Blogs


Notices

Giving up our power.

Old 05-16-2003, 08:00 AM
  # 21 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Bristol TN/VA
Posts: 12,262
Blog Entries: 5
Steph!!!

I hear that!!!

Sorry I am not strong enough to talk about this right now.

But, yeah, our main family rule was "don't upset your mother"

It's like "Is she 5 years old?!?!?!?!" y'know?

I break the rule. The others get mad at me for it.

But one of the first things I was required to do when I first went in counseling was to write her and tell her my boundaries and that I would not accept those violations.

After several years of trying to force some understanding and growth...I decided it was not my job and I do not want to raise my mother.

At the same time, I have to fight my way out of being pushed into the old roles....
even if it means I am the scapegoat!!!


live
Live is offline  
Old 05-16-2003, 08:22 AM
  # 22 (permalink)  
believer
 
journeygal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: walking in faith
Posts: 1,023
Live, for someone who doesn't feel strong enough to talk about this stuff, I'd say you're doing just fine!
I have always just took it and not reacted to protect her. Does that make sense. Also, if something bad happened to me she couldn't emotionally support me because she felt my pain to much and got so upset. I had to deal with stuff by myself and pretend everything was OK because she couldn't handle it. It was like she didn't know where she ended and I began.
I think it's like that with my mom too, both of my parents actually. I protect them from my feelings b/c they couldn't handle it.

When I was in college my dad would call me every day, asking about my grades, my classes, etc. It drove me insane. It finally got to the point where I couldn't take it any more and I lost it. I told him that he had no idea how much stress he was putting me under and that I was even afraid to answer the phone b/c I was scared it would be him. He was shocked and said he had no idea I felt that way. He didn't call me for over a year after that. Not out of anger, but he just couldn't deal with the fact that I said those things and felt that way b/c of him.

That was the first and last real conversation I had with either one of them. It would crush them if they knew how affected I was by my upbringing. They don't even know I'm in therapy. It's my way of protecting them, and from protecting myself from any backlash.
journeygal is offline  
Old 05-16-2003, 04:14 PM
  # 23 (permalink)  
Member
 
margo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: North Vancouver, British Columbia
Posts: 1,714
Steph - you really got me thinking with the word "minimize." I can feel thoughts coming faster than I can process them. Stop the planet - I want to get off!

Seriously, though, that is such an interesting word - it never occured to me that I was minimizing my own past. I, too, get a real sense of hurt and anger as I read these posts, yet I have never outwardly displayed those emotions for my own issues. I don't know whether that is denial or not. We weren't even allowed to show emotions when I was a kid. I know that I turned everything inwards and did my fair share of harming myself with drugs and alcohol on and off for many years, and went looking for love in all the wrong places with the wrong people. There but for the grace of God...

If it's true that I really am minimizing, then I'm awfully far down the ol 'River Denial and I must be paddling with the current. Thing is, though, I don't feel like I am. What happened to me, happened. I think I have made peace with the past. I have no anger towards my parents - I feel sorrow and a great deal of love for them. I don't want to get angry with them, either, and I think I fear going and poking around in all that stuff might bring that upon me. I do understand that this isn't about blame. I do know it's about finding out why we are the way we are and changing the behaviours that we don't like in ourselves so that we can look after ourselves better.

Live's post was a real kicker too. Now that I think about it, what kid has power? I think that word is a misnomer. Perhaps the word "choice" or "voice" makes more sense to me, because I know for sure that I didn't have either of those.

((((((Group))))))
margo is offline  
Old 05-16-2003, 05:03 PM
  # 24 (permalink)  
Paused
 
Gypsygirlmom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Climbing outa da Black Hole
Posts: 146
I've had to step out for a bit.

But Margo ~ you don't have to get angry with them! Your relationship with them is good now, and can stay that way. Looking to the past, we do for us, not to destroy what we have now. And to get rid of guilt that really isn't ours, that acoa's tend to carry around with them. To put the guilt where it belongs, and not live our lives today, by our reactions to past experiences.

Hugs!!

