my truck too.
Through some footwork I had come to find out he lasted until 1:00 in the morning before he was arrested. He is still in jail and we just found my truck today. It had what's left of a bottle of Vodka, his wallet and the keys in it. It sat there 5 days unlocked and undisturbed. I kind of figure he had no intentions of drinking because he left his paycheck here at the house. I still have it and I will see to it that he gets it.
Now, The Police are leaving it up to me as to whether I press charges or not. I took my situation to my Sponsor tonight for some insight. Naturally he went right to the book and had me read about 5 pages out loud and scrutinized every sentence. The summary is that I tossed it out there for God to provide me with an answer. The answer will come to me, as promised. I gave God 24 hours as that's all the police have given me.
What do you guys think!
He came home Friday, took a shower and said he was going out to visit some people. That was the last I saw of him. Friday night at 11:00 at night I heard my truck start and drive off. That was also the last I had seen of my truck too.
Through some footwork I had come to find out he lasted until 1:00 in the morning before he was arrested. He is still in jail and we just found my truck today. It had what's left of a bottle of Vodka, his wallet and the keys in it. It sat there 5 days unlocked and undisturbed. I kind of figure he had no intentions of drinking because he left his paycheck here at the house. I still have it and I will see to it that he gets it.
Now, The Police are leaving it up to me as to whether I press charges or not. I took my situation to my Sponsor tonight for some insight. Naturally he went right to the book and had me read about 5 pages out loud and scrutinized every sentence. The summary is that I tossed it out there for God to provide me with an answer. The answer will come to me, as promised. I gave God 24 hours as that's all the police have given me.
What do you guys think!
Another Day in Paradise
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Upland, CA
Posts: 900
Tough spot! I have found that when faced with a moral decision I sit quietly and "listen to god." Usually, in fact in all cases in my life I have that "gut feeling" and then I remember that when faced with that moral decision the thing that I want to do the least is the one that I must do.
Just something to chew on. It works for me. Whatever you do, best of luck.
Jon
Just something to chew on. It works for me. Whatever you do, best of luck.
Jon
Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: anomaly
Posts: 2,180
Hey just be gald your sponsee didn't have sex with your gf and stuff like that,
becuase that really suck.
What about you, how are you feeling about it ?
It can be very difficult and yes it'll effect you profoundly
of your trust in people and how you will reach out ot others recovering
aloholics again, if at all.
Your program will defferently be put through the acid test.
I'm not really sure why stuff like that happens..it happens to best of us, i guess.
Try to process your feelings and thought about it as honest as posisble.
It's okay to be angery and feel what you feel. Just do trun it inward
or take it out on someone else later.
Makes you wonder if god gose crazy sometimes having to make decisions
dosn't it ?.lol
But nothing absolutely nothing happens by mistakes, in god's world.
becuase of crazy stuff of him never cashing check...that has no logic.lol
Will that's about how it is for codies...setting rules and trying to work
someone else program for them. And off gose the alkis into another
relapsed. Now you know what i mean when i say..chaos.lol
But also at the sametime, it gave me a deeper understanding of step #9.
To be wearing the other shoes for a change...maybe that's what something
wated you to see or experience. That hurt is just not a 4 letter word.
Me..I'm a softy, i wouldn't press charges. I don't beliving throwing
anyone in jail, punishment or prison time will ulitmately help them.
And him having a record wouldn't benifit him in the long run.
Ulitimately you can't blame yourself.
becuase that really suck.
What about you, how are you feeling about it ?
It can be very difficult and yes it'll effect you profoundly
of your trust in people and how you will reach out ot others recovering
aloholics again, if at all.
Your program will defferently be put through the acid test.
I'm not really sure why stuff like that happens..it happens to best of us, i guess.
Try to process your feelings and thought about it as honest as posisble.
It's okay to be angery and feel what you feel. Just do trun it inward
or take it out on someone else later.
