Alcoholics Anonymous vs. Other Approaches: The Evidence Is Now In
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Strailya
Posts: 8,019
Alcoholics Anonymous vs. Other Approaches: The Evidence Is Now In
An article from the New York Times:
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/11/u...gtype=Homepage
TLDR: An updated systematic review published by the Cochrane Collaboration found that A.A. leads to increased rates and lengths of abstinence compared with other common treatments
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/11/u...gtype=Homepage
TLDR: An updated systematic review published by the Cochrane Collaboration found that A.A. leads to increased rates and lengths of abstinence compared with other common treatments
Sober Alcoholic
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 3,539
Thanks Kaneda8888 for the link. The study addresses some of the difficulties in doing research on AA. I give them a lot of credit for that. Doing academic research on AA presents huge problems.
I must admit, that even though I agree with the positive results of the study, I remain skeptical that good research can be done on the organization. Perhaps I'm guilty of the same sort of confirmation bias that effects those who hear the words spiritual or God and say "It's not for me".
Changing my belief that good research can be done on AA is going to take a good look at the studies after some serious self reflection.
I must admit, that even though I agree with the positive results of the study, I remain skeptical that good research can be done on the organization. Perhaps I'm guilty of the same sort of confirmation bias that effects those who hear the words spiritual or God and say "It's not for me".
Changing my belief that good research can be done on AA is going to take a good look at the studies after some serious self reflection.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Christchurch, NZ
Posts: 517
I think it's great that articles like that get published.
It helps people weigh the odds.
Imagine there was a betting agency and you could get odds on folks staying sober long term.
So you tell them
He's going it alone ... and they go '100/1' odds.
He's going with cyber support ... '25/1'
He's going to f2f meetings ... 10/1
He's going the full box and dice, steps, everything and the kitchen sink ... 2/1
Eventually, even the most stubborn alchie is going to get that the best odds are available if you can just swallow your pride and avail yourself of them.
Then it just comes down to how much are you prepared to lose along the way ?
Marriage, family, kids, jobs, houses, financial security ... the list goes on.
And ... hope you survive the long odds runs.
The article mentions 3.3 million of us dieing each year, so unfortunately, a lot of us don't survive those long odds.
Which brings it back to why articles like this are invaluable.
It helps people weigh the odds.
Imagine there was a betting agency and you could get odds on folks staying sober long term.
So you tell them
He's going it alone ... and they go '100/1' odds.
He's going with cyber support ... '25/1'
He's going to f2f meetings ... 10/1
He's going the full box and dice, steps, everything and the kitchen sink ... 2/1
Eventually, even the most stubborn alchie is going to get that the best odds are available if you can just swallow your pride and avail yourself of them.
Then it just comes down to how much are you prepared to lose along the way ?
Marriage, family, kids, jobs, houses, financial security ... the list goes on.
And ... hope you survive the long odds runs.
The article mentions 3.3 million of us dieing each year, so unfortunately, a lot of us don't survive those long odds.
Which brings it back to why articles like this are invaluable.
12-Step Recovered Alkie
Join Date: May 2010
Location: West Bloomfield, MI
Posts: 5,797
I can't speak to the efficacy of any other program but from what I've seen in AA over the 12yrs I've been there, I haven't seen anyone ever drink again once they've had the spiritual awakening that's promised as the one result of working the steps. Then again, the % of folks who actually do that (work all 12 steps) is, unfortunately, pretty low.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 15
There's attending and also doing all the steps. When people at meetings would say there recovery % of AA is 5% I'd so no way. And why I say that well as you realized maybe not in every area there's alot of addictive drug takers that used to take all the top drugs and alcoholics as well as smoking, herion ,cocaine, meth and who knows what. Rebuild there life to better then they ever thought it could be. 22% to 37% were there is willingness there's a chance were there"s desperation of a drowning man or women there's a even promises no results.
Sobriety is Traditional
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Orcas Island, Washington
Posts: 9,066
Ultimately, I am skeptical of any study of AA--the most important statistic is my sobriety. I feel AA is an important part of my recovery.
Here is a challenge to the study, and one point it raises is, "AA groups, by convincing people they can’t control their drinking, make it likelier that when such subjects do drink, they do so explosively."
https://filtermag.org/alcoholics-anonymous-cochrane/
Here is a challenge to the study, and one point it raises is, "AA groups, by convincing people they can’t control their drinking, make it likelier that when such subjects do drink, they do so explosively."
https://filtermag.org/alcoholics-anonymous-cochrane/
Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Michigan
Posts: 5,382
I understand AA isn’t for everyone! And if it isn’t, I hope they can stay sober through here or any other methods they are using!
All I know is AA works for me and many other people who go to meetings!
Some big pluses about AA: 1) It’s cheap financially! It’s basically free other than putting a dollar of two in the basket! And only if you have it!
2) it’s a simple program and not too demanding! The only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking!
3) Its not too time consuming! Meetings usually only take an hour! Then after that you just go live your life!
4) It’s good for you socially! You pretty much have a group of friends who want to see you succeed just by showing up!
5) AA will screw up your drinking! How could you not feel like you’re doing something wrong if you start drinking again after hearing all this stuff at meetings! And I think that’s good if you really want to stay sober!
All I know is AA works for me and many other people who go to meetings!
Some big pluses about AA: 1) It’s cheap financially! It’s basically free other than putting a dollar of two in the basket! And only if you have it!
2) it’s a simple program and not too demanding! The only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking!
3) Its not too time consuming! Meetings usually only take an hour! Then after that you just go live your life!
4) It’s good for you socially! You pretty much have a group of friends who want to see you succeed just by showing up!
5) AA will screw up your drinking! How could you not feel like you’re doing something wrong if you start drinking again after hearing all this stuff at meetings! And I think that’s good if you really want to stay sober!
Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: canada
Posts: 7,242
“ AA groups, by convincing people they can’t control their drinking, make it likelier that when such subjects do drink, they do so explosively."
AA groups do not convince people that they cannot control their drinking. maybe you meant “that they cannot control their not-drinking”? just checking.
what i have seen is that by the time people get to AA groups, or Lifering meetings, they are well aware they cannot control their drinking. in fact, that is what finally convinced them to attend the groups in the first place. if we had control, we would not need anything like a group.
the second part of that quote strikes me as twisted logic: first, the subjects supposedly CAN control their drinking (implied by the first part of the quote), and then, when they don’t (why don’t they, if supposedly they can?), then we can blame attendance at AA for them going overboard?? huh?
AA groups do not convince people that they cannot control their drinking. maybe you meant “that they cannot control their not-drinking”? just checking.
what i have seen is that by the time people get to AA groups, or Lifering meetings, they are well aware they cannot control their drinking. in fact, that is what finally convinced them to attend the groups in the first place. if we had control, we would not need anything like a group.
the second part of that quote strikes me as twisted logic: first, the subjects supposedly CAN control their drinking (implied by the first part of the quote), and then, when they don’t (why don’t they, if supposedly they can?), then we can blame attendance at AA for them going overboard?? huh?
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