PhoenixJ

I used to be a Christian in the trad sense of the word, but due to a lot happening to me 3y ago, I do not follow this premise anymore.

I am still on that journey and it will take time. In the meantime, I focus more on the word 'spirituality', although being a relative newie, am disconnected a lot from this. I just have to stay sober, keep trying to do the next right/best thing, and always try to grow.

Redmayne

The philosophy of Stoicism played a significant part in early Christian beliefs, on which the 12 Steps are based.

The Stoic Virtues are based on exercising practical wisdom,temperance, courage,in dealing with others and ourselves and on being just.

Not to difficult to see then that all these things compliment each other...

Realest

Do the stoic believe in God. I read Seneca letters from a. Stoic. He would sleep on a wooden bed, fast for days. He was hardcore.

Tommyh

I did the 12 steps,and l Later on wrote out my 10th and 11th steps daily for a month or so,and went over them with a sponsee who was doing the same.
Spent more time in prayer
also remember this and do the next right thing
It is not your feelings, your emotions, that make you a child of God, but the doing of God’s will. A life of usefulness is before you if your will becomes God’s will. Then you may stand in your God-given manhood/womanhood, an example of good works.

Realest

Thanks this helped a lot.

Ken33xx

Good topic as God or Higher Power is often a major sticking point.

I grew up with religion and believe in God. However, when I was new I asked why we ended meetings with the Lords Prayer if AA is not a religious program. I thought AA was non-denominational. I was told AA is not a religious program. You can make a door knob your higher power. O.k. I thought. Whatever.

When I hear newcomers share about not buying into the idea of a higher power I tell them not to look for reasons to leave AA. You don't have to believe but don't use it as an excuse to say, "Oh, I tried AA, It didn't work. Give me another shot and make it a double."

August252015

^^ One way I discuss the "God thing" (and wording, and use of the Lord's prayer) is when and by whom the BB was written (and AA formed). White men in the mid-20th century with the common Judeo-Christian ethos of our country. (Here, you can also delve into the Oxford Group) Many lay people, authors, and sure, religious leaders have used God (or their word for a specific HP, like Allah) in writings and teachings.

"Modernize" that language- and, even specifically use what the BB says if you read in full "God of your understanding." IMO it's semantics, a reason "not to do AA," etc- basically, as was said above - to keep drinking. Also IMO - there has to be "some" word in a prayer- and the Lord's Prayer is so common that to me it makes sense it was a go-to given the time/place/whom of the BB.

Ken33xx

It is the idea of a higher power which turns some people off. They don't believe in superstition. O.k. I won't argue or try and change their mind.

I tell them if one is going to look for reasons to leave AA they can find them.

Not believing in a HP or getting upset because one hears the word God in the rooms is no reason to quit.

And besides what do you have to lose outside of the misery which brought you here.

Tommyh

some local oldtimers used to say if the God word drove ya out the bottle would drive ya back in

Kris47

Hi Realest,

The search for the meaning in life has puzzled people for thousands of years because usually we all look in the wrong place: ourselves. Only God the creator of life can reveal your purpose here on earth. We are all "Godwired." We all know that there is something grander out there than we . To know God we need to have a relationship with Him. It is by Faith in Jesus Christ that we can do this. I only know this way.

Ask for Him to come into your life. Be a friend. Learn all you can about Him.

Thank him for giving you the Gift of Sobriety. It is by His will, not ours that we can come to see Him.

It is just the beginning.

Realest

Thanks I try to read the Bible and pray but sometimes I still doubt. Perhaps my mind is to small to comprehend God.

Ken33xx

When I got sober there was no internet. When I walked into an AA meeting for the first time I had no idea of what to expect.

Today that's all changed.

People often come into a meeting already having researched AA online. They've checked out both the good and the bad reviews.

Attraction rather than promotion works best especially for those looking for reasons to leave.

Ken33xx

Years ago after getting sober I had a minor job in a hospital and became friendly with a few doctors. One day I asked about near death experiences. About the stories of seeing loved ones across a river or floating above the room and seeing your body.

I was told as the body breaks down a morphine type chemical is released which can cause hallucinations. The shaman or holy man was born out of a need to explain this and religion followed.

So what happens when you die I asked?

The doctor said nothing except to live in the memories of others.

Deflating to say the least... but I still say my prayers (when I remember) before going to sleep.

Kris47

Doctors are not God.


Without God you have nothing, with God you have eternal life.

We need only the faith of a mustard seed...………………

We all doubt sometimes.

Your faith grows.

Just keep praying and ask the Holy Spirit to guide you.

Realest

Thank you so much for all your posts. I’ll keep praying.

Kris47

I'll pray, too.

tomsteve

gotta thank you for this. i have something written in theback cover of my bb i havent read in a while:
we will never understand God.our idea of God will always be lacking,for to fully understand- to comprehend God is to be equal to God.
Father Ed.

youre seeking God- thats awesome! its what we're supposed to continue to do.
And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who earnestly seek him.

Realest

That makes sense thank you and thanks for pm