Makes you wonder if god gose crazy sometimes having to make decisions
dosn't it ?.lol
But nothing absolutely nothing happens by mistakes, in god's world.
becuase of crazy stuff of him never cashing check...that has no logic.lol
Will that's about how it is for codies...setting rules and trying to work
someone else program for them. And off gose the alkis into another
relapsed. Now you know what i mean when i say..chaos.lol
But also at the sametime, it gave me a deeper understanding of step #9.
To be wearing the other shoes for a change...maybe that's what something
wated you to see or experience. That hurt is just not a 4 letter word.
Me..I'm a softy, i wouldn't press charges. I don't beliving throwing
anyone in jail, punishment or prison time will ulitmately help them.
And him having a record wouldn't benifit him in the long run.
Ulitimately you can't blame yourself.
Follow Directions!
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Fredericksburg, Va.
Posts: 9,730
cuda turn it over is what I would do, ask your HP which would benefit him more long term in life.
1. Being allowed to get away with grand theft auto suffering no consequences for his own actions.
2. Suffering the consequences for his own actions.
What would give him the maximum benefit?
Keep in mind that even though this is your choice you owe him no apology one way or the other.
I am going to be honest and say I am glad I am not in your shoes, for me this I would have to turn over for a decision to be made.
On one hand if you do not press charges you would be showing him forgiveness and he may benefit from that and turn his life around being given another chance or he might just say "Cool, and continue down the path he is on because he suffered no consequences for his actions.
On the other hand if you do press charges this could wind up being a blessing for him, it would allow him to see where his drinking is taking him, putting him either at his bottom or closer to it. There is nothing to stop you from talking to him and explaining why you pressed charges.
Pray and meditate, turn it over and let your HP lead you to the right decision.
1. Being allowed to get away with grand theft auto suffering no consequences for his own actions.
2. Suffering the consequences for his own actions.
What would give him the maximum benefit?
Keep in mind that even though this is your choice you owe him no apology one way or the other.
I am going to be honest and say I am glad I am not in your shoes, for me this I would have to turn over for a decision to be made.
On one hand if you do not press charges you would be showing him forgiveness and he may benefit from that and turn his life around being given another chance or he might just say "Cool, and continue down the path he is on because he suffered no consequences for his actions.
On the other hand if you do press charges this could wind up being a blessing for him, it would allow him to see where his drinking is taking him, putting him either at his bottom or closer to it. There is nothing to stop you from talking to him and explaining why you pressed charges.
Pray and meditate, turn it over and let your HP lead you to the right decision.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Newton Iowa
Posts: 157
So, how did it go bad?
You stayed sober and tried to carry the message. You do the work and leave the results to your HP. You get to grow in your recovery. Thats the way this thing works!
So, how did it go bad?
Bill W. used to joke about all the drunks that fought and broke things in His house, but I dont think He ever called the law on them.
Good luck & keep working with those wet ones!
You stayed sober and tried to carry the message. You do the work and leave the results to your HP. You get to grow in your recovery. Thats the way this thing works!
So, how did it go bad?
Bill W. used to joke about all the drunks that fought and broke things in His house, but I dont think He ever called the law on them.
Good luck & keep working with those wet ones!
Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: .
Posts: 299
My sense is that you shouldn't press charges, but that you should cut all ties with the guy.
He does seem to have made some serious efforts to get straight, and if he gets banged up on a car theft charge now, all of that might just go out the window, for the sake of one incredibly stupid night.
But at the same time, what he did was an terrible betrayal of your trust and kindness, one that can't just be shrugged off like that. So I would sit down with him, tell him what you think, tell him you won't press charges but you don't want to see or speak with him again, except at meetings where you both happen to be.
He does seem to have made some serious efforts to get straight, and if he gets banged up on a car theft charge now, all of that might just go out the window, for the sake of one incredibly stupid night.
But at the same time, what he did was an terrible betrayal of your trust and kindness, one that can't just be shrugged off like that. So I would sit down with him, tell him what you think, tell him you won't press charges but you don't want to see or speak with him again, except at meetings where you both happen to be.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: MA.
