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Old 06-12-2008, 10:17 AM
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Anonymity

Anonymity is obviously a critical component of AA - but why?

I recently heard a great share on this topic and it got me to thinking - Why is anonymity important to AA? Why is it important to me? How is it critical to my sobriety and spiritual growth..

The book says a few things, among them: "It is important that we remain anonymous because we are too few, at present to handle the overwhelming number of personal appeals which may result from this publication. Being mostly business or professional folk, we could not well carry on our occupations in such an event. We would like it understood that our alcoholic work is an avocation."

with the growth of AA since that was written - I don't think it's really relevant anymore.

I would like to know what our AA SR members think about anonymity.

What does it mean to you?
Why is it important for your recovery?

My thoughts on this subject were changed in an instant - and I will share them after awhile. I am still sitting with it and would like other's points of view to consider.

Tks

~a

BB references taken from Big Book On Line
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Old 06-12-2008, 10:56 AM
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I have recently evolved a new understanding of anonymity in AA, for me.

At first, I really wondered why the founders selected that specific word:anonymous when naming our fellowship program. It could just as easily been called Alcoholics Association, Alcoholics United for Sobriety, Alcoholics in Recovery, Alcoholics No More..you see it could have been something very different.

Why "Alcoholics Anonymous"?

Aside from mainataining anonymity for the practical and professional issues as outlined, including the quoted "...at the level of film and press..." I see this as the essence of spirituality. Egolessness.

If self-centeredness is our problem, and surrender to God, is the way out, ego deflation must naturally follow.

Humility requires us to stop seeking recognition for the good we do. We learn self honesty and practice it each time we check our motives for an action we may be about to take. Remembering that I am an Anonymous Alcoholic helps me to work my program.
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Old 06-12-2008, 12:33 PM
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ditto on that....

it seems to me that we need to listen to what people share, not who said it and that it is best to not put our reliance on one particualar person..who lets face it...could drink again or just get down right dingy at times.

Mostly i see it as something like miss c said as a personal spiritual path...to walk so skillfully through this world that you are not noticed but have positive impact.

oh and i think basic anonimity is helpful to certain people at certain times in the program

Thanks -
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Old 06-12-2008, 01:45 PM
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Everyone in AA is equal.

There are no social levels, no elitists, just people with a problem who want to get better.
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Old 06-12-2008, 03:17 PM
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Dr. Bob addressed this in Dr. Bob & the Good Oldtimers. He said that people need to know how to find us in our communities, and we should not be anonymous there - that the tradition calling for anonymity at the level of press, radio and film means exactly that - at the level, not above it or below it.

If people don't know our last names, or know us to be in recovery from alcoholism, they will not know how to find us when they need help. Now, local hotline numbers listed in newspapers and phone books can eliminate much of this need, however, some folks will find it easier to go to people they know in their communities. Also, if we use no last names in meetings and we failed to give a newcomer our phone number, how is this newcomer going to find Joe B. in the phone book?

There's a fine line between anonymity for the sake of humility and being so anonymous that it hampers our ability to carry the message.

Peace & Love,
Sugah
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Old 06-12-2008, 04:48 PM
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Right now, I am in the mindset that while I really don't want people to know that I am in the AA program, I wouldn't be too bothered if people found out. Why? Pride mainly.

Being from a small community, I respect that others may not want their AA membership made public. Could be work reasons, family reasons, ignorance of the general public, pride, whatever...none of my business. Also, people share some pretty sensitive stuff in our meetings and trust that it won't turn into gossip. One of the reasons I joined AA was because of the anonymity. It is critical to my participation. If it wasn't anonymous, I would not have joined.

I do think that AA could do a better job at publicizing the benefits of the program (I know, "attraction rather than promotion"). I find that there is too much of a stigma attached to AA and people (including alcoholics that need help) are buying into it.

I think my answer to this question will change over time but this is where I am at right now.
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Old 06-12-2008, 05:11 PM
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I love this picture.


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Old 06-12-2008, 06:29 PM
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Anonymity is very important for a variety of reasons, but I'll focus on just one reason right now.

I have a friend who is a sober member of this program for over 35 years. Soon after coming into the program he got a job for a big manufacturing plant. (His expertise is in the aircraft manufacturing business so your reputation can be considered rather important.) Anyway, as time went along and he continued practicing this program and attending meetings several individuals who also worked there came and went. During one of these intervals a couple of the folks would talk about him and another member who was also employed there. Eventually some of this "break room" talk reached the ears of some of the higher ups. Although highly qualified for certain positions that would advance them in the plant, for some strange reason my friend and the other guy were passed over a couple of times. Was the unnecessary talk the cause? Perhaps. (Later my friend was told by someone "in the know" that a couple of the administrative old guard had biased opinions of "drunks.")

Time has gone by and those guys who talked about my friend and the other AA member are no longer around and the old guard has been replaced by a new business administration. My friend is still there and is the sixth senior employee in the plant. He's risen in his status there, but when asked if he felt that the broken anonymity hurt his situation there, he will tell you he felt it did.

