Child & Wife of ACOA
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: detroit michigan
Posts: 2
Child & Wife of ACOA
Hi, I am a child and wife of an acoa. I see a lot of simialarities in my mother and husband in some of the situations I have read about I would like to help both my mother and husband, myself as well. I think my relationship with my husband would be alot better if he learned to deal with the prob he has about communication. He totally shuts down when if we are arguing or if things are to personal. He will not talk about his mothers substance abuse prob its like he is scared. When he shuts down I get mad and argue, cuss, and fuss I get so frustrated but sometimes it seems like that is the only way to get through to him. It seems like we are following a pattern if you can understand this it seems like he needs that abnormality to make it normal. I have saw and heard his mother cussing and fussing I dont want to be anything like her An I want to stop this continued pattern. His mother has been in recovery for about a month from drug abuse and alcohol abuse but he still will not ask her any questions he only knows what she tells him its like he's afraid of her. One time he told me his mother was a grown woman when I asked was he afraid to ask her questions. On the other hand my mother whose mother was an alcoholic resented her mother (she passed away) and still resents her I think anyway we were talking and she just now realized her mother was a functioning alcoholic and although she drank she still took care of her kids and kept a roof over there heads. My mother is a very kindhearted person and would do anything for her family and for a lot of people for that matter. Is there any suggestions on how to get through to my husband and/or how to comfort my mother. I gave my husband the 13 characteristics of an acoa and it seemed to offend him, he asked is that how I saw him he does not have all of the char just some but I didn't know what to say. His mother is in a treatment house and still calls and asks for money even though it is four of us with a house note car note and insurance on 2 cars etc and my husband feels bad about saying no I dont know if he's giving her money without my knowledge though.. I thought she would kind of change her ways once she was in recovery. I cant understand why he doesn't tell her flat out were struggling with 2 kids and it's just one of you.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Under the Rainbow
Posts: 1,086
I wanted to let you know that I've read what you posted. I would like to respond, but my response isn't going to be short or quick, so I'd like to wait until I have a bit more time.
You are heard. I would suggest you read the stickies at the top of this page and at the top of the 'friends and family' forum in the meantime.
I hope your day treats you well.
You are heard. I would suggest you read the stickies at the top of this page and at the top of the 'friends and family' forum in the meantime.
I hope your day treats you well.
On a tear
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Volcano Country!
Posts: 3,221
Hi Cnfzd... Welcome!
What I know about addicted relatives is that they find their way in their own time... his mom is only newly sober, and has close to zero "time" to figure out how she feels (her feelings have been numbed for decades by now) and who she really is and what she wants in life. Until she figures those things out, she will rely on the behaviors she already knows... the bad ones.
As an adult child, one of my biggest "traits" is fear... I am not all that afraid of DOING wrong, but deathly afraid of BEING wrong. I hope that makes sense. Not fitting into the rest of the world - being "less than" in many ways is part of what being an adult child is for me.
If my husband had presented me with a list of what I considered to be "defects", then I might also have been offended. Today, what I know is that you were trying to empathize and be helpful.
You are a kind and loving wife and deserve to have good relationships in your life.
The program I work is Alanon - though there are ACOA groups around the country as well as Alanon groups with an ACA focus. I went to fix someone else in my life (smile - which is why almost EVERYONE gets to Alanon) and ended up "fixing" myself (still a work in progress).
You might try 5 or 6 Alanon meetings - and perhaps see if your husband will accompany you. There are also Alanon speaker tapes that are great to listen to - they are often taped directly from a speaker meeting at a regional or national conference around the country and have incredible Experience Strength and Hope. Google "Alanon speaker tape" to get a list of places to order from.
I wish you well!
What I know about addicted relatives is that they find their way in their own time... his mom is only newly sober, and has close to zero "time" to figure out how she feels (her feelings have been numbed for decades by now) and who she really is and what she wants in life. Until she figures those things out, she will rely on the behaviors she already knows... the bad ones.
As an adult child, one of my biggest "traits" is fear... I am not all that afraid of DOING wrong, but deathly afraid of BEING wrong. I hope that makes sense. Not fitting into the rest of the world - being "less than" in many ways is part of what being an adult child is for me.
