paulokes

When I'm in a good space, I can walk anywhere and feel good. When I'm not so good I can walk anywhere and find fault. Make of that what you will

I like to think that's why we talk about this program as a Spiritual Life . The recovery is internal. It's not dependant on outside things or the behaviour of others.

Also includes a huge chunk of truth to swallow though...IMO. if I feel irritated or unhappy with something...I am responsible for that feeling, no one else. That doesn't mean I am doing something "wrong" or "bad"...just that I have no more excuses

People can be annoying...whether or not I become Annoyed is up to me.

P

Fly N Buy

I wanted to add this to the thread, especially for newcomers reading it and that is the opposite side of the coin = Elder Statesmen.

My experience is there are far more of these folks in the group(s) I attend than other "types" of old timers. There are some on this thread, no doubt and easy to identify in the love they reflect and how they post or address the OP/others.

The elder statement is capable of shining a blinding light and as our friend paulokes states - living the spiritual life. I see these fine men and women daily - they are sensitive to newcomers and even handed with those who are arrogant. They understand the program and not just parroting pages from the book.

I have had the experience of having one as a sponsor - maybe a hybrid type actually, cause we are human and even those with time do get disturbed.

These folks seem to effortlessly express their thoughts and carry the message without the mess. They help all those who ask and don't judge - they are the keepers of the flame and I hear the God of my understanding in their spoken words. I have a couple who are friends on SR.

AA is a miraculous program attended by passionate people. There is little doubt in my mind that everyone on this thread would throw one heck of a meeting. That may have to wait for the big meeting in the sky.

I am grateful to be a very small part of the WE thing.....

DayTrader

I didn't like that one for more than a couple years. Thought it was superfluous writing on Bill's part - grandstanding in the hopes of making a point.

Over time and with practice, I've found it's more true than I ever used to fear it was.

One of the differences now is those quotes don't scare me nor to they bother me. As Joe Hawk says in most of his talks, "It's the greatest statement of hope in the Big Book." What he means by that is if all my troubles are of MY making, I'M the only one who has to change (or maybe just a change of perspective on my part) for me to be ok. If my troubles are fault of everyone around me, I need to change them or for all of them to change in a way that suits me for me to be ok.

Trying to change everyone and/or everything around me and not being successful (or maybe just not successful enough) reminds me of how I felt prior to experiencing recovery - and by that I don't just mean "while I was drinking." I quit drinking and felt the same and in a lot of cases far worse than when I was drinking for quite a while. The Big Book revers to that as the spiritual malady and/or untreated alcoholism and I can tell ya it feels a whole lot worse when you're dry than when you're drinking.

Dave42001

you should chair a meeting and show some new younger leadership!! That's what I would do.. then when you get a rambler, ring the bell on him... kidding!! Chair a meeting and change it up, really prepare for your topic and go for it.. be a leader!

NepaGuy

I could but the deacons would likely object and run me out. They would say, "You violated the Traditions (Their Opinions) sonny! The AA Gods will smite you!"

Dave42001

Tough call, I'd be frustrated too..

NepaGuy

I am going to the club house speaker meeting tonight and I am going to make that my home group. That meeting hasn't been ruined by deacons yet.

Dave42001

Good deal!! Don't let those guys keep you from the program, hope there are some other groups you can connect with!! Good luck, I always like a good speaker meeting! We have some good ones but they're later in the evenings.. I usually go to the noon or happy hour 6pm.... Wishing you the best!

paulokes

Nepa...I feel like a negative Nancy here, please tell me if my comments are unwelcome

I understand your frustrations. I've experienced similar. Lots of people here identify with your problem.

But...that's the 4th/5th/6th time now you have talked about these 'Deacons'. Once was enough. More than that...seems churlish, no? Just sayin'

How might you apply the principles of the 12 Step Program to this problem?

P

Ken33xx

Yeah, just find another meeting if possible. Personally, I don`t feel I am required to like everyone in AA or all types of meeting. However, outside of taking a group conscious there isn`t much I can do except to vote with my feet.

NepaGuy

I've never in my life heard anyone in the US use the world "churlish." That must be a UK thing. We don't use the word "whilst" either. Also, we call being on license being on probation. We also always spell the word license with an "s" whether it is being used as a verb or a noun. I'll have to add the word "churlish" to my vocabulary of words that I'll never use unless I visit the UK in which case I still probably wouldn't use it because it sounds awkward to me.

paulokes

Us brits have all sorts of linguistic peculiarities. That was a churlish response my friend

Keep coming back...it gets better

P

Fly N Buy

On page 25 of our basic text there is an asterisk which prompts me to Appendix II - Spiritual Experience - "......personality change sufficient to bring about recovery from alcoholism has manifested itself among us in many different forms."

On the next page I learned the essentials of recovery that are indispensable - willingness, honesty and open mindedness.

Finally the appendix ends with this - “There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance—that principle is contempt prior to investigation.”

As I continue to learn to practice these principles in all my affairs life gets much easier - I quit fighting everything and everybody.....

I had no idea what the word churlish meant but love to learn new words - simply here is what I found; rude, ill-mannered, ill-bred, discourteous, impolite, unmannerly, uncivil,

I will add it to my vocabulary and throw it in at times when I use the phrase bombastic blowhard - ie, what a churlish bombastic blowhard that fella seem to be.......Perhaps he's simply having a bad day.

NepaGuy

Americans decided to alter the language during the 1800s because they wanted to be different. Words ending with "se" such as "realise" are spelled with a "z" rather than an "s." The "u" was dropped from words containing "ou" such as "colour" and "honour. " I once attempted to read a Canadian newspaper that was written in British English and it was almost like trying to read a foreign language. Would you say Americans were being churlish when they developed their own form of English?

paulokes

Nope, but I have no idea what this all has to do eith the principles of 12 Step Recovery

I'll wish you a good day my friend

P

NoelleR

I believe a couple of folks here may be becoming a bit churlish.

(o:

NepaGuy

Is an individual being churlish if they become offended by the number of times the terms "bleeding deacon" or "deacon" is used in a discussion thread that is clearly labeled "Bleeding Deacons?" I am mean after a few seconds of hard thinking any resonable person would conclude that such terms would be used frequently on such a thread as "Bleeding Deacons" was the intended topic of discussion.

paulokes

No offence intended or taken here...though bemused in a comical way.

is this how the Boston Tea Party started?

P

paulokes

Seriously Nepa if my input was unwanted you have humble apologies and all is good

I always got told a nice little indicator of Resentment was repetition...a persistence of annoyance ...those little gripes that I wanted to go back over just ONE more time

I have met a whole host of people in AA through the years that have annoyed me in different ways...the 'Bleeding Heart' Deacons, Pharisees, Traditions Lawyers, Thumpers, Dry Drunks, Slippers, Noobs, 13th Steppers, Two Steppers...there are a million ways I can describe them...judge them...make myself feel a little better at their expense

True what they say though...for every finger I point, there are ten pointing back at me. EVEN IN AA I have found the ride is much easier if I accept people as they are and concentrate on what lil' old me is up to!

That stuff is either true or it isn't...right? God is or he isn't...twelve step living works or it doesn't?

Any hoo...I think I've taken the thread a little off topic. Why don't we get back to bashing those Deacons.

Darn deacons....they get me so mad...grrr

P

Edit: Ooh...I forgot to mention the Brits. Godamnn brits with their Supercilious Verbiosity and Rumbustification

NoelleR

"...Is an individual being churlish...'

If you're referring to what I wrote, please note that I did NOT say anyone was being churlish.

(o: