Not Counting Sobriety Days
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 773
Not Counting Sobriety Days
I am sick and tired of people at AA meetings demanding to know "how much time I have." I do not count days (although I have a general idea) and find it offensive when members question me. These AA "bullies" have been turning me away from meetings a bit. I especially dislike AA "old-timers" who constantly boast about their 10, 15, 20 years of sobriety. I don't look up to these arrogant people. For me, counting days and collecting chips has been very harmful and hurtful. I have an opinion today and I guess I can be grateful to AA for that very reason.
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Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Zion, Illinois
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Well Tib, you can count days or not count days. That's up to you. I don't count days, I count years and I'm at 30 years plus. I say that not to boast but to let you and others know it's possible to go that long without drinking. The program works if I work it. Caution: The worst resentment is one against AA or anyone in AA. Be careful.
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Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Fredericksburg, Va.
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Tib if you were a newcomer and no one in meetings shared how much time they had how much hope would that give you?
You look at some one saying they have 20 years as a braggard, I view that as them showing me that there is hope for an old drunk like me to stay sober for the rest of my days.
I am amazed that anyone stays sober in Chicago with the vicous way that the old timers your your area attack those with less time then them by bragging about how long they have been sober.
I saw a guy pick up his 33 year chip, I had about 2-3 months then and was so filled with hope to see that someone could remain sober that long I had to ask the man how he had done it and he simply smiled a warm smile and said "Martin I did it just like every one else....... one day at a time."
I would have to assume in your area if someone picked up a 33 year chip they would take it and say in a loud boisterous voice "IN YOUR FACE TURKEYS!!! IN YOUR FACE!"
You look at some one saying they have 20 years as a braggard, I view that as them showing me that there is hope for an old drunk like me to stay sober for the rest of my days.
I am amazed that anyone stays sober in Chicago with the vicous way that the old timers your your area attack those with less time then them by bragging about how long they have been sober.
I saw a guy pick up his 33 year chip, I had about 2-3 months then and was so filled with hope to see that someone could remain sober that long I had to ask the man how he had done it and he simply smiled a warm smile and said "Martin I did it just like every one else....... one day at a time."
I would have to assume in your area if someone picked up a 33 year chip they would take it and say in a loud boisterous voice "IN YOUR FACE TURKEYS!!! IN YOUR FACE!"
Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: green hills of Vermont, USA
Posts: 251
In the years when I don't celebrate my sobriety anniversary, I feel as though I am not being of service. That's because I know that what brought me into the rooms of AA was the knowledge that certain friends with severe alcohol problems had managed to stay sober for many years through AA. If they could do it, maybe I had a chance.
My celebration is for others, so they can know it works. I'm actually embarrassed to sit up there and then have to say something meaningful. There was a period in my recovery when I used to manage to work info about my length of sobriety into my sharing. Why don't I do that any more? I bet it was defensive since I don't tend to want to one-up others. Something has changed that I no longer need to do that. Now ya got me thinking.
I know it's something about good manners, which for me involves making others feel comfortable. Around here we sure do respect those with serious time, but I think we all know there are some with over 20 years whose behavior is still sick. So it's not automatic respect.
It sounds as though where you are, this one-upsmanship about sobriety time is an unfortunate behavior that got started somehow. Sort of the rotten apple syndrome. I wish I had advice besides this: STICK WITH THE WINNERS. Find 'em first, then attach yourself if possible.
Best wishes from the Snowgoose.
My celebration is for others, so they can know it works. I'm actually embarrassed to sit up there and then have to say something meaningful. There was a period in my recovery when I used to manage to work info about my length of sobriety into my sharing. Why don't I do that any more? I bet it was defensive since I don't tend to want to one-up others. Something has changed that I no longer need to do that. Now ya got me thinking.
I know it's something about good manners, which for me involves making others feel comfortable. Around here we sure do respect those with serious time, but I think we all know there are some with over 20 years whose behavior is still sick. So it's not automatic respect.
