Rose6844

Hi. I've been married for over 20 years. My husband's father was an alcoholic, and his family/homelife growing was dysfunctional. I love my husband. He has traits that can make him hard to live with, and others that are great (he works hard, does groceries & cooking, etc.)

I read about ACOA today and a light bulb went off. I don't know why I didn't see it before - I guess because he seems so functional in many ways.

However, there are issues. The hardest part is the defensiveness /offensiveness. Extreme over-reaction to a simple comment. Frequent misdirection of any meaningful conversation.

I would really like to help him see this and to direct him towards counselling (or us, I would go too). How on earth do you do that with someone, when a simple and reasonable request can often set off a storm of words ending in ...do you think I'm stupid or something???!!!". Or worse. Many times I am at fault for his reaction.

Anyway, when someone is that defensive, how do you even have the conversation with them about getting help?

I feel like I finally found something today that explains why he is both so wonderful and so hard to live with.....and I was happy for a few minutes, until I imagined trying to even talk to him about it.

Hoping that others can maybe share their experiences on what worked for them or for their spouse.

Thanks.

Kialua

Maybe leave a book lying around, and be reading it yourself in front of him. Ask him, did this ever happen to you? Tell me about it.
Amazon.com: Adult Children of Alcoholics (9781558741126): Janet G. Woititz: Books

See if that works. I know my own brother refuses to believe he could benefit from any literature. His wife and kids disagree...

tromboneliness

My suggestion: Al-Anon. Not for your husband: for you. The picture you're painting is, "It's all his problem, not mine. How can I make him get help?" That is not usually the case -- and there are a lot of things we can do for ourselves, to improve the way we interact in our relationships, that don't require an uncooperative other person to change! That's the part that's useful to me.

I'm an ACOA, and so is my wife. (She's also a recovering alcoholic.) Despite the fact that she's been sober almost 17 years, and I've been going to Al-Anon for more than that, there are still things that come up, where there's stress in our relationship. And every time I find it happening, I'm able to take steps to make things better without any action on her part. I bet you could do the same thing!

T

DavidG

Well, first of you good on you! We adult children to not mean to be the way we are. Not at all.

It is a painful way to live.

I sometimes wish there was a group my wife could go to- Al-Alack, or something like this.

Although the defence systems are up high- there is a high sensitivity, a deep insight- how else will he have survived so far.

Having read your share this is my opinion- keep reaching out, and when you feel inclined talk about the situation...

there will be an opportunity to get in 'under the radar'. You will know when that is... :>)

You are a lovely person. You and my long-suffering wife would get on well.

all the best,

David.

Reedling

It's strange to think about at first, but if you have been with an ACOA for over 20 years, you have spent that amount of time deeply immersed in an alcoholic family system (even if there was no alcohol use in your home-- it's the worldview, the thinking and behavior not the drinking per se).

That has really deep impacts. I'd second the Alanon suggestion, it's ok to go ahead and get this for yourself. You qualify if you want it.

Rose6844

Thank you for saying this. It's very true, but I probably wouldn't have said it for myself. I think one attraction for my husband is that I took on his family's issues with him. I used to have the strength and willingness to do this, especially as there were young kids still being raised by his family for a long time. We both admit that we are fortunate his parents have passed and his siblings have moved far away. Not that we don't/didn't love them, but I'm sure people here can understand what that means. So yeah, I certainly have been immersed, although voluntarily on my part.

And, thank you everyone for replying so quickly.

I feel very compartmentalized. Part of me is that lovely person mentioned by David G and part of me does really feel like it’s all his problem as mentioned by Tromboneliness.

As soon as I read about being an ACOA I saw my husband as this person carrying around a world of hurt – which is not the way he presents himself at all. I was heartbroken and just gave him a big hug and kiss.

The other part of me is really tired and does feel like it’s his problem. That I’ve had to deal with it for so long, without knowing what I was dealing with, that I’m just battle weary.

I will take all your suggestions – i.e. help for me, help for both of us, trying to fly in under the radar and leaving some info around – although I’ll have to find a you tube video or something as he really doesn’t “do” reading.

Is there an alternative to Al-Anon meetings? We are in a small town, meetings are held in the most populous church in the area, and we are known as not religious. I can think of 3 people right off the bat who are important to us that are involved members of that church and who would wonder what we are doing there. Not that there’s anything wrong with going to a meeting, but I’m private by nature so that bothers me.

I spent some time reading around this forum and I am so impressed by the level of support and non-judgement here. My husband is the 3rd child in a family of 4 and I can see so much of various members in his family and their experiences here. Although I’ve always accepted him and his siblings for who they are, I am already finding a new level of understanding just by coming here. Thank you for existing.

Rose6844

Scratch that question about alternative to Al-Anon - I just realized we can drive in another direction and find some meetings - they were just grouped under the name of a district that is actually far away for some reason.

