Peter

"There is a principle which is a bar against all information,which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep us in everlasting ignorance............that principle is contempt prior to investigation."

Herbert Spencer

AA Big Book Third Edition.Pg 570

Doug

Good choice Peter,

I almost posted that for the Big Book quote today. I chose another instead, and this one came up anyway.

The Jay Walker

Good post Peter

I really have a hard time with this one at times, during my drinking years I thought I was so open minded, just because I would do anything stupid, LOL
after sobering up I still have problems with this, I can be invited to go someplace, and in my head have it all figured out that I wont like it before I even go, same goes for some of the suggestions my sponsor gave me, he had me go to alanon for a year, along with my A.A., I thought it would be a big waste of time
but I learned a lot by going. man the list goes on and on.

thans for the post Peter, I needed to hear that today.

Music

"There is a principle which is a bar against all information,which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep us in everlasting ignorance............that principle is contempt prior to investigation."

This quote is so powerful. I read through it and I've replaced the word "contempt" with "fear" and in reality, either one works. Only thing is, I believe "fear" is the mother of "contempt."
I remember so many times when I was so full of the fear of being wrong, the fear of being rejected, the fear of losing something I had, the fear of not measuring up, that I manufactured a contemptuous attitude, just so I could justify my actions. I couldn't admit I was afraid. I'm a 100% believer that what keeps people from getting to know one another and keeps prejudice, bigotry and hate alive today is contempt, born from fear. The fear that others are different in dress, talk, beliefs, food, religion...you name it.
What a powerful statement.

Peter

Aided by my insatiable desire for drugs and alcohol I commenced to build the walls of fear,contempt and prejudice that was to become my prison.

If it had not been for AA that prison would have become my tomb.

To die with fear, anger, regret and remorse is no way to die.

Peter.

Tapery

This was written some time ago but its truth endures.

Doug

Nice find Tap, thanks for bringing it back up.

Grimnar

I think I understand.

Right now I am thinking that I need to keep an open mind and not have fear.

Don S

I guess the key would be knowing the difference between skepticism and contempt.
Don S

Tapery

Fear being the mother of contempt, and fear, contempt, and prejudice forming a prison that could turn into a tomb are concepts that now feel like profound truths to me. I went back and tracked how I got to where I was when I first read this thread. It felt like following the course of dominos in reverse order. I realized that I was guilty of prejudice. That prejudice was rooted in my anger at what felt like abuse. It probably was abuse. The abuse was not really understood and had frightened me. I wasn’t accustomed to being frightened and didn‘t like it. I felt much stronger being angry. The anger wasn’t really understood any more than the fear had been but isn’t that what prejudice is?

This new insight has helped me put my fear and anger in perspective. I think I have left much of that prejudice behind. Learning a little better self-protection would be a nice next step but I know and appreciate the giant step you have helped me make already. Thank you.

DaliLlama

I just joined this forum and found this quote. A couple days ago I got an email from my first sponsor. Apparently that quotation that appears in the big book is a false quotation. As well, Herbert Spencer never said it. The quote has a very interesting history. Here's the link he sent me----

http://www.geocities.com/fitquotation/


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Dan

Interesting.
Sort of.
It always sounded to me like something Einstein would have said anyway.

Don S

I guess it joins the ranks of quotations that should have been said, along with the statistics that would be useful if they were true, and stories about events that would present great moral lessons if they had really happened (Washington and the cherry tree).
Actually, if you think about it, contempt prior to investigation is not destined to keep us in eternal ignorance. It just gives the investigator further to go.
Good to have the Dali Lama among us. I feel honored.
Don S

Tapery

Dali Lama, please accept my welcome as well. It is interesting knowing what interests you.

As every artist knows, once a work of art leaves their hands they have no control over what the viewer takes away from it. I guess quotes are the same way.

Marsha

Music

Never ceases to amaze me, the amount of crap people can dig up if they choose to try to make a point. The Big Book has been around since 1939 and just now someone comes up with the theory that a very profound quote(profound at least to me)wasn't said by who the book says, said it. I guess if I thought it was important to poke holes in something, I could find the time and energy to dig up studies, and opinions to support my contention. As far as I'm concerned, the person who said it, isn't as important as what was said. I really don't care ol' Herby made that statement or not. It's a profound statement and has invaluable meaning to me. Because of that statement, I realized that one of the reasons I was afraid of people was because I really didn't understand them, and was afraid to investigate because of fear. I don't feel that way today....thank God. One of the first lessons I learned from my first sponsor was that I was no better, or no worse than anyone else. This quote has helped me to walk on the same ground with people around me, regardless of race, religion, political beliefs, etc. I just have to take the time to learn, and isn't that what life is all about?

Dan

And that be the truth.
Oh yeah, oh yeah.

Doug

Yep. And a post thats 2 years old too no less. Shared just for the sake of sharing, because it has some meaning, and makes some folks think a bit.

Its such a relief for me to be in recovery now. I don't take everything so seriously. I don't have to always be right. I don't have to have the last word. I can take what I need, and leave the rest.

Andy F

I find it strange that Dalillama's post would be lambasted if it is merely an honest observation. Sounds like the normal hypersensitive 'we are under attack' defensive stuff to me.

Music

I find it strange that someone who thinks the 12 steps are religious nonsense, and that the idea of a higher power is un-necessary to recovery, identifies himself with AA in any way except in an attempt to be unique and draw attention to himself. Just an honest observation!!

Dan

I'm going to the store for some milk.
Anyone else need anything?
Rope maybe?