Minimize is good! I'm a pro at it ! No he didn't hit me with a closed fist, it was just a slap, so it wasn't really that bad!
Gypsygirlmom is offline  
Old 05-16-2003, 05:11 PM
  # 25 (permalink)  
Member
 
margo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: North Vancouver, British Columbia
Posts: 1,714
Gypsy - I hear you! The thing is though, I feel like I have a right to be angry, and I do wonder why I've never felt it for myself. I probably displace it because if someone hurts a person that I love and care about, I get very protective and defensive on their part. This discussion is good though - I am gaining more understanding all the time.
margo is offline  
Old 05-16-2003, 05:17 PM
  # 26 (permalink)  
Member
 
phoenix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Dreaming Summer
Posts: 821
Mine was beaten out of me and taken in other ways,both physical and emotional over the years..Choosing to be solitary seems to be my main defense.I make my choices today and stand by them.

But even now,I am sometimes too easily undone.At the moment I am doubting my ability to voice a point of view,maybe doubting my right to do so.I'm reasonably bright and articulate.But someone comes down on me for something I said,and even if I disagree, I feel shaken.Worse,I feel wrong for speaking up for myself.I wonder why I got singled out(if I did)for a reprimand.

And I decide to stay out of further discussions that might turn out the same.I hate feeling "less than" or feeling like the easy target for someones elses stress.I tend to regret letting my guard down.It's safer just to distance myself.

Guess I still have a lot of work to do.


phoenix

PS....I really admire you all
phoenix is offline  
Old 05-16-2003, 05:38 PM
  # 27 (permalink)  
Member
 
margo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: North Vancouver, British Columbia
Posts: 1,714
Phoenix - I think when those things happened to us as kids, the question became, for me anyway, What did I do wrong? When you can't come up with a reason, you start to doubt yourself. If that happens often enough, we start to doubt everything about ourselves and it carries through. I think.

You know, it's funny - I've always longed to have the ability to distance myself from my feelings, to feel like I could control my responses to certain things with intellect instead of emotion.

I see so much stength in you Phoenix, and I really admire YOU!
margo is offline  
Old 05-16-2003, 08:35 PM
  # 28 (permalink)  
JT
Supply Manager
Thread Starter
 
JT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Cleaverville
Posts: 2,898
I wonder about that distancing sometimes. It is like I went from out of control to detached to...what?...stone? Sometimes I think it takes a nuclear blast to get my attention.

And on the subject of crumbling I am feeling like that is where mini me comes in. Where does that inabilty come from? Lack of confidence? Not trusting myself and my beliefs? Self worth? Another trigger?

I for one intend to pay attention to that feeling and try to identify it. When does it happen? Are there common themes? Give it a name. Accept it and then move to change it.

Hugs,
JT
JT is offline  
Old 05-16-2003, 08:54 PM
  # 29 (permalink)  
Member
 
phoenix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Dreaming Summer
Posts: 821
Originally posted by margo
Phoenix - I think when those things happened to us as kids, the question became, for me anyway, What did I do wrong? When you can't come up with a reason, you start to doubt yourself. If that happens often enough, we start to doubt everything about ourselves and it carries through. I think.
It troubles me some.For so many years I was not allowed to have my own voice.I was expected simply to exist as an echo.When I would rebel,and go my own way,the price could be very high.I became a very quiet person,soft spoken and easily spooked.

It's taken so long to reach a point where I will sometimes speak up and even dare to disagree.When I do,I am so careful.I try to be objective and not forceful.I try to present my point of view without ridiculing the other person.I never insist that the other person should agree with me.

To be that careful and somehow still find myself in hot water....

I probably take it way too hard.

Originally posted by margo

You know, it's funny - I've always longed to have the ability to distance myself from my feelings, to feel like I could control my responses to certain things with intellect instead of emotion.

