Does this make any sense?
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Does this make any sense?
Recent threads milling about have brought me to here, although my mother was not an alcoholic I have no doubt her mother was.
And I am wondering … my mother didn’t become the classic codependent, it almost seems as if she took on the role of a volatile alcoholic without the drinking????
I also am curious if anyone else dealt with the fact that it seems their abusive parent knew something was wrong on some level….My mother thought the beatings were normal and not a big deal as she reminded over and over to never talk of what happens in this house… but she swore to us that we would never live the reality her and her mother did as adults….and yet she perpetuates the cycle, almost pushes for it to be exactly what she lived. At times I watch the dynamics and think omg I saw this before.
She has never admitted to anything. If I even mention the word dysfunction in any way she goes insane and swears what a normal life we all had. And I would have been all for divorce at any time, but back then I am not sure that would have been a good thing to happen because then the mothers got the children and the children didn’t have any say. My father’s presence saved my life, without him removing her, even if it took years, I don’t think I would be here today.
And I am wondering … my mother didn’t become the classic codependent, it almost seems as if she took on the role of a volatile alcoholic without the drinking????
I also am curious if anyone else dealt with the fact that it seems their abusive parent knew something was wrong on some level….My mother thought the beatings were normal and not a big deal as she reminded over and over to never talk of what happens in this house… but she swore to us that we would never live the reality her and her mother did as adults….and yet she perpetuates the cycle, almost pushes for it to be exactly what she lived. At times I watch the dynamics and think omg I saw this before.
She has never admitted to anything. If I even mention the word dysfunction in any way she goes insane and swears what a normal life we all had. And I would have been all for divorce at any time, but back then I am not sure that would have been a good thing to happen because then the mothers got the children and the children didn’t have any say. My father’s presence saved my life, without him removing her, even if it took years, I don’t think I would be here today.
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Hello incitingsilence, and pleased to "meet" you 
Makes perfect sense. There are many reasons why people _start_ drinking. One of them is that they find the effects of alcohol to be almost magical. All their crazy feelings go away and they feel almost normal. Some people refer to that as "self-medicating" with alcohol.
Medical science has found that some people have a different metabolism when it comes to drugs and alcohol. Those chemicals have entirely different effects in their body and mind than with the rest of the population.
If you get a person who needs to self-medicate, for whatever reason, and they also have that body chemistry then you wind up with one of those angry, hostile drunks. Sometimes they quit drinking, but they don't resolve the original issues. Some people call them "dry drunks".
What happens to a person who has those horrid feelings of anger that they can't control, and when they drink alcohol..... nothing happens? Those are the people who do _not_ have the internal chemistry that leads to addiction, but they still have the rage, the insane thoughts, the wild feelings.
Yes, it does make perfect sense, and it is fairly common in "toxic families". I come from an alcoholic family. I had one aunt who was _not_ an alcoholic, but she suffered the horrors of being raised in a "tocix family". She could not self-medicate with alcohol becuase it just did not work for her. Instead she became anorexic.
That's one of the "symptoms" of a toxic family. Children are raised in a toxic environment, they learn what they live, grow up, become adults, and then repeat the same behavior with their own children. Sometimes the behavior is not _exactly_ the same, sometimes it is very different but _still_ toxic.
That is where the expression "breaking the chain" comes from. It is very difficult for a person to change their behavior if they have no _awareness_ that any other kind of behavior is even possible. Some people do find that awareness, and then choose to find a better life for themselves. Those are the people you see in this forum
Well.... "normal" in who's life?
I have never been to China. I have _no_ idea what is "normal" for a middle class family in China, what is normal for teenagers in high school.
For a person raised in chaos, who has never seen anything other than chaos, that is the only "normal" they have ever seen.
I am glad you are here today. And I am glad you decided to post. Take a few minutes to read the "sticky" posts at the top of this forum. Browse around the posts. Tell us what you think. I hope you find answers to your questions.
Mike
Originally Posted by incitingsilence 
.... it almost seems as if she took on the role of a volatile alcoholic without the drinking????....
Medical science has found that some people have a different metabolism when it comes to drugs and alcohol. Those chemicals have entirely different effects in their body and mind than with the rest of the population.
If you get a person who needs to self-medicate, for whatever reason, and they also have that body chemistry then you wind up with one of those angry, hostile drunks. Sometimes they quit drinking, but they don't resolve the original issues. Some people call them "dry drunks".
What happens to a person who has those horrid feelings of anger that they can't control, and when they drink alcohol..... nothing happens? Those are the people who do _not_ have the internal chemistry that leads to addiction, but they still have the rage, the insane thoughts, the wild feelings.
