Midnightfrost

So my mother is very manipulating. I've let her manipulate me into all kinds of bad decisions. But I'm not doing that anymore. I've found talking to her on the phone to be dangerous for me. As she talks and lies my head starts to spin and all the what ifs start to pop up. What if I'm wrong? What if I'm crazy? etc. So I've stopped talking to her on the phone for now. We've been exchanging email and I'll send her a voice mail telling her I've sent her an email or responding to a call but I don't answer when she calls or return her calls.

It's kinda nice emailing because I can finish a whole thought and thought respond to what she says. I can also see just how ridiculous and unrealistic a lot of what she says is. Because its not in the heat of the moment I have time to think and respond. She still out and out denies any kind of addiction. She accuses me and everyone else of betraying her. Is that a common characteristic among addicts? She hates me speaking to her friends or discussing her with family members? Think she's trying to keep everyone isolated so she can keep us all in the dark? I've finally started to reach out to friends and family members. And we're all staying in touch trying to figure out what's best. Everyone is firm on not giving or lending money. One friend is helping with welfare and medicaid paperwork.

I just don't understand how she can deny such an obvious disease. I don't understand why she lies and rages at me instead of being honest with the both of us. She's always been rather hard headed. And since she started getting ill its just gotten worse. She's always seemed to decide exactly what was wrong with her and how it needed to be fixed. If something was wrong with me I would go to the doctor and ask what he/she thought was wrong and let her run test and figure it out. And I'd follow his advice. But mother marches in there already having decided what's wrong with her and what he's going to do to fix it. It absolutely drives me up the wall. And makes it nearly impossible to get any help for her. She only tells what she think the doc will want to hear to support whatever she has decided is wrong.

For so long I've been isolated from other people because Mother considered any discussion of her, her health, or finances as a total betrayal. She absolutely forbade it. Like she has any control over other people! Discussing family matters was not allowed with people other than her. She even told me what I could and could not discuss with my brother, my aunt, my grandmother. She didn't want me to speak to other family members at all because they had betrayed her so me talking to them was in essence betraying her. Uggg. . . . so much guilt involved in reaching out for help and support because of it. But I have and the world hasn't crumbled thankfully and I feel a lot less alone and lost. Still battling huge waves of guilt though. It's getting better though. I hope she realizes people aren't trying to judge and condemn her. This is all exhausting but I'm feeling better and better about the decisions I've made recently.

DesertEyes

Yup, sure is. If you browse around the other "Friends and Family" forums you'll see how common it is.

What difference does it make? Suppose you _did_ understand, what then? Your understanding her is not going to make her magically become a different person. I know cuz I tried to understand my alcoholic folks and that never changed them.

Yeah, I went thru that too. The big family secret. 'cept everybody else knew perfectly well my folks were drunks, they were only keeping it a secret from themselves.

Good for you, and congratulations. That's a major victory for you.

I'm glad to hear that. I found that as I got more practice at my "recovery" it became easier and easier. I think they call that a "learning curve", where it's really hard at first but get easier with practice. Sounds to me like you're doing real good

Mike

GingerM

Hear hear!! Yup, like with anything else we learn in life, practice, practice, practice!

I, too, grew up where "You don't air your dirty laundry!". It took me a long time to be able to talk about the elephant in the living room that everyone could see but no one would acknowledge.

Any major change we try to make in our lives will involve some level of discomfort and adjustment - such as when I was told I needed to cut refined sugars out of my diet, it took me a couple of years to get used to that. You are trying to make not only a physical change, but a change in how you perceive your world. It's not going to be fast, and it's bound to cause some emotional upheaval.

Just keep at it, I promise it gets easier (and feels so liberating!) the more you do it.

Wascally Wabbit

This is because deep down they know they have something to hide. Funny how that kind of thinking is so twisted.
I have a alcoholic mother. Sober 30 yrs, but the behaviors are the same. The manipulation etc.
I got to where instead of calling her every night I call every other day.
No one else gets to me like she does. I get VERY upset with her remarks. I am learning, really I am, not to let it get to me like it does.

Midnightfrost

Thanks for all the support! I feel like if she just acknowledged the problem we could work from the basis that she does have a problem. Talking to her seems so pointless when you can't actually discuss what is causing all the problems that she goes on and on about. The mere suggestion of addiction and she flies off the handle screaming and yelling and crying. She has this whole delusional past constructed too and you can't suggest that some things may have been a bit different then she remembers them. So I can't discuss the present with her or the past so its just frustrating.

I got an email from her today. And she sets out what she expects and demands. No negotiation. This is how things are going to be! I just don't understand how you can think you have that kind of control over things. Then she goes on to accuse me of being controlling because I won't fly her back and forth for Dr appts when she lives near one of the best medical centers in the world. So its controlling when I make decisions in my best interest but she's just being a good mother when she lays down the law. Its just infuriating. I don't trust myself to talk to her on the phone cause I know I'll get caught up in it all. And I just don't even know how to respond to the email. Thinking I just won't respond. I've told her several times I'm not flying her on my passes and she just won't let it go. :horse

Wascally Wabbit

The problem is she has not recognized she has a problem and as long as she's in that state, things will remain the same.
We have to put our selves FIRST when it comes to this kind of person.
Someone told me I can love her from a distance and offer support, but I do not have to be a door mat to anyone. When the negative or critical speech comes, I learned to quickly change the subject by saying something random like, "It looks like rain is coming", and I will keep talking non stop about the rain until she changes her thought pattern. Most of the time that works.
As for your moms "demands", it's ok to say NO.

Midnightfrost

that's what I keep telling myself. Its ok to just say No. Thanks!

GingerM

Not only is it okay to just say no, sometimes it is the best thing we can do for ourselves. And if we don't take care of ourselves, no one else is going to want to.

Wascally Wabbit

Amen Ginger. It certianly is the best thing for me to say no a lot of the time.
The last time I got upset, and this will show the emotional power she had (but is losing) over me was about 2 wks ago.
I wound up having that panic attack feeling for two solid days. I couldn't breathe, I had symptoms of running a fever when I really wasn't.
This kind of stress can kill you!
I am learning to live and let live with her, and to keep myself out of her chaotic spasms of negativity.

GingerM

Good job Wascal! That's no trivial feat you're accomplishing! It's taken me years to get to where I could live and let live when it came to dysfunctional people, but I, too, am getting there (I don't know if I'll ever be completely free of that inner "ick" feeling, but the closer I get, the better it feels).

It's amazing to me now, looking back, at how many dysfunctional people I invited into my life and how many I allowed to have such major control over my emotions. No wonder I always liked animals better than people! With the exception of blood relatives and coworkers, I think I've finally cleansed my life of all the poor choices I made in my past. The former I'm doing well with on maintaining my boundaries, and the latter I feel sorry for because I remember what it was like to be that way.