There are many reasons why "Anonymity is the spiritual foundation of all our traditions" in the program of AA and the above, as I said before, is only one reason this is important. I also have a job where anonymity can be important. It's on a "need to know" basis. I've always let my immediate supervisor know about me when the time seemed right. (One of them knocked it off right off the bat by the way I verbally responded to a situation with a quote from the BB--seems they had more than a passing acquaintanceship with our program and our birthdays turned out to be only a month apart from each other :ghug3.) Regardless, I am the one who has the right to break my own anonymity, but I do not have the right to break yours.

My feelings are that we just need to be a bit more sensitive in this area.
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Old 06-12-2008, 06:35 PM
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Sugah I believe you hit the nail on the head.
If we are going to do correct 12 step work,we will need to get out in the community and carry the message.We carry the message to jails and prisons.We cannot keep our identity secret there.We carry the message to the Professional Community, ,H&I,PI and Other places.We sometimes have to let others do though background checks on us.

A good example is this,we cannot put our name in the paper taking credit for what we do,like going to prisons and jails.It would be pretty bad if someone carried the message to a jail for one month and then put their name,phone number and address in the paper as a AA rep for the jails,etc and then got drunk and ended up in jail.

at the level of press,TV and films we do need to keep our anonymity,but below that,we do not.The one underlying principle of all the traditions is self sacrifice.

We sacrifice our personal wants for the good of AA
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Old 06-12-2008, 07:14 PM
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I've had those background checks run on me several places. I regularly surrender my driver's license at the door in certain institutions, and I've sat down with judges, probation officers, ministers, doctors and counselors. If any of those things ever holds me back in my career, I would have to ask myself if the increase in pay and prestige is worth more than the message heard by someone who's life it saved. The personal prejudice of other people is not my problem, even when it affects the way they treat me.

In my own admittedly short span of sobriety, I have found that, especially in a small town, prejudice can be turned around by the right kind of example. A certain judge who saw me at my worst is now very grateful that I come in contact with those he sends to jail. I'm not taking credit for the fact that he's now a believer that people can change. No, he's encountered a good number of us, and the more examples, the better.

For the record, I've been extraordinarily blessed - beyond my wildest imaginings - not by capitalizing on my AA membership, but by doing what the program has taught me to do, which is to pray to a power greater than myself to make good use of me, put one foot in front of the other, and do the next right thing.

Peace & Love,
Sugah
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Old 06-12-2008, 07:17 PM
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At my second AA meeting I ran into 6 members who knew me.
3 were ex lovers...3 were customers where I worked.
Sooo...I had no anonymity from the start...
My customers never alluded to our fellowship outside the rooms.

My first home group had several nationally known members
as well as 4 newsmen There was no leak about our
high profile members by the reporters.
A good lesson to see for a newcomer.

As I was a public drunk....I became an open AA member.
Along the way I've worn T-shirts and sweatshirts with AA
sayings ...had a bumper sticker on cars...always have my
current medallion in my purse....used key chains with symbols..
worn AA jewelry.

I also mention my AA committment in conversations
and I always told my bosses and often co workers.

These actions just feel right for me.
It is not about being spiritual to me.
That special connection is between my God and I.
it's about being unashamed and honest.

I have not disclosed anothers AA membership.

The above is my take on my personal anonymity
certainly not that of AA's or anyone elses.

Thanks for letting me share
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Old 06-12-2008, 07:19 PM
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It certainly appears that anonymity has laxed with it's members as the fellowship grew. I beleive society has become a tad more accepting recgonizing alcoholism as a disease.

That by no means is saying that the general public can really understand alcoholism. I beleive you have to be an alcoholic to understand an alcoholic. Because of this, I think anonymity is essential today and tommorow.


Tom
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Old 06-12-2008, 07:43 PM
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Part 2....

Do I think anonymity important in
"press-radio...films'?

Absolutely.

I worked on a project concerning the working poor
and why free clinics needed funding.

I was interviewed/videoed by ABC had the Washington Post
come over for pictures and an interview.

Neither piece was particularly factual due to editing.

No one has asked me to do inteviews about AA
in films press or radio. But I would decline
after the earlier experience....
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Old 06-12-2008, 09:06 PM
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Thanks everyone for sharing- gave me more to reflect on.

In my opinion - my anonymity is no longer mine. I gave my will and my life up to a power greater than myself. What follows is the gist of the share I heard last night...

Imagine that myself and another AA member who I also work with are discussing things at the 'watercooler' about what we heard at a meeting the night before - maybe we even make habit of it. Maybe we even spill people's **** during these discussions, maybe we include non-AA people in what goes on in AA, stories we have heard, people that are members. If someone was to overhear this (not a participant in the discussion) and they had a dark secret (drinking problem) that they were thinking of getting help for - How would they feel about going to AA for help? Do you think that maybe part of them thinks "People are gonna talk about me afterwards - outside of AA", if they have heard conversations at the water cooler, the grocery store, the post office....?

AA needs to be a safe place, where you can be open and feel free, lest you never get set on the path to recovery. The newcomers need to know this. So- even outside the level of press radio film - I need to be anonymous, as do my fellows. It's part of the attraction...and if there are no more newcomers, how can I possibly share what has been so freely shared with me? Force it on people?? I think not.

