Do Pot and AA mix?

[IO Storm]

Thanks TM,

Great topic..

I stopped drinking..but smoked weed. A lot.."marijuana maintenance"..not clean.

Relapsed with alcohol on and off, my drug of choice. Not sober.

I stopped drinking..and abused diet pills (speed) for 8 years...not clean.

Total unequivocal relapse with alcohol in 2005...last drink..2/17/06.

Last speed pill 6/8/06.

Alcohol is my DOC..speed would be my 2nd..weed #3.

But when I stopped weed..I literally picked seeds from the rug and window

sills. Chewed them wherever I could find them. Until there were none.

That is how I tapered off..

And to pick up joint little speed pill would be a relapse for me...and I know,

a definite "gateway" drug back to my DOC. Booze.

And yes.

I am bipolar..I take medication for this. My mother is diabetic, and takes

her meds faithfully. So do I.

But my BP meds don't cause the perception changes...and cigarrettes don't.

Weed can make a city block half as long as it seems..and a car closer, or

further away...I remember well. So..it can destroy someone.

Just don't drive..

That's my opinion..

From one who knows.

This is my truth...

Hope it helps someone.

Blessings

[James13]

Originally Posted by TropicalMango

I think loneliness is a part of this modern life we live in, and isolation and solitude among people will only increase in the coming decades. I love to be around people. I am the guy out there talking to everybody in the street, pulling down his window at a red light to chat with the biker next to him. My family is all spread apart on different continents, and I do not live in the city I grew up in. However sometimes the feelings of isolation almost drive me to a state bordering psychosis. Marijuana actually takes those feelings away. Is that bad? After smoking I don't feel lonely any more. In AA you hear: "just come to meetings!" But how is coming to 3 meetings a day not an addiction? I appreciate people in AA, however AA is a support group and is not/should not be your life.

I can only speak for myself. (Which is also what AA is about, sharing your story, and leaving it up to others to take what they want from your story.)

For me, marijuana enhanced working on art, listening to music, watching films, eating food, enjoying a day at the park, talking to other people, playing guitar, among other things. It was fun. I still remember those feelings. Then I found marijuana took away feelings of insecurity, loneliness, everyday stress and worries. So I could just smoke some pot, sit around, and feel stress lift away through plumes of smoke, enhancing everything around me.

Then, I began smoking every day. I was looking forward to smoking pot, and NOT looking forward to seeing my wonderful girlfriend, seeing my family, or hanging out with friends (unless they had some pot or were willing to smoke some with me.)

Then, nothing was good enough unless I was high. I noticed that when not smoking, I was waiting until I could, like after work. At school, I would be working on a drawing, and the reason why I would be in a good mood was because I knew I would get home after school and have the rest of the day to myself to smoke pot and get really high. I would stay baked until I went to sleep.

Then, the experience wasn't as good anymore. I would still look forward to smoking pot almost every day, but the high didn't enhance my experiences as much anymore. I also noticed that I was more depressed when I wasn't high. My motivation for school and friendships waned. I would always think I could replicate the feelings I once had when high, but I was just tired and isolating. The "magic" left.

Then, I never saw my girlfriend anymore, or other friends, unless they smoked pot. Then my relationship crumbled as I took her for granted. When I had been with her, I was wishing I was high. No experience seemed good enough without pot. But now, she was gone.

Then I got sober.

[BackToSquareOne]

Wow you could carry this topic to ridiculous extremes if you wanted to. The focus of AA is on the mind and mood altering substance alcohol. But then again caffeine and nicotene are mind and mood altering to a degree. Carbohydrates increase the production of serotonin (the feel good chemical) in the brain so what about the "sugar high"?

In the end though the name "Alcoholics Anonymous" says it all. Its primary focus is alcohol.

[IO Storm]

Great post..James!

[SoberforME]

Originally Posted by TropicalMango

The difference is that pot does not destroy you in the process (whether it is right or wrong).

Some people feel that way some don't.

I haven't been sober long enough to feel like I can have an opinion here. Right now any mind altering substance, for me, is not good.

