What enabling thoughts do you have when dwelling on wanting to drink?
Open Minded
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: NZ
Posts: 226
What enabling thoughts do you have when dwelling on wanting to drink?
I'm in weekly counselling, have been for a long time, and have addressed a lot of addiction related issues. My counsellor has asked me to keep a journal again, which I am going to start today. Specifically related to my alcohol consupmtion.
One thing I want to counter is the enabling thoughts that rationalise and minimalise my 'knowings' about the consequences of getting drunk. Does that make sense?
For me it's
1) Oh 'just a few' and then I'll stop (which I have been able to do on occasion but generally it leads in heavy drinking again after a week or two.)
2) It's 'only' another twenty bucks (man have I spent a lot of money on alcohol during my life)
3) I 'deserve' it, I've worked hard this week at Uni
4) It doesn't matter, I'm not harming anyone (other than me of course)
5) 'Blow it, who cares anyway' (that's the most dangerous one, that's at the point that I stop caring and grab my keys to get to the bottle store.)
I'm sure there's more. Anyone else?
One thing I want to counter is the enabling thoughts that rationalise and minimalise my 'knowings' about the consequences of getting drunk. Does that make sense?
For me it's
1) Oh 'just a few' and then I'll stop (which I have been able to do on occasion but generally it leads in heavy drinking again after a week or two.)
2) It's 'only' another twenty bucks (man have I spent a lot of money on alcohol during my life)
3) I 'deserve' it, I've worked hard this week at Uni
4) It doesn't matter, I'm not harming anyone (other than me of course)
5) 'Blow it, who cares anyway' (that's the most dangerous one, that's at the point that I stop caring and grab my keys to get to the bottle store.)
I'm sure there's more. Anyone else?
Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Leaving Sparta
Posts: 2,912
I am not sure I understand your use of the word "enabling" in conjunction with the fact that you are the addict.
I have never heard of an addict "enabling"' himself but maybe I am not understanding your post.
I have never heard of an addict "enabling"' himself but maybe I am not understanding your post.
Open Minded
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: NZ
Posts: 226
Hrm, ok, I'll try to explain it a little clearer. Those thoughts enable the continuation of my addiction. Those are the excuses I use (for want of a better word) when I'm considering drinking, that enable my 'acting out', my trip to the bottle store and taking my first drink. Does that help?
Member
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Cumming, Ga
Posts: 665
I think of this as the lies we tell ourselves in the slimest hope that we will be able to drink normally. That some how next time it will be different. It is the fantasy that some how, some way we will be able to control our drinking again. This is called insanity. Now, the thought of "it's just hurting me" doesn't take into account the unmanageability of our lives. When I did an unmanageability list I was clearly able to see how others were effected by my drinking. No relationship was spared, nor friendship. I wouldn't call these enabling thoughts...I call them alcoholic thoughts. I have an alcoholic mind that minimizes the severity of my disease.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Murrieta, Ca
Posts: 2,683
Hi there need2free.
I found I couldn't think myself out of my drinking problem. All the self knowledge in the world was of no use. If I knew why I drank, what happened when I drank, and what happened after I drank, I'd still drink.
Sobriety takes action, and change. I found I had to change my entire outlook and attitude about life. The change I made was to try and quit being so self centered, and think about how I can help others. These ideas, and others, have been taught me through the program of AA.
It's not easy, but it's worth it in the end.
I found I couldn't think myself out of my drinking problem. All the self knowledge in the world was of no use. If I knew why I drank, what happened when I drank, and what happened after I drank, I'd still drink.
Sobriety takes action, and change. I found I had to change my entire outlook and attitude about life. The change I made was to try and quit being so self centered, and think about how I can help others. These ideas, and others, have been taught me through the program of AA.
It's not easy, but it's worth it in the end.
Open Minded
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: NZ
Posts: 226
Thanks folks!
I find it has been helpful as a part of my recovery to journal and discover this self knowledge, and I find it interesting. I don't think I'm doing it to be self absorbed as it were. Counselling and therapy is a good thing I think.
Maybe GP and BP44 you are seeing a bigger picture and past this thinking to the greater consequences of alcoholism. For now I'm finding this process useful in my recovery :0)
I find it has been helpful as a part of my recovery to journal and discover this self knowledge, and I find it interesting. I don't think I'm doing it to be self absorbed as it were. Counselling and therapy is a good thing I think.