That was the angle I was approaching this from when I posted this morning.

I agree with all the other aspects of anonymity - but in my view today, it's not for me - it's for the 'greater good' and the ability to allow God to work through me and touch the lives of others.

Personally - I don't care who knows I am a member of AA (work,friends etc), I have no shame attached to it. I found last night in reflection that I forget what it's like to have that dirty little secret and not know where I can take it....at AA - no one is gonna share my secret outside that room, it was critical to my opening up my life, critical to my recovery to know I was safe and could get to work with no fear of other's spilling my **** all over town.

For what it's worth - on a personal level - I give my entire name, same thing in closed meetings. In open meetings "I'm Adam and I am an alcoholic". Even here at SR - plenty of people know my full name- personal email, phone number - but I wouldn't want that information posted in a forum or readily available to just anyone.

Like Grav - the meaning of anonymity has changed for me over time and was certainly on my mind today.

Thanks for taking the time.

~a
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Old 06-13-2008, 06:57 AM
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The first meeting I went to the chair person said at the end of the meeting "what was said and who said it should remain in this room" That was the only meeting that I attended where such a statement was make. I'm the opposite of CarolD, I was a private drinker so my recovery is private except to others that suffer from the same disease.
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Old 06-13-2008, 12:47 PM
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Sugah,awesome,I love it!
fantastic example
when you are doing what you do
you are building good relations with the public and AA

Originally Posted by Sugah View Post
I've had those background checks run on me several places. I regularly surrender my driver's license at the door in certain institutions, and I've sat down with judges, probation officers, ministers, doctors and counselors. If any of those things ever holds me back in my career, I would have to ask myself if the increase in pay and prestige is worth more than the message heard by someone who's life it saved. The personal prejudice of other people is not my problem, even when it affects the way they treat me.

In my own admittedly short span of sobriety, I have found that, especially in a small town, prejudice can be turned around by the right kind of example. A certain judge who saw me at my worst is now very grateful that I come in contact with those he sends to jail. I'm not taking credit for the fact that he's now a believer that people can change. No, he's encountered a good number of us, and the more examples, the better.

For the record, I've been extraordinarily blessed - beyond my wildest imaginings - not by capitalizing on my AA membership, but by doing what the program has taught me to do, which is to pray to a power greater than myself to make good use of me, put one foot in front of the other, and do the next right thing.

Peace & Love,
Sugah
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Old 06-16-2008, 09:07 AM
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i think they threw anonymity in to make everyone stumble as they read the 12 traditions.


jus kidn.


but really, all my buddies are in recovery. everyone i work with knows i'm sober through AA. but, that's me. i respect my fellows by not disclosing by name what was said in meetings, but i will share ideas that i've gained there. i would never disclose that i was a member of AA to any level of press, radio, or film. i have respect for the traditions. i just know that, for me, it was important to share my sobriety with the folks that i was with on a daily basis.
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Old 06-17-2008, 05:00 AM
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This has been an awesome thread.

I must say though that for the newcomer the Anonymous part of AA is what helps many get through the doors the first time. I had my butt kicked bad enough to where I did not care if someone knew I was in AA or not, some of us suffer from paranoia that some one will find out they are going to AA!!!!!

I know some folks who laugh at them selfs now, for some reason it was okay for some one to know they were a drunk, but just horrendous if someone knew they were in AA!!!!

I do not hide my belonging to AA, nor do I advertise it, but if it comes up I have no problem letting it be known........ I have an old freind who is one of us, because he knew I was in AA, instead of pulling the trigger after a week long bender, he called me, he told me he was at the end and that he knew I had gotten sober via AA and he asked me to help him.

If I had totally maintained my anonymity.................. well I do not think he would be here today, did I save him? Heck no!!!!! I just shared with him what I had done to get and stay sober, he did the same, he celebrated a years sobriety the 15th of this month.

The first time I introduce myself in every meeting I use my full name, for the rest of the meeting if I am asked to share again I just use my first name.

My anonymity is mine, I would never break someone elses even in a meeting unless they have given me specific permission.
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Old 06-17-2008, 05:28 AM
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my landlord was in aa meetings at one time when i was. we had an ongoing problem over my apt. and a bad water heater. Anonimity for me meant tht in that meeting (and the meeting afterwards) he was not my landlord...he was a fellow alchoholic seeking recovery...and i really felt tht way...our homegroup was pretty cool that way
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Old 06-17-2008, 05:33 AM
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Originally Posted by ananda View Post
my landlord was in aa meetings at one time when i was. we had an ongoing problem over my apt. and a bad water heater. Anonimity for me meant tht in that meeting (and the meeting afterwards) he was not my landlord...he was a fellow alchoholic seeking recovery...and i really felt tht way...our homegroup was pretty cool that way
Amen. It's the same way when I'm in a meeting with my husband, one of my children's teachers, medical professionals I have seen outside the rooms, ministers, and legal professionals. Although aspects of our personal lives may help a newcomer relate, we're all in that room for one reason, and anything that sets us apart is left at the door.

Peace & Love,
Sugah
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