Yes, it does make perfect sense, and it is fairly common in "toxic families". I come from an alcoholic family. I had one aunt who was _not_ an alcoholic, but she suffered the horrors of being raised in a "tocix family". She could not self-medicate with alcohol becuase it just did not work for her. Instead she became anorexic.
Originally Posted by incitingsilence
....I also am curious if anyone else dealt with the fact that it seems their abusive parent knew something was wrong on some level ... and yet she perpetuates the cycle....
That is where the expression "breaking the chain" comes from. It is very difficult for a person to change their behavior if they have no _awareness_ that any other kind of behavior is even possible. Some people do find that awareness, and then choose to find a better life for themselves. Those are the people you see in this forum
Originally Posted by incitingsilence
.... If I even mention the word dysfunction in any way she goes insane and swears what a normal life we all had.....
I have never been to China. I have _no_ idea what is "normal" for a middle class family in China, what is normal for teenagers in high school.
For a person raised in chaos, who has never seen anything other than chaos, that is the only "normal" they have ever seen.
Originally Posted by incitingsilence
....My father’s presence saved my life, without him removing her, even if it took years, I don’t think I would be here today. ....
Mike
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Join Date: Feb 2011
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InsctingSilence ,great to have you Here......
In ACA ,the Meeting I attend,this Toxic Attitude is Called Para Alcoholism.
We take on the Characteristics of the disease without ever Taking a Drink....it would be worth your while................
Having a look at the ACA Problem and Laundry List.....There is a Solution.
In ACA ,the Meeting I attend,this Toxic Attitude is Called Para Alcoholism.
We take on the Characteristics of the disease without ever Taking a Drink....it would be worth your while................
Having a look at the ACA Problem and Laundry List.....There is a Solution.
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,384
Welcome to the forum!! I know what you are talking about. My parents do the same thing. They complain about how much they were abused, but then they were abusive themselves. Alcoholism runs through my father's side. However, his father was not an alcoholic. Despite that, his father was very abusive. So, even though the alcoholism wasn't passed to that generation, the toxic behavior was.
Abuse gets passed from generation to generation, but it can be stopped.
Abuse gets passed from generation to generation, but it can be stopped.
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Join Date: Jan 2009
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I am far from new to the gig, we all have our stories don’t we … but Mike the way you described it makes total sense and it is the first time I have read anything like that, very thought provoking…
There has been more than a few things this past week that I have read that have been big ahhh moments, including what you all have written here, thank you …
There has been more than a few things this past week that I have read that have been big ahhh moments, including what you all have written here, thank you …
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Join Date: Dec 2008
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My mom was (and is, to a degree) the same way. She has never been an alcoholic (although she did marry one, but she must have been in denial about it for a really long time, as I never noticed it and she never talked about it...she still doesn't "know for sure" whether my step-dad sneaks out for drinks when he obviously does).
Although she was never an alcoholic, she carried on the raging, neurotic, unpredictable and cruel behavior that her alcoholic father had.
She has improved to a degree, at least in my life, but she is still the vindictive, hateful, emotionally abusive spouse to my step-father (and he is the same way, so it's really a pretty picture to have them both together).
So yes, it makes perfect sense to me. As others have pointed out, the cycle of abuse can be perpetuated any which way, alcohol or no alcohol.
The great (and frightening) thing about it is that *we* have the ability to stop that cycle, because we have sought help.
It can be really frightening for me, because I feel like if I don't succeed in stopping the cycle of verbal abuse that my mom heaped on me as a child, then it will be a double failure because I tried and failed. These behaviors are so hard to break sometimes, but I figure if I keep trying I'll get there.
Thank you for posting, and welcome!
Although she was never an alcoholic, she carried on the raging, neurotic, unpredictable and cruel behavior that her alcoholic father had.
She has improved to a degree, at least in my life, but she is still the vindictive, hateful, emotionally abusive spouse to my step-father (and he is the same way, so it's really a pretty picture to have them both together).
So yes, it makes perfect sense to me. As others have pointed out, the cycle of abuse can be perpetuated any which way, alcohol or no alcohol.
The great (and frightening) thing about it is that *we* have the ability to stop that cycle, because we have sought help.
It can be really frightening for me, because I feel like if I don't succeed in stopping the cycle of verbal abuse that my mom heaped on me as a child, then it will be a double failure because I tried and failed. These behaviors are so hard to break sometimes, but I figure if I keep trying I'll get there.
Thank you for posting, and welcome!
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