However, my sponsor and I were talking last night about how our alcoholic personalities come into play with all sorts of things be it pot, booze, sex or food. We have addictive personalities. I would really consider the fact that the reasons you state to smoke are the same reasons that a lot of people drink (ie. to take away loneliness)

Although I do agree that pot is the lesser of a lot of evils and perhaps shouldn't be illegal.

Edited to add:

James, that post is word for word my experience with alcohol. Although I'm lucky that my girlfriend is still here.

[IO Storm]

I am an AA'er..but my sponsor, after hearing my lifestory, said that I cannot separate

drugs from my drinking career as they are so closely intertwined.. ?

I do keep my sharing to problems with alcohol in the rooms, but when I've shared

about my drug history, no one has said a peep.

[doorknob]

Originally Posted by IO Storm

But when I stopped weed..I literally picked seeds from the rug and window

sills. Chewed them wherever I could find them. Until there were none.

That is how I tapered off..

Seeds don't produce THC...

[IO Storm]

edited due to tiredness, hunger, and presumption.. lol

[doorknob]

Originally Posted by James13

I can only speak for myself. (Which is also what AA is about, sharing your story, and leaving it up to others to take what they want from your story.)

For me, marijuana enhanced working on art, listening to music, watching films, eating food, enjoying a day at the park, talking to other people, playing guitar, among other things. It was fun. I still remember those feelings. Then I found marijuana took away feelings of insecurity, loneliness, everyday stress and worries. So I could just smoke some pot, sit around, and feel stress lift away through plumes of smoke, enhancing everything around me.

Then, I began smoking every day. I was looking forward to smoking pot, and NOT looking forward to seeing my wonderful girlfriend, seeing my family, or hanging out with friends (unless they had some pot or were willing to smoke some with me.)

Then, nothing was good enough unless I was high. I noticed that when not smoking, I was waiting until I could, like after work. At school, I would be working on a drawing, and the reason why I would be in a good mood was because I knew I would get home after school and have the rest of the day to myself to smoke pot and get really high. I would stay baked until I went to sleep.

Then, the experience wasn't as good anymore. I would still look forward to smoking pot almost every day, but the high didn't enhance my experiences as much anymore. I also noticed that I was more depressed when I wasn't high. My motivation for school and friendships waned. I would always think I could replicate the feelings I once had when high, but I was just tired and isolating. The "magic" left.

Then, I never saw my girlfriend anymore, or other friends, unless they smoked pot. Then my relationship crumbled as I took her for granted. When I had been with her, I was wishing I was high. No experience seemed good enough without pot. But now, she was gone.

Then I got sober.

Thanks, James. I really needed to hear that. I believe that pot is my number one addiction, alcohol being a close second.

[IO Storm]

Sorry DK...

I'm a little tired,...the high I got could have been from drug metabolizing through

detox..mm hmm?

[dgillz]

Originally Posted by TropicalMango

Freedom of thought?

Surely you already have freedom of thought. And speech for that matter.

As you can see some people are more open to pot than others, but the consensus answer to the question "do pot and AA mix?" is still NO.

By the way I used to smoke but never regularly and it was never a problem for me. I personally think pot and all drugs should be legal, I just don't want to do any of them, because I am afraid it would lead to an alcohol relapse.

Alcohol is what damn near killed me, not pot.

[Peter]

No, AA and pot does not mix. At least not in my neck of the woods.

Cigarettes and coffee ,yes.

Why this is so I really don't know, except it simply has been that way for a long long time.

perhaps it has something to do with the fact that back in the early formulative days of AA there was a lot more stigma and disinformation associated with MJ.

That being said, I believe the insiduous and destructive nature of pot is often downplayed or overlooked. Some of the laziest, most non productive people I know are habitual pot smokers .

I guess in some cultures laziness and non productiveness is not considered destructive.

[Pinkcuda]

"Alcoholics Anonymous is a fellowship of men and women who share experience, strength and hope that they may solve their common problem"
Alcoholism is our common problem, nothing else. I don't like it any more than the next person but I don't make the rules.
Also I have also heard and read this in meetings. "Remember that what you hear here are opinions and only opinions as no one may speak for AA as a whole". Therefore it invalidates the question and the answers read here.

