Fioranol & Vicoden

[notkernels]

I'll make a long story short, my doctor perscribed Fironal w/codeine 5 years ago for migraines. Well, about two months ago I was using 6-8 of them a day. With the help of my very supportive wife I got myself off of them. After about 6 weeks clean I relapsed due to very severe migraines. This time I got a perscription for vicoden.
So heres what happened, Thursday the drugs arrives. Took 3 that day becuase I needed to see how they worked. I know pretty stupid. On Sunday came down with migraine so I took another 3. Then on Tuesday I could feel withdrawls so I took 2 more. I have not taken any more since Tuesday and as of today (Saturday) I don't feel sick anymore.
I know I'm playing with fire but my migraines are so bad I can't help myself. I even suffered with a migraine yesterday but was able to make it through with Relpax.
Please don't give me the usual advice about talking with my Dr. He has basically ignored my problem and gave this advice: "Just stop taking them!" Even after he told me that, I left him a phone message about this and my wife spoke with him. That was 2 months ago, haven't heard from him yet.
As crazy as this sound my questions is: Is there a period of time of not taking pain medication that it's safe to take them only when suffering from severe pain and still not suffer from withdrawls. I was really amazed how just using Vic 3 seperate times ( total of 8 vics that week) in a week put my body back into withdrawls.

[Phinneas]

Originally Posted by notkernels

Please don't give me the usual advice about talking with my Dr. He has basically ignored my problem and gave this advice: "Just stop taking them!"

As crazy as this sound my questions is: Is there a period of time of not taking pain medication that it's safe to take them only when suffering from severe pain and still not suffer from withdrawls.

My suggestions are - 1) get a new Dr. - one who understands drug addictions. (Many, many, many Drs. are clueless.) And, 2) NO, there is no safe time period when we can go back to using. A drug is a drug, whether gotten on the street or at a reputable pharmacy.

If you really want out of the cycle of addiction, you must be abstinent AND work some form of recovery program. That's what worked for me, and believe me, I tried everything else!

Good luck!

[Dawn10]

Phinneas has given you some very good advice and I will echo it.
You have a doctor that is not in tune with the addict. Find a doctor who is, find an addicitions therapist and work diligently with them. Find a meeting(s) that you can go to and work the steps. These are things I share because they have worked for me and I have have 7 1/2 years of clean and sober time.
Another bit of advice--you mentioned " the pills arrived". I am assuming you are ordering online. If you are, STOP. Do not accept delivery of anymore drugs from online companies. The DEA is cracking down and arresting and prosecuting those who buy and accept the deliveries. You do not want to hit that rock bottom point.

Please consider these points.

[angelgirl]

Hey notkernels,

Welcome to SR.. Great to have you here. I am glad you posted..

I just want to say that I agree very much with the advice you have been give here by Phinny and Dawn.

Just like Phinny said, a recovery program is really important, and there are alot of them out there. There is NA, AA, Celebrate Recovery, and Smart. There are also more. I believe there is a list of them here on SR.

You can call a local crisis line, and they can give you info, on where to find meetings in your area. They will know that, at least they do in my area. Also alot of town have a County Mental Health clinic that have recovery groups, I attend groups through the MH clinic in my county.

These are just suggestions for you.. It is so important to have support.

Prayers,,

Please keep posting, we will be here for you, no matter what time it is..

Love and prayers,
Becky

[notkernels]

Okay okay, I get the message.
Actually I watched "Intervention" and Dr. Phil's show on Alcholism last night back to back. I know I can never take pain medication again but man oh man. I woke up this morning with a pounding headache. It really sucks to know that 1-2 pills and all that goes away.
On Tuesday I will call around and find some help. I spoke with my wife whom by the way is really supportive, last night. She is also pushing me to get help. She does not know that I relapsed but I think she suspects it.
I appreciate your blunt advice and will seek outside help. I must admit however it kind of hurt. Really don't like being called a "drug addict" but I guess sometimes the truth sucks!

[Dawn10]

Sometimes "blunt" is what has to happen. I discovered too that much of my "pain" that I took pills for was anticipatory pain and not real pain.My brain tricked me into believing I needed the pills and I really believed it. In the 7 1/2 years I have been in recovery I have had major dental work and hurt my back twice and OTC Aleve and Ibuprofen have been absolutely sufficient to relieve that pain.
Please keep us posted on your recovery. Find a good therapist. For me, that was my saving grace. I have one I still see on occaision to just stay on course and she is a God send.
You will be in my prayers!

Dawn

[kj0975]

For your headaches I would recommend a neurologist who is more familiar with headaches and migraines and has more knowledge of drugs so he might be able to help you more than your regular Dr I had the same problem and I asked my Dr to refer me a neurologist and it has helped me sooo much. Have you tried taking 4 advil liquidgels at the first sign of a headace (migraine) that helps me alot and usually stops it which is great. Good luck. KJ

[notkernels]

I usually take 4 aspirins which 1/3 of the time works. Then I rely on Relpax which if I give it 3-4 hours seems to work most of the time. Its the dam 3-4 hours that really sucks. My worst moments are these becuase I know fioranol or vic would fix me up quick.
I will get a referral to a specialist, although not sure how much good it will do. At least if I try I can say I tried.

[Dawn10]

You will never know how it will work ( getting a therapist) unless you give it a try and work at it. I know I was always sceptical of "counselors" and "therapists" before I entered recovery. But, once I started in therapy, it was so much of a relief to have someone who would listen and not judge me and offer me concrete advice. I will remind you it is not a magical fixer upper. There is work for you to do. But I can almost guarantee that if you enter treatment with the idea that you are going to work to say clean and do whatever it takes, you will be sucessful.
Sorry I sound a little "preachy" but I really believe what I say!