I see so much stength in you Phoenix, and I really admire YOU!
Thanks Margo.I guess I tried to distance myself from my feelings when I was using.Now I just distance myself from the things that trigger painful feelings.Sometimes that's ok,and sometimes it isn't

phoenix
phoenix is offline  
Old 05-16-2003, 10:36 PM
  # 30 (permalink)  
Member
 
Stephanie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: The Basement
Posts: 724
[i]
It's taken so long to reach a point where I will sometimes speak up and even dare to disagree.When I do,I am so careful.I try to be objective and not forceful.I try to present my point of view without ridiculing the other person.I never insist that the other person should agree with me.

To be that careful and somehow still find myself in hot water....

I probably take it way too hard.


This is very interesting because I show this kind of behavior in other ways. For example it took me forever to feel comfortable calling a sponsor because I always feel like a burden. I don't want to bother anyone. I realize that sometimes I sound so pathetic with people like excuse me I hope I'm not bothering you is it ok if I ask you something, I'll be really quick. I wouldn't ask if it wasn't really important. If you're busy I totally understand....blah blah

Over the last yr really, probably since alanon stuff I try not to do that anymore. Not because I don't still feel that way a lot of times. You know, not worthy of someones time but I've learned that even though I'm working on myself and I've done a lot of healing, I'm in AA, I have good friends and you guys.....there's still a lot of really sick people in the world and I have always made myself a perfect target with my not good enough bull sh.. Because I'm used to being the scapegoat it seems to be tatooed on my forehead and my behavior screams for you to take advantage. I don't like it, I never liked it but now I'm starting not to accept it. It's very hard because even though I have begun to stand up for myself a lot more I'm still scared to death when I do it.

I think I'm very much like my mother in one way. She 's very strong in a lot of ways, intellectually, in her career etc. Me too, I mean just try to get one past me in a store or something and I am all over it. i got a jogging stroller for free because I called corporate headquarters when I found out the model I bought was discontinued and the guy in the store told me it was the new more improved model. But anything having to do with personal emotions and I'm full of self doubt. See here even now, just like phoenix says. I'm thinking to myself do I want people to know I feel full of self doubt in certain situations because if they know that then they will hurt me some how.
Stephanie is offline  
Old 05-17-2003, 07:38 AM
  # 31 (permalink)  
Member
 
phoenix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Dreaming Summer
Posts: 821
Originally posted by Stephanie
This is very interesting because I show this kind of behavior in other ways. For example it took me forever to feel comfortable calling a sponsor because I always feel like a burden. I don't want to bother anyone. I realize that sometimes I sound so pathetic with people like excuse me I hope I'm not bothering you is it ok if I ask you something, I'll be really quick. I wouldn't ask if it wasn't really important. If you're busy I totally understand....blah blah


Steph...I do that tooooooooo

Sometimes I think you are my long lost cosmic twin


phoenix
phoenix is offline  
Old 05-19-2003, 05:34 AM
  # 32 (permalink)  
Member
 
lyn_blossom78's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Ohio
Posts: 444
Two incidents come to mind.......

When I was in the 7th grade, I seemed to have a problem "hearing" what people said to me the first time through--especially my Dad's voice. I'd say "Huh?" then answer the question, after I let what he said register in my brain. So, my Dad made me stand in front of him, and he whispered a line of cuss words, and told me to repeat what he said. Now, I knew if I repeated them, I'd be beat for saying cuss words. I also knew if I didn't repeat them, I'd be beat for not doing what I was told. I felt so hopeless, knowing I couldn't do a thing to keep from being beat. I guess I've always felt I didn't have any control, but manipulation to keep out of trouble did become a way of life, and still is.

Another time, my Mom and Dad got into a huge fight. I was in the 5th grade. This was not long after my Dad got back from Vietnam after being gone a couple of years. He was drunk, and my mother had found out she had MS, so was quite emotionally unstable over it. She was on a lot of meds, so decided to take a handful of them during the fight. My dad drug her into the kitchen and started running the garbage disposal, with my Mom's head in the sink. We thought he was trying to kill her, when he was actually trying to get rid of all of her meds. Her hair was in the garbage disposal. It was awful. She died a year later from MS.

I suppose the loss of power started long before that, though.... I'll have to ponder it.

Lyn
lyn_blossom78 is offline  

Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off




All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:59 PM.