[James13]

Originally Posted by doorknob

Thanks, James. I really needed to hear that. I believe that pot is my number one addiction, alcohol being a close second.

Sure, DK!

Same here for me as far as pot. THC is a really sneaky drug, and I see social stigmas swinging towards being against any notion of dependence to it in younger circles that use it more often. I think this makes it even harder for someone to admit they have a problem, because they or others don't want to see it.

Also, it's sneaky because it's really hard to fight the rationalizing of using it after being sober, because the "bottom" is not death or as bad as alcohol. So with pot, it can be easier to forget where you were before you quit.

[freya]

Basically, as far as I can tell, recovery of any kind is limited in direct proportion to how much one relies on any substance or behavior to temporarily "solve," "ignore," "deny," or "mask" any painful feelings, issues, wounds, problems etc. that could, if one were instead to work on them honestly and directly, lead one to greater growth, self-actualization and spiritual connection.

Of course, part of working honestly and directly on one's self is learning how to take safe, fun breaks and time-outs for relaxation and recreation. And, as others have pointed out, some people are perfectly capable of using alcohol or various other drugs in this way. And, of course, only a given individual -- with the help of perhaps his/her trusted support people -- is ultimately qualified to and responsible for making the judgment of where recreation ends and escape/flight begins.

So, on a purely theoretical basis, I would have to say that the answer to your OP is probably, "Yes, it's possible."

However, we live in the real world and, in the real world things don't usually work as well and as neatly as they do in theory.

So, I guess the question for me would be, if someone knows he/she is an addict and, therefore, knows that he/she has a tendency to use substances and/or certain behaviors in ways that are not healthy (and there are plenty of things that are not healthy that will not kill you physically but that are just as "deadly" emotionally and spiritually) and that either shut-down or seriously diminish his/her ability to be aware of and work on him/herself in an effective, personal-growth-nurturing way, and if it is indeed that same person's true and sincere desire to be "fully present" in his/her life and, thus, to be able to do the best possible self-work he/she can do, then why on earth would he/she even flirt with using substances or engaging in behaviors that may be dangerous to him/her??????

Also, TropicalMango, just in terms of the way you have developed your position here in this thread, I see some red flags of the "Thou doth protest too much" variety. First off, you ask the question: Do pot and AA mix? OK, simple enough.....but soon you let drop the fact that you know that this is not going to be a question that is going to well-received by AA people, and then, when asked about your choice to bring-up a question that you admit you know will not be well-received (or, at least, not well-received in the sense that you know you are not likely to get a lot of answers you like) you reply that it is your goal to encourage freedom of thought.

Well, what is it?????

You are clearly an intelligent person, so I'm assuming you know very well whether or not you really want to just take a survey of people's opinions on the question asked (in which case, why would you bother to argue and to disagree with those opinions?), want to pick a fight with a bunch of AAs, or want to do all the "unfree, non-thinkers" in the world (the people who don't respond to the question the way you like????) the favor of liberating their minds. (Just FYI: most people don't respond real well to that kind of loudly advertised, self-righteous "help.").....Your intent seems to get more confused -- and more questionable -- the further you go.

The reason that I am rehashing all of this in such detail is because, for me as a reader of this thread, it makes me wonder why someone who really felt secure and confident in his decision to combine pot-smoking and recovery would approach a discussion of the topic in this strange, and apparently manipulative, manner.

freya

[Dee74]

Thanks James. This destigmatization of marijuana, even here on SR, concerns me too.

I smoked it for 20 years, daily.

Pot was every bit as bad for me as alcohol - I used it in the same way... to counteract my deficiencies and fears or to enhance my mood....it took over my life in the same way...I craved it in the same way, I used it nonstop whenever I could in the same way, I went crazy when I didn't have it in the same way.

It stopped working for me, like alcohol did, in the same way too.

I know - I'm an addict. It appears many people can smoke weed with little ill effect, just as many people can do the same with alcohol.

But I've still got mates living from sunup to sundown stoned, doing nothing, not wanting to do anything - same as they did in 1999, and 1989 - don't tell me its benign, or that it's somehow less harmful than any other drug.