If my husband had presented me with a list of what I considered to be "defects", then I might also have been offended. Today, what I know is that you were trying to empathize and be helpful.
You are a kind and loving wife and deserve to have good relationships in your life.
The program I work is Alanon - though there are ACOA groups around the country as well as Alanon groups with an ACA focus. I went to fix someone else in my life (smile - which is why almost EVERYONE gets to Alanon) and ended up "fixing" myself (still a work in progress).
You might try 5 or 6 Alanon meetings - and perhaps see if your husband will accompany you. There are also Alanon speaker tapes that are great to listen to - they are often taped directly from a speaker meeting at a regional or national conference around the country and have incredible Experience Strength and Hope. Google "Alanon speaker tape" to get a list of places to order from.
I wish you well!
Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Under the Rainbow
Posts: 1,086
Bis Sis said it much better than I could have.
I would be concerned that perhaps you are feeding the behaviors which you dislike in your husband. Codependent people (yes, men can be codies too) will seek out people who keep them in that role because it's the only role they know.
You may want to ask yourself if your behaviors are so similar to his mother's way of treating him, and you want his behaviors to stop, how can he stop his reactions when you, by your own admission, are treating him the same way she does?
This was going to be longer but BigSis was nice enough to say a lot of it for me.
Ginger
I would be concerned that perhaps you are feeding the behaviors which you dislike in your husband. Codependent people (yes, men can be codies too) will seek out people who keep them in that role because it's the only role they know.
You may want to ask yourself if your behaviors are so similar to his mother's way of treating him, and you want his behaviors to stop, how can he stop his reactions when you, by your own admission, are treating him the same way she does?
This was going to be longer but BigSis was nice enough to say a lot of it for me.
Ginger
fairyprincess
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: South Jordan, UT
Posts: 25
At this point the mother will most likely never change her ways and the son (your husband) will always feel responsible for her. Its a vicious circle of victim, savior, victim. My mom used to call me or my brother to get money. I would give her small increments like 20.00 here or there, I would tell her that's all I could spare in my situation. Soon enough she died from alcohol and I never felt guilty for burning a bridge that I didn't really have too. It may sound mean, but I've always heard you find yourself through charity so I thought of my mom as charity and I gave if I could, or not if I couldn't and left it at that. You cannot change her or her ideas and you cannot change how your husband feels about her, and it is not your job to do so. If it is just a matter of some money here or there and the boundries stay firm, count it as doing what you can for someone incapable of doing for themselves....for whatever reason that you may not comprehend...
Member
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: WA Rainforest
Posts: 209
Yep, I'd say definitely you are following a pattern. Do you like living in that pattern? do you like where it's leading you? if not then you have to break the pattern.
first step is realizing you can't change your husband and you can't change his mother and you can't change your mother. You can change yourself and how you react to them. that's it.
He shuts down when you argue? well who wouldn't. Adults who are married should discuss, not argue. Perfectly natural to get defensive when someone argues with you, and ACOAs shut down when attacked, even if it doesn't seem to you like an attack it feels like one to him. You're not going to change that in him but you can change what you do when he does that.
You stop this continued pattern by Stopping Yourself from acting in it. That's it. That's the magic. You can learn new ways to communicate with him that don't follow that old pattern that doesn't work.
It's only been a month. A month is nothing! she's barely begun! I wouldn't even say she's IN recovery if it's only been a month, she's just starting, and if she's still doing the same old things then she's not in recovery yet, just in a house where she can try to recover. It's a state of mind, not an address. She won't change right away if ever, he won't change fast either but youth is on his side, and their relationship may not change at all whatever changes the people involved make in themselves. Recover takes years! if ever.
Here's the most important thing I learned from my ex AH's counselors: don't let him hold you hostage. Don't let him control what happens to you. Don't wait for him to change, if you do you're letting him control what happens to you. Sure your relationship would be better if he learned better communication. But why wait for him? You could be waiting forever! Start right now yourself learning new communication patterns! He may be unable to change so long as you are in the pattern you're in now and you may be the only one in this relationship with the strength and ability to make the first move. First step, and the hardest, is to let go of trying to control him or his mother.
first step is realizing you can't change your husband and you can't change his mother and you can't change your mother. You can change yourself and how you react to them. that's it.