Posts: 1,719
Ummm...
I am so sorry this happened to you...You have a kind heart to help the sick and suffering...
I have had similar situations happen to me over the course of the years...I had to learn the hard way that you can't save anyone...
Blessings to you...
I am so sorry this happened to you...You have a kind heart to help the sick and suffering...
I have had similar situations happen to me over the course of the years...I had to learn the hard way that you can't save anyone...
Blessings to you...
Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Leaving Sparta
Posts: 2,912
The proverbial "rock and a hard place" , "the devil and the deep blue sea"
*sigh*
I like the others balk at the thought of giving advice but even when i 'turn things over to my HP" I know that answers often come through the voice of my friends in recovery.
I dunno, I suppose if I were in your position I would be reluctant to press charges, but even so I think our young alcohol friend will have to deal with the consequences of breaking the trust of a friend. In other words it may be a very long time before I was able to trust and physically support him again.
Either way best of luck to both of you.
*sigh*
I like the others balk at the thought of giving advice but even when i 'turn things over to my HP" I know that answers often come through the voice of my friends in recovery.
I dunno, I suppose if I were in your position I would be reluctant to press charges, but even so I think our young alcohol friend will have to deal with the consequences of breaking the trust of a friend. In other words it may be a very long time before I was able to trust and physically support him again.
Either way best of luck to both of you.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Sunny Florida
Posts: 73
What was he arrested for? DUI? Grand theft? The officer had to see the open vodka container....no? How did he get your truck key? If he left to meet people and then he came back?
You said he didn't take his paycheck -- did he drink with friends and then they dropped him off and he wasn't ready to quit?
I think we've all been there.
It's a tough decision but you know what's in your gut. And, God will guide you.
You said he didn't take his paycheck -- did he drink with friends and then they dropped him off and he wasn't ready to quit?
I think we've all been there.
It's a tough decision but you know what's in your gut. And, God will guide you.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: green hills of Vermont, USA
Posts: 251
Pinkcuda, as much as I understand the compulsion to drink, I fail to understand how even under the influence, someone who is basically honest can become dishonest. I know, I know, folks will tell me otherwise. But even drunk, I never stole, I never had any sexual escapades... the worst I did, on a few rare occasions, was to drive under the influence. As soon as I had some experience with that, I didn't want to do it anymore cuz I knew I could hurt someone else. What I'm leading up to saying is that although I don't want to see this guy get hurt with a criminal record, especially if there is any way his behavior can be rationalized...(had you ever offered open-ended use of your vehicle?) and apparently your truck was OK, most people who will do something criminal need to understand the consequences before they begin to "think first". So I am leaning slightly toward advising you to press charges.
The Big Book has stories of the early recovering alcoholics opening their homes to those in need, even when they had little to share. Wow, I'm different, I protect myself from anyone who might take advantage, especially while having a slip. Just a different personality, I guess. But I give you a lot of credit for your generosity.
I hope you find a good solution to this problem.
The Big Book has stories of the early recovering alcoholics opening their homes to those in need, even when they had little to share. Wow, I'm different, I protect myself from anyone who might take advantage, especially while having a slip. Just a different personality, I guess. But I give you a lot of credit for your generosity.
I hope you find a good solution to this problem.
Guest
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Mpls, Mn
Posts: 55
Pinkcuda,
When my teen-age addict son threatened his Mom with a knife for insisting he go to school, she called the police. They transported him to a lock-up hospital ward. She pressed charges and I totally supported her in that.
He had to go to court, where he pled out and took what the court gave him. I'd do the same again. He is doing well now, 4 years later.
It was not your choice to break the law, it was your guest's. If he does not have an extensive record the court will probably not bite with very many teeth.
BTW, here in Minnesota if he had hurt someone while driving drunk in your vehicle you would be faced with criminal charges if the DA thought you had given him permission.
So, if it was me, I would probably prosecute. Since there was no injury, and you are forgiving, he is likely to get a break from the Court, but still get enough reality to help him concentrate.