Kialua

Well bless you both for being the fixer of the family. I know that role well, just can't stand to see any of my relative's kids neglected or hurting. So I jumped right in for many decades. I understand being battle weary and glad they are all grown up. But now another generation is growing up and I am being enticed once again. yikes.

Yes there are a lot of ACoA youtube videos, explore.

Do you think your husband would go with you to Alanon meetings? If he doesn't you need to think about going alone, for yourself. Some places have ACoA meetings as well. But any of them would help.

Rose6844

Thank you. The fixer role – very aptly put and so true for both my husband in his family and me in mine. Well, as the fixer, it seems I can’t stand still for long, so I really should be changing the title of this thread. I’ve gone from how to talk to hubby, to looking up info as suggested by all of you kind people, to getting a list of Al-Anon meetings, to asking him to go with me. I do get that this is anxiety at work - I just can't stand to have a problem hovering around if there is a potential solution at hand.

I also got to thinking about how both my parents were "adult children of ... in my dad's case parental neglect and my mom's parental mental illness/neglect and how I married someone very similar to my parents - and all of this makes me feel a lot more interested in getting some help, so....

Had a short conversation with him. Just kept it to the point: ACOA’s have some common issues, I see some in him related to anger, defensiveness and perception of normal family life, I need work to avoid escalating with him, I need help after 25+ years involvement with his family, he’s a strong person and I still see him that way, just want to help us with issues. Don’t have to talk, just attend meeting & observe.

At first he thought I meant go to an AA meeting and he truly thought I was off my rocker. Then after explaining more, he said it’s not his first option and he’ll think about it. Which is a way to avoid thinking or talking about it of course.

So, I’m going to plan to go and I’m going to set out some information and see if he will go with me, and if not, I’ll go anyway. Truly, truly I do need help in dealing with him, regardless of whether he is on board or not. I'm a bit scared to go by myself though, so I hope he says yes.

Rose6844

Yes, yes, yes! that is me to a T. Wish I was a lot wiser when helping, wish I could have done more. The next generation is having issues in our family as well. Thank goodness they are extremely far away, otherwise I would not be able to resist.

Best thing I did was develop a close relationship with my husband's brother when he was little. He is grown now and is a father. He is extremely protective of his little girl. Ridiculously so, and I'm sure there will be issues because of it. But I just can't explain how happy my husband and I are after visiting them, and our only concern is that this child is OVER protected. That's a first in our family. And quite wonderful...

DavidG

Yep, its good to see hope, Rose. It brings fresh tears to my eyes... for me a sign of healing.

I live in a small town- where it is impossible to be anonymous for long. I learn to live with that- and strongly protect the sharing in the meetings.

In the bad old days people got sick a lot worse, and conditions were far worse. I think that all families emerge out of that with bumps and bruises... it is up to our generation to promote change, if we can.

In the past ACA or ACoA was for the children of alcoholics. But now it for anyone who needs to come along. I think we do grow up to the level of those around us... by that I mean growing emotionally.

I took my own neediness into a marriage. I think I knew enough to know that marriage would not fix it.

Would it give me the sense of family I didn't have? well, I tried. Sometimes I tried far too hard [something you have observed].

Well to be honest, I took it to Alanon. Now I have friendships and contacts outside of Alanon, having gained confidence.

But, yep- you live and learn... day by day...

David.

Rose6844

It will be a long road, I'm sure, but he did agree to come to an Al Anon meeting, so that is good.

The feedback here has really set me in a direction of finding so much information and insight. I feel like I can "feel" for the first time in a long time, and I'm feeling hopeful, although I know the hard stuff is ahead and no guarantees as to how it will all work out.

I grew up in a large suburb of a big city. Been in a small town for 13 years and still can't get used to the lack of privacy, although it's nice in it's own way too.

Mracoa

I was married 21 years before I started to take ownership of my own problems. As an ACA I was constantly trying to fix others, assign blame, take care of everyone and anything but myself. I neglected myself and grew angry and resentful when others wouldn't do for me what I was doing for them.

Earlier in our marriage my wife wanted us to go to couples counselling. However I maintained that therapists were a rip off. They only reflect back what you say. We should just talk to each other. That's therapy was about anyway , was talking to each other. In my mind therapy was worthless, and I told her as much.

My wife and I kept busy with our seperate projects and hobbies and grew further and further apart. Eventually she succumb to temptation and betrayed me with another man (2 actually). I snapped inside, I was totally and completely broken. I was angry, depressed, fearful and ashamed. It was a horrible feeling.

It did open my eyes to the fact that no matter how well I provide or how nice I tried to be, a relationship is not maintained without dealing with problems head on. I used to avoid conflict. Escape, deflect or deny. That is no basis for a healthy relationship. Being 'nice' means at times I was being dishonest.

