PaperDolls

C and I are going through something bad with our dogs. We've got three that are like our kids.

One is a 14 year old schnauzer that is having some medical problems and generally doesn't feel well. The second is a 8 or 9 year old boxer/blue heeler mix. The schnauzer is about 20 lbs and the boxer is about 55lbs. It always seemed to me that the schnauzer was the dominate alpha dog (both are females). Over the last few days as the schnauzer has gotten more sick she's been very grumpy and growling at the other dogs. It seems the boxer is tired of it and is being very aggressive to the schnauzer. Almost like she is trying to kill her! She's going for the neck. I've done a little reading and it's not out of the question that the boxer senses that the schnauzer is sick and is trying to kill her. I'm fairly certain that the schnauzer will be alive for quite a few more years. I don't think she's sick to the point of being near death although I know she's up there in years.

We've talked with our vet briefly about this aggression but haven't gotten a clear answer yet. We will be taking the schnauzer back to him soon, like tomorrow, because of her not feeling well. In the meantime, we're having to keep the two dogs separated and when they are not separated we've got to pay very close attention to them. At this point C and I are trying to figure out what to do. Will be able to keep the boxer? We both love her so, so much and be all accounts she is the best dog ever. Very sweet & passive. She also plays like a puppy with our younger chihuahua (about 7 lbs). I've never seen the boxer be aggressive to the chihuahua, whom she could kill in one bite.

The schnauzer and the boxer have lived together in peace since 1999. Is the boxer trying to become alpha? Will she kill the schnauzer? Is it possible for us to train her and get rid of this behavior?

I just don't know what to do and I'm not sure I could handle getting rid of her. We've had her since 1999 and I don't know what I'd do without her.

Anna

That is strange!

I really hope you talk to your Vet about the behaviour problem because it would be such a shame to not be able to figure out this issue. Obviously something is wrong to make the boxer change his attitude. It could even be that he has some medical issue. Keep looking for information and I wish you luck with this. Our pets are so very special.

Jules62

Hi PD!

I have worked with dogs for 8 years now (still do) so I know a little about this stuff.I'm not a dog behaviorist-but have studied it.

I would definitely say yes-your boxer has sensed weakness in your schnauzer and is wanting to be the alpha.Dogs are pack animals and are highly sensitive to changes within the pack.In wolf packs, if the alpha wolf is injured a younger wolf will challenge it for leadership and either the existing alpha will win the fight-or-it will be abandoned by the pack.I know it sounds cruel but that's their dynamic and dogs aren't much different.

Keeping them separated for now is a wise move.I would hold off making any serious decisions about giving your boxer away until after your schnauzer is well again.The boxer may go back to her normal self once she senses the schnauzer is okay again.You CAN train them to live together peacefully-and a very important part of this is that YOU become the alpha-not any of your dogs.It is a real key in having several dogs live together in the same house without fighting.There are specific signals and rituals you can do every day to teach your dogs you are the leader-and I'm happy to share them with you.

If it's possible-get hold of a copy of a book called 'The Dog Listener' by Jan Fennell.She goes through the 4 things you need to do to teach your dogs that you are the leader-and it's done in a very gentle way-but is so effective.She has helped people with dogs who were about to be put down because of aggressive behavior and there are tons of examples in her book of situations similar to yours-and how to overcome them.I highly reccommend it.It certainly has helped me here.(I look after other peoples dogs in my home so I have up to 6 dogs here at any time and they HAVE to get along-but they do because they know I'm in charge)

I am sure you can work this out.If there's anything I can do to help let me know.I know how precious our furbabies are to us and you don't have to lose any of yours.

Love, Julesxox

PaperDolls

Thanks Jules. I'm going tonight to get that book.

One other time the boxer went for another dog. C's parents dog, who at the time wasn't feeling well. At that time, we have two different vets tell us that once a dog wants to kill another, it's ingrained in their head. We now can't have C's parents dog with our boxer. I pray that that's not the case with our schnauzer and boxer.

I've done some reading today and I've realized we really aren't in charge of our dogs. Not like we should be. The schnauzer seems to be alpha over the other two but the boxer does display some alpha traits as well. The schnauzer use to be able to put the boxer into submission with just a little growl or bark. C is taking the schnauzer to the vet in about an hour. I just hope that he can figure out what's wrong with her and all of this can be over.

Jules62

You're welcome

Let me know how it goes with the vet.I'm sure you can work this out.

Love, Jules xox

PaperDolls

I'm hopeful it can be worked out too.
C isn't so positive about it. The schnauzer has been her dog since a puppy and is her baby. She loves the boxer but the schnauzer comes first to her. For me, the boxer comes first.

Oy!

I'll keep you posted.

PaperDolls

Well, we still don't know much yet. We should hear from the vet today on blood work he took from the schnauzer.

C is afraid, no matter what happens with the schnauzer we may not be able to keep the boxer. I haven't seen her go after the schnauzer but she's been keeping her distance and they look at each other funny.

I was so stressed out thinking about it last night.

This morning when I left I had to put the boxer in the bedroom with the door shut and she looks at me with these big sad eyes. I hate it.

I keep thinking there is a way for me to fix it.

I placed an order for the book you recommended Jules. Thanks!

Jules62

((((((((((PD))))))))))

Sweetie, I SO believe you don't have to give away the boxer.It should be an absolute last resort. I really wish I lived near by-I'd love to come over and help.I'm really glad you ordered the book-I hope it gets there soon.The ideas in it have helped so many people with difficult situations like yours.I would really hate to see you not have the chance to try to fix this.I really think you can!

You must feel so stressed and I'm really sorry.Don't give up yet though.There is hope.Keep me posted on what happens won't you?

PaperDolls

I have hope that it can be fixed. C doesn't have as much and I don't think the vet does either. All I can do is try.

I'll keep you posted.

If the schnauzer turns out to be sick, C won't handle it well. Actually, neither will I but I'll have to be strong for her.

Thanks for you advice and encouragement Jules.

gypsytears

I read this earlier PD. I don't have any answers for you, but wanted to let you know I'm thinking about you. Hopefully there is an answer in that book or with the vet. Losing or letting go of pets is an extremely difficult thing. I know... I've been there. Hoping it won't come to it .