Maybe GP and BP44 you are seeing a bigger picture and past this thinking to the greater consequences of alcoholism. For now I'm finding this process useful in my recovery :0)
Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Colorado Springs CO
Posts: 889
It didn't really matter. If I wanted a drink, I'd think whatever was necessary to ease the conflict of getting one, or think nothing at all. Something had to be done so I wouldn't want that first drink. If I wanted a drink right now, I'd probably be having one.
Forward we go...side by side-Rest In Peace
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Serene In Dixie
Posts: 36,740
Hmm.."adiction related issues" ???
if you are dwelling on drinking
and making rationales for drinking
are you saying you are an alcoholic?
That is what I did when
I was in active alcoholism.
No need to answer me...
just yourself.
if you are dwelling on drinking
and making rationales for drinking
are you saying you are an alcoholic?
That is what I did when
I was in active alcoholism.
No need to answer me...
just yourself.
Coffee Drinker
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Lobstah Land
Posts: 1,122
From the book: "Beyond the Influence".
Be sure to schedule an initial consultation with the therapist. During this interview, ask the therapist to explain his or her beliefs about alcoholism. Listen carefully to the answer. Here is the general answer you are most likely to get: "I believe alcoholism is a disease." At that point, ask: "What exactly do you mean by the word disease?" If you hear some thing along the lines of "Alcoholism is a symptom of other life problems" or "Alcoholism is a maladaptive behavior rooted in psychological conflict," say, "Thank you very much for your time," and schedule an interview with another therapist. What if the therapist says something like, "Alcoholism is a disease, I have no question about that fact. Still, it seems to me that you might also be depressed-have you ever considered taking medication for your depression?" This happens often, and here's how you should respond: "Do you think that my depression is caused by alcoholism or that it is an independent problem?" The answer to this question will tell you whether or not the therapist is considering a dual diagnosis.
Dual diagnosis is an extremely controversial topic in alcoholism treatment circles. In many treatment centers the majority of alcoholics are labeled dual-diagnosis patients and treated for both alcoholism and, say, chronic depression or chronic anxiety; treatment for psychological disturbances often involves the use of various medications including antidepressants, sleeping pills, mood elevators, or sedatives. Too often the diagnosis is made on the basis of the patient's presenting symptoms-the recovering alcoholic is clearly anxious, depressed, or suicidal-and no effort is made to review the patient's history to determine if the anxiety or depression existed prior to the use of alcohol and/or other drugs.
When the primary problem is alcoholism, it is highly likely that the secondary symptoms of depression, suicidal thoughts, anxiety, and panic attacks will improve rapidly over a period of several days or weeks of abstinence, eventually disappearing without the need for medication. A dual diagnosis, in these cases, would constitute a misdiagnosis, for the disruptions in thought, mood, and behavior are not separate disorders at all but consequences of alcoholism. In most cases these symptoms will abate after several weeks of abstinence and disappear after several months. If the psychological symptoms continue unabated or worsen as time goes on, the need for medication can be reevaluated.
Some recovering alcoholics do benefit from antidepressant medication in the early stages of recovery, but in determining who is a candidate for medication, this essential question must be asked: Is the recovering alcoholic's depression related to the lingering effects of the disease and thus destined to lift over time, or is the depression a separate disorder that predated the drinking and will continue despite abstinence? If the depression is not severe or debilitating, many alcoholism experts and clinicians will advise you to wait three or four months (or longer, in some cases) before taking medication. They don't want you to suffer unnecessarily, but they also don't want to jump to conclusions or suggest therapies that might
jeopardize your sobriety.
Although many recovering alcoholics have experienced relief from depression, anxiety, insomnia, and obsessive-compulsive disorders by taking the class of antidepressants known as SSRIs, these drugs are not, unfortunately, without their problems (see Chapter 11). Our general rec ommendation is to approach all long-term drug treatments with caution.
