Originally Posted by equus
These days for the life of me I struggle to understand how religions can fail to be interesting as they are some of the oldest texts we have available that wrestle with the very nature of life. They were written by people, often collectively, filled with intent, have been read by billions over thousands of years. They CERTAINLY remain fascinating to me!
If I was left alone, if suddenly all group experience was denied me, without language except what I invented, with a motivation to invent - in isolation; I'm totally unsure that any part I know as me would or could exist. I think it is possible that the group experience has wholly created this individual.
I agree that religion is fascinating! I find it a truly wise way of teaching in a social context. It is a man made thing, I really do not believe that any deity has actually given us the "truth" although I believe in some sort of spiritual world. Our spirits (emotions) are educated from childhood in every society in a religious way. We celebrate the same occassions through out the world, weddings, funerals, adolescence, birth, change of season, feasts. We have social constructs that help us come together as a group. We have some rules, manners, policies, guidelines of behaviour ... so as to look after each others feelings, so as NOT to leave people out, so as to educate all people in proper mingling, even those who do not excel at social niceties.
BUT in the twentieth and twenty first centuries, in the modern western society ... things have changed. Group behaviour has changed immensely ... generations are not mixing together as much, there is much more of a "same age" mix, where people compete and criticise more. The multi age groups are better at tolerance, forebearance (?S), understanding ... but the multi age mix is reducing. We put old people in homes, they should be part of a younger group (IMO), they should be there helping with the patience that they have, the wisdom that they have acquired. Teenagers are being left to entertain themselves without mixing with older and younger people ... that is just deadly ... teenagers are not meant to be on their own in any animal group.
One study I saw on TV depicted a group of teenage elephants separated from the older elephants, they went ballistic, they were really naughty, they had no role models of behaviour. When they were joined by the rest of the herd, the adults, they settled back down again. People are seeing a huge change in our social structure ... the extended family is really only a few decades out of "date" ... this is huge when we talk about groups in the human animal.
Originally Posted by aloneagainor
Emotions! I get so stuck on this point of the distorting factor of emotions. How emotions tell us we need other people, and emotions without understanding demand that we need people to behave in a certain way in order for us to be happy/ content/ fulfilled. Is that emotional dependency on the belief that we need to be part of the group beneficial, or harmful, to being an independent thinking being? Or is that what keeps a person from achieving inner peace, preventing one from fully exploring, for inhibitions and fear of disapproval that might distance one from the group. Perhaps group think/ need for belonging and acceptance are the very factors that create feelings of loneliness and unworthiness and disapproval, the "not good enoughs" that weigh people down.
Emotions are also able to be felt when just sitting in the crowd at an amazing concert, sharing the music .. we are at one with others ... feeling something that is just so deeply uplifting .. for a brief time we have inner peace.
Then the individual must up and go do their own thing, that is no problem ... we need both, group time and individual time. Some people need more group time than others, sometimes we need to work out our issues and at those points we need more interaction with others to work stuff out, bounce ideas, put thoughts to the test, argue about things, criticise things. Other times we need to achieve something for ourselves, we need our own space to do that.
Originally Posted by bobby
When a person is emotionally capable or emotionally intelligent shall I say, they often approve of themselves and find themselves in no need of outside approval...but regardless, approval it still necessary to the human being. As a matter of fact, this individual, or self-approval, seems to be the most effective way at achieving approval. If it exists, then outside approval (from the group) would naturally be granted by default. To have approval from the group and not ones self, would suggest it is not genuine and basically non existent.
Happiness is when what we think, what we say and what we do is harmony ... Ghandi ... just takes a bit to really get to the truth of ourselves sometimes .. to find our own approval.
Originally Posted by equus
My withdrawal from family life was absolutely conscious, it still hurt me, I wasn't detached emotionally but I was in terms of teaching, I CHOSE not to learn from them - actually that's not true, it was more like this: I learned that their way harmed them, I learned not to follow it, I thought they had sent my brother mad and he stayed in the family, hence I stayed in myself - so I suppose I did learn alot.
My family was not perfect, I observed, I doubted and could not find my own way because I tossed aside all of what my family was at different points. The imperfections and weaknesses made me also disregard the many strengths and intelligences of my family. Accepting that my family is not perfect and recognising both the good and the "bad" has been something that I would encourage everyone to do. Finding the best in my family has made me look for the best in me, given me belief in myself. Every family has its own ways.
Interesting stuff!!
peace and love,
Brigid