It sounds as though where you are, this one-upsmanship about sobriety time is an unfortunate behavior that got started somehow. Sort of the rotten apple syndrome. I wish I had advice besides this: STICK WITH THE WINNERS. Find 'em first, then attach yourself if possible.
Best wishes from the Snowgoose.
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Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Righthere, Rightnow
Posts: 1,424
The time dilemma.
Some members do look at it as a sort of ranking system. I think that is BS. On the other hand, it is inspirational to see that the program can work long term, but it is still one day at a time no matter how long one is sober.
The book clearly says that what we have is “a daily reprieve” based on the maintenance of our spiritual condition – nothing more, nothing less. I don’t think anyone has anything but today, or perhaps more accurately, right now. And that is a gift, not an accomplishment IMHO. Don’t get me wrong. I believe action is required.
re•prieve
1. to delay the impending punishment or sentence of (a condemned person).
2. to relieve temporarily from any evil.
–noun
3. a respite from impending punishment, as from execution of a sentence of death.
4. a warrant authorizing this.
5. any respite or temporary relief.
The book clearly says that what we have is “a daily reprieve” based on the maintenance of our spiritual condition – nothing more, nothing less. I don’t think anyone has anything but today, or perhaps more accurately, right now. And that is a gift, not an accomplishment IMHO. Don’t get me wrong. I believe action is required.
re•prieve
1. to delay the impending punishment or sentence of (a condemned person).
2. to relieve temporarily from any evil.
–noun
3. a respite from impending punishment, as from execution of a sentence of death.
4. a warrant authorizing this.
5. any respite or temporary relief.
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Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Fredericksburg, Va.
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A question to ponder for us all:
Who needs to take a look at them selves and their spiritual condition more;
1. The person who uses their sober time as a club or bragging right?
2. The person who resents those with a lot of sober time?
3. The person who shares their amount of sober time as a means to offer hope to the newcomer?
Just my take on it, but I hope and pray that I am number 3 if I get a lot of time under my belt.
If I was number one I would need to do some serious self evaluation as to how my actions/attitude may be effecting newcomers and others in the rooms.
If I was number 2 I would need to do some serious self evaluation as to why I feel that way, is it because they are really a number 1, or is it because I am simply envious of the person with a lot of time and as a result I blindly see anything they say as a direct judgement of me or others?
Who needs to take a look at them selves and their spiritual condition more;
1. The person who uses their sober time as a club or bragging right?
2. The person who resents those with a lot of sober time?
3. The person who shares their amount of sober time as a means to offer hope to the newcomer?
Just my take on it, but I hope and pray that I am number 3 if I get a lot of time under my belt.
If I was number one I would need to do some serious self evaluation as to how my actions/attitude may be effecting newcomers and others in the rooms.
If I was number 2 I would need to do some serious self evaluation as to why I feel that way, is it because they are really a number 1, or is it because I am simply envious of the person with a lot of time and as a result I blindly see anything they say as a direct judgement of me or others?
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Ok, I'll come clean on this...I have 17 years coming up on 9/3 (less than 2 weeks) and was not planning on getting a coin. I was using the false-humility excuse for not doing this (i.e. do want to be a braggart), where in reality I am not very close to many people in the fellowship like I used to be. There are a variety of reasons for this, for me it's mainly pride and laziness.
I think that getting a coin is good for newcomers because it instills hope. Yes, there are many old timers who have a variety of personality issues. A big one I've seen over the years is the inability to stay married. This doesn't discount the fact that they have managed to stay sober and that they have a right to proclaim it.
I think that getting a coin is good for newcomers because it instills hope. Yes, there are many old timers who have a variety of personality issues. A big one I've seen over the years is the inability to stay married. This doesn't discount the fact that they have managed to stay sober and that they have a right to proclaim it.
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Originally Posted by Tazman53 
3. The person who shares their amount of sober time as a means to offer hope to the newcomer?
The amount of sobriety time I have and the chips I carry aren't a means of feeding my ego. Hopefully they're an inspiration to the newcomer and the alcoholics who are still suffering, a way of showing that the program works.
not a greeter
Join Date: Nov 2006
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So don't count your days Tiburon. If someone asks, can't you just say something along the lines of "I don't keep track numbers but I know I am sober today, thanks for asking" ?