Be sure to schedule an initial consultation with the therapist. During this interview, ask the therapist to explain his or her beliefs about alcoholism. Listen carefully to the answer. Here is the general answer you are most likely to get: "I believe alcoholism is a disease." At that point, ask: "What exactly do you mean by the word disease?" If you hear some thing along the lines of "Alcoholism is a symptom of other life problems" or "Alcoholism is a maladaptive behavior rooted in psychological conflict," say, "Thank you very much for your time," and schedule an interview with another therapist. What if the therapist says something like, "Alcoholism is a disease, I have no question about that fact. Still, it seems to me that you might also be depressed-have you ever considered taking medication for your depression?" This happens often, and here's how you should respond: "Do you think that my depression is caused by alcoholism or that it is an independent problem?" The answer to this question will tell you whether or not the therapist is considering a dual diagnosis.
Dual diagnosis is an extremely controversial topic in alcoholism treatment circles. In many treatment centers the majority of alcoholics are labeled dual-diagnosis patients and treated for both alcoholism and, say, chronic depression or chronic anxiety; treatment for psychological disturbances often involves the use of various medications including antidepressants, sleeping pills, mood elevators, or sedatives. Too often the diagnosis is made on the basis of the patient's presenting symptoms-the recovering alcoholic is clearly anxious, depressed, or suicidal-and no effort is made to review the patient's history to determine if the anxiety or depression existed prior to the use of alcohol and/or other drugs.
When the primary problem is alcoholism, it is highly likely that the secondary symptoms of depression, suicidal thoughts, anxiety, and panic attacks will improve rapidly over a period of several days or weeks of abstinence, eventually disappearing without the need for medication. A dual diagnosis, in these cases, would constitute a misdiagnosis, for the disruptions in thought, mood, and behavior are not separate disorders at all but consequences of alcoholism. In most cases these symptoms will abate after several weeks of abstinence and disappear after several months. If the psychological symptoms continue unabated or worsen as time goes on, the need for medication can be reevaluated.
Some recovering alcoholics do benefit from antidepressant medication in the early stages of recovery, but in determining who is a candidate for medication, this essential question must be asked: Is the recovering alcoholic's depression related to the lingering effects of the disease and thus destined to lift over time, or is the depression a separate disorder that predated the drinking and will continue despite abstinence? If the depression is not severe or debilitating, many alcoholism experts and clinicians will advise you to wait three or four months (or longer, in some cases) before taking medication. They don't want you to suffer unnecessarily, but they also don't want to jump to conclusions or suggest therapies that might
jeopardize your sobriety.
Although many recovering alcoholics have experienced relief from depression, anxiety, insomnia, and obsessive-compulsive disorders by taking the class of antidepressants known as SSRIs, these drugs are not, unfortunately, without their problems (see Chapter 11). Our general rec ommendation is to approach all long-term drug treatments with caution.
Open Minded
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: NZ
Posts: 226
Hi and thanks again for the replies.
Carol, I will answer you anyway. This has been a long journey for me. Prior to 1998 I had been a (class A, B and C) drug addict for 7 years.
Now I smoke cigs and am dealing with my triggers to drinking, which are mostly loss related. My Dad died when I was 11 of leukemia. That sent me into a spin that saw me being put into local authority care for 4 + years, in and out of foster homes and children's homes.
Until I got into therapy/counselling which I've been in now for nearly four years I had not dealt with any of these loss/abandonment issues.
The alcohol is another addiction issue that I'm dealing with, one after the other but suffice to say I know I can stop my addictive behavior, with the right support and help, I've proven it to myself.
My relapse after two years sober was again loss related, it's been a hell of a year, my 9 year old son's father dying of leukemia last year (like that's supposed to happen twice in in one lifetime!) and my mother dying very suddenly this Easter has sent me back into my default coping machanism - addiction, this time alcohol, but I've managed to not touch the drugs again - that's a huge achievement and one I'm very proud of.
I'm not in denial :0) I'm moving forward at a sustainable rate and have gained a diploma in the last 18 months and am now undertaking a degree, in the second year. I would have had no hope of achieving that in my 20's, I was way too screwed up. Thank heavens for my support people :0)
Groucho - thank you for your long and considered response, I appreciate the feedback.
I've been depressed and anxious for most of my life, long before I started drinking at 15, again great loss was the cause. I've been under psychiatric care for almost 3 of the last 5 years, I self referred. I'm medicated for dysthymic disorder (chronic long term depression which you are probably aware of) social anxiety disorder and generalised anxiety disorder. I've had two major depressive episodes in my life and the fact that I managed to not fall into another one in the last year is a measure of the success I've found within therapy/counselling. I still have changes to make and I'm getting there bit by bit.