He shuts down when you argue? well who wouldn't. Adults who are married should discuss, not argue. Perfectly natural to get defensive when someone argues with you, and ACOAs shut down when attacked, even if it doesn't seem to you like an attack it feels like one to him. You're not going to change that in him but you can change what you do when he does that.
I have saw and heard his mother cussing and fussing I dont want to be anything like her An I want to stop this continued pattern.
I thought she would kind of change her ways once she was in recovery.
I think my relationship with my husband would be alot better if he learned to deal with the prob he has about communication
Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Bucharest Romania
Posts: 8
I am in much the same situation you are. hubby is from a alch. home and I am from a toxic home. The problem is that in my home there was no official diagnosis. So I focus on "the real problem". His family cuz now they are really messed up. lol just another form of denial. I am trying to change that behavior and 'own my own" sh##.
His parents have both died within the last 18 months. We detached from them years ago and I for one have few regrets. We have a very good relationship. Communication is very difficult and we have been working on it for 18 years. I have come to the conclusion that it may always be difficult. he hates all forms of confrontation and takes everything as a criticism. I do try really hard to word things "right" somethimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. The problem is that my family fought for sport. We kept score on who won and who got the most jabs in. My mother really enjoyed getting me from normal person to bit## in 5 seconds and she practiced on all of kids who would play her game. I found a man who would not fight but now I avoid confrontation too and am truly afaid of my own anger...so I tend to hide it and guess what it doesn't go away....anger is a healty emotion...okay I don't really believe that either but my therapsit said it so I believe her.
OK to the point......we all carry our own baggage into our relationships. We are so used to carrying it around it becomes part of us. IMHO your husband is very confused right now it is so much easier to hang out in denial. He wants to believe his mom is a good mom a good person and she loves him. He feels these things connot be true if he accepts the FACT she is an addict. Right now he can't wrap his mind around the idea that she loves him and is an addict so he acts like he is ignorant to her behavior. It is his only way of holding onto "his" reality. If he admitted the truth "his" reality would start to crumble. He needs to be in a "Safe" place for that to happen...He will have to create a new reality it takes time and alot of tears. Be patient he will get to that safe place if you let him.
My husband and I have a phrase that helped. THE big pink elephant in the middle of the room. His father's addiction is like a big pink elephant in the middle of the room. It just keeps getting bigger. and nobody sees it so it just keeps getting bigger and pretty soon they all have to dance to aviod aknowledging the big pink elephant. My husband and I moved to his hometown and didn't know the dance we just showed up and a big pink elephant was in the middle of the living room and everybody was doing this crazy dance.....So we said "HEY what is up with the elephant"...all of a sudden WE WERE THE PROBLEM. Nobody was ready accept the truth and since we were the first to "notice" the elephant we were the enemy. What is really sad is that FIL behavior had started destoying his family 30 years before this happened and they had been living in denial all that time. All the siblings said yeah dad is an alchoholic....but that is as far as it went.
Your husband has been raised to see only what he is supposed to see. It is like some kind of complicated contract he signed...if you want to be part of this family this is trhe script you will learn.
Also this is an addiction it DOES NOT MAKE SENSE. Don't try to reason with it. Don't try to make it conform to logic. An addict does the same thing over and over again and expects a different result, that is the deffinition of insanity. They truly have no control over their actions.
I really hope this rambling makes sense to you.
Be really gentle with your husband right now he is in a very vulnerable place.