Or don't. It's up to you
.
Or don't. It's up to you
.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: green hills of Vermont, USA
Posts: 251
Originally Posted by mike_mass
I think that getting a coin is good for newcomers because it instills hope. Yes, there are many old timers who have a variety of personality issues. A big one I've seen over the years is the inability to stay married. This doesn't discount the fact that they have managed to stay sober and that they have a right to proclaim it.
And I want to second your observation in the second part of the paragraph I quoted. The miracle for any of us is that we have stayed sober. I so often think that when I'm fussing over others' not-perfect behaviors that affect me, that the miracle - really - is that they have stayed sober, hang the rest of the problems. (I seriously do try to avoid taking others' inventories. Sometimes I do have to find a way to protect myself, though. And the incident that started this thread is a good example of that kind of thing.)
Cheers to all from the Snowgoose.
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Lobstah Land
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I have heard a saying around here to the effect of:
"Too many years, not enough days."
Referring to a long-timer that is not practicing the principles of AA well.
In your place I would be tempted to reply with something like:
What time did you get up this morning? If you got up earlier than me than you have more sobriety today.
How long someone has remained sober has very little to do with weather or not they are serene and joyous in their sobriety. Some, it seems are still white-knuckling it after many years.
Early AA did not have chips for lengths of sobriety, they are a fairly new phenomenon.
Ted
"Too many years, not enough days."
Referring to a long-timer that is not practicing the principles of AA well.
In your place I would be tempted to reply with something like:
What time did you get up this morning? If you got up earlier than me than you have more sobriety today.
How long someone has remained sober has very little to do with weather or not they are serene and joyous in their sobriety. Some, it seems are still white-knuckling it after many years.
Early AA did not have chips for lengths of sobriety, they are a fairly new phenomenon.
Ted
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 773
I think I will tell members who ask that I am sober since 6am (the time I woke up). I think that would be better than cussing them out. I just think that if you have 20 years sober & still need to go to AA meetings every day, you have a problem.
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Originally Posted by tiburon88
I just think that if you have 20 years sober & still need to go to AA meetings every day, you have a problem.
DOS: 11/6/10
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I confess, I'm one of the people who find hope and joy in the length of others' sobriety. It's not a "one-up" to me at all... I always feel like it's a sign that it CAN be done... a happy life without alcohol is possible and here in front of me is the living proof.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: green hills of Vermont, USA
Posts: 251
Originally Posted by tiburon88
I think I will tell members who ask that I am sober since 6am (the time I woke up). I think that would be better than cussing them out. I just think that if you have 20 years sober & still need to go to AA meetings every day, you have a problem.
Said lovingly by the Snowgoose.
Another Day in Paradise
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Upland, CA
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While attending an AA meeting a few months ago I asked a gentleman with 56 years(he is 87 years old), why he still came to meetings? He told me that "I am 56 years away from my last drink, but just as close to my next as anyone here." So much for "still having a problem”.
When I first came to AA, a few years ago, I found it hard to believe that people had gone 90 days without a drink, let alone years without one. They did give me hope that it is possible to stop drinking. When I get my car repaired I am very interested in how long the "warranty" on the "repair work" is good for. In a way the results are what I look for before investing my money or my TIME in a particular remedy. It may just be that AA would not attract as many clients if we didn't have some idea of its effectiveness.
After all, isn't any form of "advertising" bragging in a way?
Just some random thoughts from an ex-drunk.
When I first came to AA, a few years ago, I found it hard to believe that people had gone 90 days without a drink, let alone years without one. They did give me hope that it is possible to stop drinking. When I get my car repaired I am very interested in how long the "warranty" on the "repair work" is good for. In a way the results are what I look for before investing my money or my TIME in a particular remedy. It may just be that AA would not attract as many clients if we didn't have some idea of its effectiveness.
After all, isn't any form of "advertising" bragging in a way?
Just some random thoughts from an ex-drunk.
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