When my teen-age addict son threatened his Mom with a knife for insisting he go to school, she called the police. They transported him to a lock-up hospital ward. She pressed charges and I totally supported her in that.
He had to go to court, where he pled out and took what the court gave him. I'd do the same again. He is doing well now, 4 years later.
It was not your choice to break the law, it was your guest's. If he does not have an extensive record the court will probably not bite with very many teeth.
BTW, here in Minnesota if he had hurt someone while driving drunk in your vehicle you would be faced with criminal charges if the DA thought you had given him permission.
So, if it was me, I would probably prosecute. Since there was no injury, and you are forgiving, he is likely to get a break from the Court, but still get enough reality to help him concentrate.
Last edited by Fenian_Man; 10-25-2007 at 11:37 AM. Reason: typo
Coffee Drinker
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Lobstah Land
Posts: 1,122
From an early AA Akron Pamphlet:
Out of all this trouble, this disruption of your life, what reward do you
expect? Do you expect a pat on the back? Do you expect your "baby" to throw
business your way or become a client? You DO NOT. Your only reward, and it
comes without asking, will be the feeling of having done some good, perhaps
saved a life., brought a little happiness into this world.
And if your "baby" is not a success, if AA doesn't take with him, are you
going to throw up the sponge? Are you going to tie one on your self? Are you
going to sulk and give it all up as a bad job?
You are not. You will continue your Twelfth Step work, giving another
alcoholic the same break that someone gave you.
You have performed a completely selfless act, an act of pure love. And
whether or not you realize it: YOU HAVE HAD A SPIRITUAL EXPERIENCE!
I hope the answer comes to you soon my friend.
Out of all this trouble, this disruption of your life, what reward do you
expect? Do you expect a pat on the back? Do you expect your "baby" to throw
business your way or become a client? You DO NOT. Your only reward, and it
comes without asking, will be the feeling of having done some good, perhaps
saved a life., brought a little happiness into this world.
And if your "baby" is not a success, if AA doesn't take with him, are you
going to throw up the sponge? Are you going to tie one on your self? Are you
going to sulk and give it all up as a bad job?
You are not. You will continue your Twelfth Step work, giving another
alcoholic the same break that someone gave you.
You have performed a completely selfless act, an act of pure love. And
whether or not you realize it: YOU HAVE HAD A SPIRITUAL EXPERIENCE!
I hope the answer comes to you soon my friend.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Colorado Prairie
Posts: 1,417
The story goes like this; He just came by and helped himself to my truck and drove it to a bar about 20 miles away. He was asked to leave the bar after he got too drunk for them to manage. He wouldn't leave so he was arrested for trespassing and obstruction. He has been in jail since Fri night/Sat morning. His bond hearing was Monday morning and the bond was set at $4000.00 and the arraignment s Friday. He'll probably be there a while as it will take about three to four months before he gets his court date. That is just for those two charges.
I have made the decision not to pursue charges for theft. I'll let God deal with him. This persons life is such a mess right now that he will die under a bridge, end up in Prison, or pull his head out of his ass and follow our path. Those things are certain, regardless of my decision today. "Thy will, not mine, be done! God's going to handle this guy and I am relieved of it. There are no resentments, no ill will, and my conscience can remain clean.
Zoobear, you hit it on the head. It didn't go bad. I used a poor choice of words. The 12 step did exactly what it was supposed to do. You guys are cool, thanks for the input!!!
I have made the decision not to pursue charges for theft. I'll let God deal with him. This persons life is such a mess right now that he will die under a bridge, end up in Prison, or pull his head out of his ass and follow our path. Those things are certain, regardless of my decision today. "Thy will, not mine, be done! God's going to handle this guy and I am relieved of it. There are no resentments, no ill will, and my conscience can remain clean.
Zoobear, you hit it on the head. It didn't go bad. I used a poor choice of words. The 12 step did exactly what it was supposed to do. You guys are cool, thanks for the input!!!
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