Also meetings are great. Go by yourself and/or ask him to go with you. visit your favorite restraunt before or after the meeting. Don't make it about HIM just go watch all THOSE crazy people talk about all THEIR problems. Someday he will understnd he is right there with them and it will be ok to be "one of them"
His parents have both died within the last 18 months. We detached from them years ago and I for one have few regrets. We have a very good relationship. Communication is very difficult and we have been working on it for 18 years. I have come to the conclusion that it may always be difficult. he hates all forms of confrontation and takes everything as a criticism. I do try really hard to word things "right" somethimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. The problem is that my family fought for sport. We kept score on who won and who got the most jabs in. My mother really enjoyed getting me from normal person to bit## in 5 seconds and she practiced on all of kids who would play her game. I found a man who would not fight but now I avoid confrontation too and am truly afaid of my own anger...so I tend to hide it and guess what it doesn't go away....anger is a healty emotion...okay I don't really believe that either but my therapsit said it so I believe her.
OK to the point......we all carry our own baggage into our relationships. We are so used to carrying it around it becomes part of us. IMHO your husband is very confused right now it is so much easier to hang out in denial. He wants to believe his mom is a good mom a good person and she loves him. He feels these things connot be true if he accepts the FACT she is an addict. Right now he can't wrap his mind around the idea that she loves him and is an addict so he acts like he is ignorant to her behavior. It is his only way of holding onto "his" reality. If he admitted the truth "his" reality would start to crumble. He needs to be in a "Safe" place for that to happen...He will have to create a new reality it takes time and alot of tears. Be patient he will get to that safe place if you let him.
My husband and I have a phrase that helped. THE big pink elephant in the middle of the room. His father's addiction is like a big pink elephant in the middle of the room. It just keeps getting bigger. and nobody sees it so it just keeps getting bigger and pretty soon they all have to dance to aviod aknowledging the big pink elephant. My husband and I moved to his hometown and didn't know the dance we just showed up and a big pink elephant was in the middle of the living room and everybody was doing this crazy dance.....So we said "HEY what is up with the elephant"...all of a sudden WE WERE THE PROBLEM. Nobody was ready accept the truth and since we were the first to "notice" the elephant we were the enemy. What is really sad is that FIL behavior had started destoying his family 30 years before this happened and they had been living in denial all that time. All the siblings said yeah dad is an alchoholic....but that is as far as it went.
Your husband has been raised to see only what he is supposed to see. It is like some kind of complicated contract he signed...if you want to be part of this family this is trhe script you will learn.
Also this is an addiction it DOES NOT MAKE SENSE. Don't try to reason with it. Don't try to make it conform to logic. An addict does the same thing over and over again and expects a different result, that is the deffinition of insanity. They truly have no control over their actions.
I really hope this rambling makes sense to you.
Be really gentle with your husband right now he is in a very vulnerable place.
Also meetings are great. Go by yourself and/or ask him to go with you. visit your favorite restraunt before or after the meeting. Don't make it about HIM just go watch all THOSE crazy people talk about all THEIR problems. Someday he will understnd he is right there with them and it will be ok to be "one of them"
In Recovery
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Upper Midwest
Posts: 259
Well said, Everyone
I really liked the way you described the Pink Elephant, Blondy...and could totally relate to moms wanting to make me go from 0 to Bi#$! in 5 or less minutes..me, too. Then I get mad, and assert myself just a little, she cries, my siblings ride my a## for being a horrible, ungrateful kid...yeah, fun.
I just wanted to add, Confused, that the things said to you here are said with love and compassion, and because we've all been where you are, in one form or another. Nobody is intending to place blame or attack, k?
(I say this, because "I've been there" too, and sometimes when people would say to me, "You have to change" it felt like my dysfunctional family saying, "It's you, Kari...you're the crazy one...we're all OK"...ACK!!)
I really liked the way you described the Pink Elephant, Blondy...and could totally relate to moms wanting to make me go from 0 to Bi#$! in 5 or less minutes..me, too. Then I get mad, and assert myself just a little, she cries, my siblings ride my a## for being a horrible, ungrateful kid...yeah, fun.
I just wanted to add, Confused, that the things said to you here are said with love and compassion, and because we've all been where you are, in one form or another. Nobody is intending to place blame or attack, k?
(I say this, because "I've been there" too, and sometimes when people would say to me, "You have to change" it felt like my dysfunctional family saying, "It's you, Kari...you're the crazy one...we're all OK"...ACK!!)
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