So, now we are this broken couple. We are in therapy, and I'm finding it helpful. I'm not sure I can really forgive her. I know that I played my part in our relationship problems. But that doesn't excuse her behavior. If she was really that unhappy she should have told me her needs and filed for divorce if I refused. Maybe the filing for divorce would have snapped me out of it and I would have agreed to counselling. Maybe I would have been pig headed and followed through with the divorce. I'm not really sure.

I hope your marriage doesn't have to disintegrate to the level ours did. I hope your husband will open up and at least read some of the material. I wish I had paid attention sooner. I'm not sure if my marriage is sustainable any more. Either way it turns out I have regrets that I will live with.

Kialua

Mracoa you certainly have a lot of insight now. Congrats on finally looking into the whole thing. Good luck with your wife and your marriage. I hope it works out and you can forgive her and she can forgive you.

Rose6844

Mracoa thank you for sharing what is a very painful story. Although it is my DH that is the ACA, I find we both have components of the behaviours you listed re: fixing things, avoiding conflict, etc etc. I agree, it's not healthy. I have only recently realized how awful and/or empty I have been feeling, a slow build up from years and years of living within this dynamic.

I think if we can both be married for so long, and come to some insight at this stage of life, then there is hope for anything. Thank you so much for reaching out. I can only imagine how horrible the feelings of betrayal were, and I hope that there is healing for you, and possibly your relationship with your wife.

Aviva

Rose, how is this going? So glad you have warm, positive contact with your little niece.

Do you have any of the literature? I found that whiting-out "alcoholic" and "drink" etc makes it easier for me to grasp how my behavior around non-substance issues is affected.

SO's ACOAish traits drove me batty at first ... so I came to Al-Anon for myself, to quiet the ugly need-to-fix that was brewing. He knows that I go to these meetings as well as to AA, but I have been very, very careful not to mention anything about Al-Anon (or ACA) possibly applying to him. Once he said perhaps he should look into it, that maybe growing up as he did affected him more than he'd thought, and I left it at that. So far, so good ... but I have so far to grow.

Vandermast

Perhaps u could both benefit from therapeutic interaction from a licensed professional

wishing u both well. V

Rose6844

Hi everyone. Well, last night was our first Al-Anon meeting. DH came with me. I could see all week the tension building in him, he was very nervous about it. We also had a tragic loss in our family the day before, and I honestly thought about not going as I was already emotional, but I just carried on, didn't make a big deal about it, just booked the babysitter and away we went.

Thank goodness we did. It was nothing like either of us expected, even after I had heard about it here and read a bit about it.

It was a small group, and at first that made us both nervous. I think we had imagined some sort of group therapy. Because we were there, they ran it as a newcomers meeting and that was fantastic. Different people spoke about different aspects of Al-Anon, such as finding serenity, confidentiality (one person said, if we see each other in public, we do not acknowledge that we know one another - and that was a big relief to my DH).

Then everyone shared a bit about what Al-Anon has done for them and with that some of their own stories - some past, some present. Later on someone said we would find snippets of our own truth in what others say, and I could tell already that was true for us.

There was a mix of new people and veterans. There were two fellows in particular who said they had found out how to be happy. That really resonated with me. One of them just seemed to radiate "serenity". It was powerful to hear that others had the same coping issues and had found ways to feel and be at peace.

At the end we asked a bit about just dropping in on meetings and were so reassured that we can come and go (we have scheduling and shift work issues) and that we can go to different groups and just find what fit best for us .

It was a perfect fit for both of us, but in particular DH who tends to be very defensive - this just drop in, go at your own speed, speak your own truth, or don't speak at all approach really made a difference and he actually spoke about feelings of anger and insecurity on the way home. We were able to talk about past trauma influencing current reaction to a major decision we are making. Was the most open conversation I can remember having with him in many many years. Not that it was wide-open amazing, but for him and I it was really good.

I didn't push about going again, but I have the schedule and I know that I will for sure, and he most likely will, once he is back on shift (which isn't for another 2 weeks or so).

So, thank you thank you thank you for all of you recommending Al-Anon. Was a very powerful experience and in our case, I think probably a marriage saving experience.

Rose6844

Aviva thank you for being so kind as to check in. Reminds me of the people I met last night :-)

Yes, the ACOAish traits of DH have resulted in so much conflict. My reaction to them included. What I said to him last night is that part of my work is recognizing when it's an ACOA reaction, and not making it about more than that. To me, just learning about ACOA, I'm (ideally) able to see his "method" of dealing with conflict, so to speak, and detach from it - not make it about whether he is loving person, making a proper decision as a parent, crazy....

Which is not the whole solution, and I wouldn't say I'm able to detach so much as at least able to recognize it. But for me that is huge.

Kialua

I'm so glad it was a comfortable meeting for you. You describe it so perfectly it could be a good resource for so many. I hope you find much insight and help there. If we can be a sounding board we are here. This is also a drop in when you need it, so don't feel bad if you need to come and go here as well.