Re the addiction as disease theory, I have huge reservations about it, if I didn't I'd be in AA like a shot, it ties in nicely and I do see that. I am a fan of Stanton Peele. Much of the work I've done in therapy/counselling has been very similar in some respects to his life process approach. I also like the work of Ph.D. Joseph Santoro, both have been very useful in different ways.
Ok, I got off track but hey, this is a forum for open discussion so I'm sure it's fine. Thanks again :0)
Carol, I will answer you anyway. This has been a long journey for me. Prior to 1998 I had been a (class A, B and C) drug addict for 7 years.
Now I smoke cigs and am dealing with my triggers to drinking, which are mostly loss related. My Dad died when I was 11 of leukemia. That sent me into a spin that saw me being put into local authority care for 4 + years, in and out of foster homes and children's homes.
Until I got into therapy/counselling which I've been in now for nearly four years I had not dealt with any of these loss/abandonment issues.
The alcohol is another addiction issue that I'm dealing with, one after the other but suffice to say I know I can stop my addictive behavior, with the right support and help, I've proven it to myself.
My relapse after two years sober was again loss related, it's been a hell of a year, my 9 year old son's father dying of leukemia last year (like that's supposed to happen twice in in one lifetime!) and my mother dying very suddenly this Easter has sent me back into my default coping machanism - addiction, this time alcohol, but I've managed to not touch the drugs again - that's a huge achievement and one I'm very proud of.
I'm not in denial :0) I'm moving forward at a sustainable rate and have gained a diploma in the last 18 months and am now undertaking a degree, in the second year. I would have had no hope of achieving that in my 20's, I was way too screwed up. Thank heavens for my support people :0)
Groucho - thank you for your long and considered response, I appreciate the feedback.
I've been depressed and anxious for most of my life, long before I started drinking at 15, again great loss was the cause. I've been under psychiatric care for almost 3 of the last 5 years, I self referred. I'm medicated for dysthymic disorder (chronic long term depression which you are probably aware of) social anxiety disorder and generalised anxiety disorder. I've had two major depressive episodes in my life and the fact that I managed to not fall into another one in the last year is a measure of the success I've found within therapy/counselling. I still have changes to make and I'm getting there bit by bit.
Re the addiction as disease theory, I have huge reservations about it, if I didn't I'd be in AA like a shot, it ties in nicely and I do see that. I am a fan of Stanton Peele. Much of the work I've done in therapy/counselling has been very similar in some respects to his life process approach. I also like the work of Ph.D. Joseph Santoro, both have been very useful in different ways.
Ok, I got off track but hey, this is a forum for open discussion so I'm sure it's fine. Thanks again :0)
Coffee Drinker
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Lobstah Land
Posts: 1,122
Hi Need to be, Those were not my words, they were from "Beyond the Influence".
I have suffered from depression also but now at 7+ months sober (the longest time sober in 15 years) I am finding that my depression is lifting and wow, what a feeling!
The Book: "Beyond the Influence" is the first thing that I have found that actually explaned the prosess of alcoholism to me. This book rings true to my ears. I highly reccommend it everyone with an interest in alcoholism. It may well be the best $16.00 I ever spent.
I absolutely believe that alcoholism is a disease and the only way to keep it in remission is to stay sober. I have tried pretty much everything to "control" my drinking but I never really had control at all. It was like trying to control the flu.
After much trial end mostly error, I embraced AA and I'm not looking back.
Best to you,
I have suffered from depression also but now at 7+ months sober (the longest time sober in 15 years) I am finding that my depression is lifting and wow, what a feeling!
The Book: "Beyond the Influence" is the first thing that I have found that actually explaned the prosess of alcoholism to me. This book rings true to my ears. I highly reccommend it everyone with an interest in alcoholism. It may well be the best $16.00 I ever spent.
I absolutely believe that alcoholism is a disease and the only way to keep it in remission is to stay sober. I have tried pretty much everything to "control" my drinking but I never really had control at all. It was like trying to control the flu.
After much trial end mostly error, I embraced AA and I'm not looking back.
Best to you,
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