D

[CAPTAINZING2000]

Seemed good for these guys . However, Chong did a little time in prison




That being said, the majority of us lose everything by doing them together

[James13]

Originally Posted by freya

So, I guess the question for me would be, if someone knows he/she is an addict and, therefore, knows that he/she has a tendency to use substances and/or certain behaviors in ways that are not healthy (and there are plenty of things that are not healthy that will not kill you physically but that are just as "deadly" emotionally and spiritually) and that either shut-down or seriously diminish his/her ability to be aware of and work on him/herself in an effective, personal-growth-nurturing way, and if it is indeed that same person's true and sincere desire to be "fully present" in his/her life and, thus, to be able to do the best possible self-work he/she can do, then why on earth would he/she even flirt with using substances or engaging in behaviors that may be dangerous to him/her??????

What an intelligent, eye opening post. I needed to see this, and I couldn't have said it better.

[Astro]

Originally Posted by TropicalMango

The difference is that pot does not destroy you in the process (whether it is right or wrong).

You gotta be kidding me? You really believe that? Given time, any addictive substance will destroy some part of us, given enough time and quantity.

James13, I really want to thank you for your post, I took a lot from your share. These words reflect my life through two marriages and a slew of relationships........

Then, I never saw my girlfriend anymore, or other friends, unless they smoked pot. Then my relationship crumbled as I took her for granted. When I had been with her, I was wishing I was high. No experience seemed good enough without pot. But now, she was gone.

Then I got sober.

I'm actually sort of surprised that I'm still engaging in the debate on this post. The topic seems kind of insane, but I guess I engaged in the same debates with myself for most of my life

[James13]

Originally Posted by Dee74

Thanks James. This destigmatization of marijuana, even here on SR, concerns me too.

I smoked it for 20 years, daily.

Pot was every bit as bad for me as alcohol - I used it in the same way... to counteract my deficiencies and fears or to enhance my mood....it took over my life in the same way...I craved it in the same way, I used it nonstop whenever I could in the same way, I went crazy when I didn't have it in the same way.

It stopped working for me, like alcohol did, in the same way too.

I know - I'm an addict. It appears many people can smoke weed with little ill effect, just as many people can do the same with alcohol.

But I've still got mates living from sunup to sundown stoned, doing nothing, not wanting to do anything - same as they did in 1999, and 1989 - don't tell me its benign, or that it's somehow less harmful than any other drug.

D

Thanks, Dee74. The thing is, I need people like you to remind me of these things, because I'm really good at talking myself out of things I don't want to see.

And the destigmatization/stigmatization of pot is very complex. Both approaches to pot have very big problems.

On one hand, pot is overly stigmatized in society in some aspects, notably with the law and anti-drug movement. Pot smokers should not be thrown in prison, and the laws are immoral, in my opinion. Some people can use the drug their whole lives in moderation, so why some people can do the same with alcohol and not pay a price is beyond me.

On the other hand, yes, the destigmatization of pot is really centered around "pot addiction" or "pot dependence". Not coincidentally, this is nothing short of denial. The notion that pot is not addictive at all is flawed on so many levels. And also, in my opinion, not coincidentally, most of the people fighting against any notion of pot dependence are: pot smokers! Imagine that! It really does create quite a front for denial.

So the issue of pot altogether has turned into this black and white argument that pays ABSOLUTELY no attention to the individual pot smoker. Some can do it with no problem, others can't, like alot of things. It comes down to the person, and both sides of the argument's broadbrushing does no one any good.

Wow... sorry that went on forever. Hope everyone's still sober.

[James13]

Originally Posted by Astro

James13, I really want to thank you for your post, I took a lot from your share. These words reflect my life through two marriages and a slew of relationships........

Anytime, Astro. I enjoy your posts too, as they have been insightful.

My GF and I have since reconciled, but taking it day to day, like everything else I have to take day to day now!

Peace and love

[NoelleR]

Do pot and AA mix.....? Well, I guess that would depend on how one sees the term AA.....as the opinions of AA members, or AA, the entity.