[Buzz Kilowatt]

Not,

I hope you've been persuaded by now to abandon the idea of using HC as a means to quit Fiorinal.

I started with a Fiorinal script and "graduated" to Lortab. A decade later I'm posting on this Recovery Forum . . .

Learn from my mistake and save yourself a lot of grief!

- Buzz

[Alera]

Major fiorinal addict here. That stuff is nasty. I never graduated above that, in large dosages it was enough.

I still spend time in closed rooms, cos my migraines never did go away.

[kj0975]

I too took esgic generic for what your taking and then I was switched to midrin and toradol and advil then I saw a neurologist because that wasnt working for my daily headaches so he put me on elivil (sp) and I take that everynight before bed and it has almost stopped my daily headaches but it has a horrible hangover effect which lasts about 3wks but once you make it through that what a difference I wouldnt take asprin I highly recommend the advil liquidgels thats what my neurologist told me and I thought he was full of you know what. I wanted something MUCH better than advil but it works once in a while I have to take something a little stronger but only in moderation. I cant take zomig, relpax or anything in that drug family so I do have some other things on hand to help the midrim does seem to help but not sure if that has a barbituate in it or not. I never researched it. But I hope this helps I know a neurologist might be able to help you I thought it was silly too havent had a migraine in 6 mos. Good luck KJ

[notkernels]

Called my doctor yesterday to ask for a referral to both a neurologist and a counselor for the addiction. The nurse wanted to send me to a pain clinic. Uh, I think my problem is more serious than that. Once again I have to push my doctors office for help with this addiciton. I should hear something today from them on this.
Bad news is I took 2 more vics yesterday. Don't feel bad today, hopefully that will

[Dawn10]

If you do not get the desired response from your doctor--( the neurologist and addictions therapist referral) FIND ANOTHER DOCTOR ASAP!
You are doing a wonderful thing and it is going to save your life. Keep it up!


Dawn

[mackie]

Where to start??
Notkernels..........stop the downward spiral now! I too started out with small stuff, ie Fiorinal, Fioricet, Darvocet..........only to get conditioned to them and wanting bigger and better. You move on to seemingly harmless, stronger drugs (Stadol, Lortabs, Percocet, Diluadid) all with the good intentions of 'curing the all emcompasing migraine.' Before you know it, you are in the ER with some ailment or another just to see what kind of shot the unsuspecting ER doctor will give you. Payday if you're bad enough to get some Demorol or Morphine! It just goes on and on, and takes you right down the tube of unending self medicating.

Please stop now...........if the doctor you have is ineffective for you, MOVE ON! Most neurologists would prefer you come to them from the get-go before some general practitioner uses you for a guinea pig trying the newest "pain" medication for migraines. It is worth spending the money to get a correct diagnosis that can be treated.

Most 'migraines' are really not migraines at all. Have a general physical done. Ask for that when you are scheduling your appointment. Most doctors "roll their eyes" and write you off if you come in for 'headaches'. Track your blood pressure, see an eye doctor, exercise...............The point being, JUST DON'T SETTLE for a pain medication. You owe it to yourself to get down to brass tacks and find the real problem.

BTW, yes, I do have migraines. I was also diagnosed with trigeminal neuralgia (causes serious facial/jaw pain)........and have been successfully treated with a low dose of Elavil at bedtime. Instead of planning my life around my migraines, I actually HAVE A LIFE! I still have an occasional attack (2 or 3 a year) but no where the amount prior to Elavil.

Be proactive in your own health care. That's the best advice I can offer.

Wishing you success,
Mackie

[kj0975]

Yes that is what I take too which is what I mentioned in my above post is the elavil I really spelled it wrong. And as mackie said I havent had a migraine in 6mos and my daily headaches are pretty much gone except for the occasional which advil will take care of. Mackie did you have the hangover effect from the elavil? My neurologist started me out at 10mg and bumped me up over time and what a difference I strongly recommend looking into this. Good luck. Kj

[mackie]

KJ,

I had a little trouble with the Elavil going from 25mg to 50mg. A little groggy in the AM but more troubled by the cotton mouth, dryed out feeling, constipation. I guess you have to weigh the pros and cons.........I think my body is adjusting to it more over time. It sure is nice not to have my life revolved around a migraine headache and what's going to alleviate it.

Happy Thursday to YOU!
Mackie

[notkernels]

I appreciate everyones advice, still waiting for the Dr's office to call me back with the two referrals. Glad it's not an emergency!
Messed up yesterday and took 2 Tramadol's, wow!!! First time I've ever taken them I think their better than vic's. Yet I hear they are much less addicting. Doesn't make sense to me. I am embarrased to admit all this but somehow sitting in front of the PC I can admitt my failures.
I'm going to wait another day or two for my referrals then I'll probably have to call around and see what I can find. Need to find a physician that takes my insurance. Which shouldn't be too hard.
Thanks again everyone for supporting me. I don't deserve it!!!

[kj0975]

Sometimes your Dr wont call you back with the referrals I know the dr office I worked at we wouldnt. We had the pts call the ins company, its a alot easier than calling every patient. So I would just call the # for your ins company and its an automated system and they will tell you all the active referrals that you have. Also check with them you might not need a referral for a neurologist I didnt but every ins co. is different. Good Luck Kj