Pincuda earlier quoted AA's preamble. It might be good to reprint it here.....:

"Alcoholics Anonymous is a fellowship of men and women who share experience, strength and hope that they may solve their common problem"
Alcoholism is our common problem, nothing else. I don't like it any more than the next person but I don't make the rules.
Also I have also heard and read this in meetings. "Remember that what you hear here are opinions and only opinions as no one may speak for AA as a whole". Therefore it invalidates the question and the answers read here.

According to AA the orginazation, pot, and all other drugs would be considered an outside issue.....the purpose of AA is to help alcoholics gain sobriety, which they define as freedom from alcohol (only alcohol).

Therefore, according to AA; their official position would be that pot and AA could mix.


NoelleR

P.S. I'd add my opinion to this thread, but it would be worth as much as everybody else's here...............just another opinion, and totally worthless when considering the question as posted in the OP. I would go to the source for the answer.....the official AA website.....where I would see that AA is all about alcohol, and alcohol only.

[nogard]

why distinguish between drugs, I am an addict and I practice abstinence as thats the only way I can be fee of my addiction and all that means to me. Picking up any drug will destroy that instantly.

Kevin

[Peter]

Originally Posted by freya

Basically, as far as I can tell, recovery of any kind is limited in direct proportion to how much one relies on any substance or behavior to temporarily "solve," "ignore," "deny," or "mask" any painful feelings, issues, wounds, problems etc. that could, if one were instead to work on them honestly and directly, lead one to greater growth, self-actualization and spiritual connection.

Of course, part of working honestly and directly on one's self is learning how to take safe, fun breaks and time-outs for relaxation and recreation. And, as others have pointed out, some people are perfectly capable of using alcohol or various other drugs in this way. And, of course, only a given individual -- with the help of perhaps his/her trusted support people -- is ultimately qualified to and responsible for making the judgment of where recreation ends and escape/flight begins.

So, on a purely theoretical basis, I would have to say that the answer to your OP is probably, "Yes, it's possible."

However, we live in the real world and, in the real world things don't usually work as well and as neatly as they do in theory.

So, I guess the question for me would be, if someone knows he/she is an addict and, therefore, knows that he/she has a tendency to use substances and/or certain behaviors in ways that are not healthy (and there are plenty of things that are not healthy that will not kill you physically but that are just as "deadly" emotionally and spiritually) and that either shut-down or seriously diminish his/her ability to be aware of and work on him/herself in an effective, personal-growth-nurturing way, and if it is indeed that same person's true and sincere desire to be "fully present" in his/her life and, thus, to be able to do the best possible self-work he/she can do, then why on earth would he/she even flirt with using substances or engaging in behaviors that may be dangerous to him/her??????

Also, TropicalMango, just in terms of the way you have developed your position here in this thread, I see some red flags of the "Thou doth protest too much" variety. First off, you ask the question: Do pot and AA mix? OK, simple enough.....but soon you let drop the fact that you know that this is not going to be a question that is going to well-received by AA people, and then, when asked about your choice to bring-up a question that you admit you know will not be well-received (or, at least, not well-received in the sense that you know you are not likely to get a lot of answers you like) you reply that it is your goal to encourage freedom of thought.

Well, what is it?????

You are clearly an intelligent person, so I'm assuming you know very well whether or not you really want to just take a survey of people's opinions on the question asked (in which case, why would you bother to argue and to disagree with those opinions?), want to pick a fight with a bunch of AAs, or want to do all the "unfree, non-thinkers" in the world (the people who don't respond to the question the way you like????) the favor of liberating their minds. (Just FYI: most people don't respond real well to that kind of loudly advertised, self-righteous "help.").....Your intent seems to get more confused -- and more questionable -- the further you go.

The reason that I am rehashing all of this in such detail is because, for me as a reader of this thread, it makes me wonder why someone who really felt secure and confident in his decision to combine pot-smoking and recovery would approach a discussion of the topic in this strange, and apparently manipulative, manner.

freya

Brilliant

[Pinkcuda]

why distinguish between drugs,

For me the integrity of my sobriety is through AA. Therefore I am not at liberty to pick and choose which parts of the book or the program I wish to believe, and which I wish to to disregard.
If it's in the book, it is a fact. That is what I need to believe.