NEED SOME ADVICE AND INFO on METHADONE

[Tara]

Hey everyone,

Well cold turkey didnt work for Denis. Now he has started taking Methadone, 25mg a day (the doctor says he is going to up the dose today at the apt, because of the withdarwls denis is still getting from the 60-80 T1s he takes a DAY!!). Anyhow, I was just curious if I could get some info, stories and advice. He is having some problems on it. Is not being able to have an orgasim a side effect? What about killer head achs??
Any advice, stories or info will be greatly appreciated!
thanks in advance......TARA

[Zzalord]

I've had a few initial unpleasant side-effects that have since subsided greatly or have gone away completely. I had the same sexual problem, sleeping through the night without waking up numerous times was and still is an issue, but not quite as bad. I also had what felt like severe narcolepsy (suddenly being almost impossible to stay awake.... I mean nodding head and falling asleep wherever I was at). The Narcolepsy thing is gone and I no longer feel even tired or sleepy (other than normal stuff).

Getting at the right does seems to take some trial and error but for me it has made a world of a difference. My wife can't believe it!

[Tara]

Thank You for your reply! Well, the Doc uped the dose to 40mg yesterday, and Denis is feeling OK. He has been puking alot and like you were, noding off quite abit. But the good thing is he is not taking 60Ty1s every day!
thanks again, Tara

[logo]

Dr. Clifford Bernstein
The Drug Abuse Warning Network reported that across the nation, Methadone-related incidents requiring emergency room treatment has increased 37 percent between 2000 and 2001. Florida saw an 80 percent increase in Methadone related deaths in the same period, and North Carolina's fatalities increased eight times from 1997 to 2001. Virginia is witnessing similar trends, and data predicts that we will soon be seeing significantly more Methadone-related abuse than OxyContin.
Like Vicodin and Lortab, the frequency in which Methadone is being prescribed for pain is also increasing. Patients who were prescribed Methadone by their physicians to treat the pain of common ailments such as chronic back pain, sports-related injuries, or migraine headaches, are now seeking treatment for a dependency on a drug that was originally intended to help them.
For many years, Methadone was not considered an addictive threat because of the length of time (several hours) between taking it and experiencing the narcotic effect. Additionally, it has a sedative, rather than stimulant, effect. As an opiate-based painkiller, Methadone can serve as an adequate stand-in for heroin or OxyContin. This can be extremely dangerous due to the delayed and subtle effect of the "high". People can overdose because they don't anticipate or feel the actual damage being done until it is too late.
Methadone has become more widely available in recent years, due in part to the increased number of clinics using Methadone to treat heroin and OxyContin addictions. This makes it difficult to determine whether the drug is friend or foe. Ryan Curry, a 21 year-old Maine resident, began taking OxyContin to get high with his friends several years ago. Like many people who use OxyContin recreationally and for medical purposes, his body became dependent. Ryan decided he wanted to break his dependency so he sought treatment at a local Methadone clinic. Ryan was put on a low dose of Methadone to replace the OxyContin he had been abusing. As he became tolerant of the effects of the Methadone, doctors gradually increased his dose.
Ryan continued to take the Methadone supplied to him by the clinic for two years with his prescribed dose having more than quadrupled during that time.
"I couldn't understand why they kept increasing my dose when I was supposed to be getting the drugs out of my system," said Ryan. "My body would grow accustomed to the dose and I would need it increased just to make it through the day. It was not helping me."
Methadone treatment facilities traditionally service the patient on an outpatient basis, administering medication with a drive-thru mentality. A patient's vulnerability, compounded by a lack of sufficient medical supervision and psychological support, can sometimes result in the emergence of the new dependency. More so, a doctor may have difficulty judging the proper Methadone dose for a first-time user. Additionally, patients are escalated to Methadone doses much higher than the original opiate in order to allow for 24-hour dosing. The consequence of this is that Methadone patients are much more difficult to detox.
Experts argue that people who are prescribed Methadone for dependency on heroin or another opiate can lead normal lives and should be praised for giving up their addictions. However, these people may need to take Methadone forever, unable to function without it. Like any other dependency, quitting Methadone can cause withdrawal symptoms because the user is still dependent on opiates. Fundamentally, Methadone treatment neither addresses nor reverses the core issue of dependency, and studies of former heroin dependents have shown that withdrawal from heroin was far less excruciating and lengthy than withdrawal from Methadone.
Is substituting one form of dependency for another really the way to approach this life-threatening problem?
The Methadone clinics will tell you not to get off the Methadone and that the Buprenex does not work. They do not want to lose your business and their steady stream of income. The treatment does work and you do not have to be dependent on narcotics forever.

[sharebear2004]

Tara,
Well if he is sleeping alot his dose is to high! I know I had the same problem and I am not having this problem because they lowerd my dose but wanted to post this before I left! Will post again when I get back home!
Sharebear

[sharebear2004]

Tara,
Hello I just read the doc's post and it is full of crap! If you go into a methadone clinic you are there to get help right? If not then don't even go! Because methadone is a person's last resort to SOBERITY and should only be used in that situation. And about the "RYAN"story that was bull! He was at the clinic for a promised high daily! Because look at me and my husband ok we had a HUGE habit! We went through a few GRAMS DAILY! Not once a month ot once a week but EVERY SINGLE DAY! And we went from that to methadone and I am on 100 MG. a day and Glenn is at 60 MG. a day. And we don't get high and I have a;ready dropped 10 and had no side effects! So I guess what I am trying to say is if you are there to reach a sober life then it can be done you just have to want it. And also you have control of when you bring your dose down. If you are there for the right reason then yes the staff might say well let's keep you where you are but NO STAND UP FOR YOURSELF! Keep right on them about dropping your dose! Don't drop it fast but 5 mg. EVERY 5 DAYS would be ok. But take that slow to. If you do this go from like i.e 100 to 95 stay there for 5-7 days and see how you feel if you feel ok try to go to 90 and stay there for 2-3 weeks! And so on so on! But when you get to say 15-10 mg. go to only 1 mg. drop a week because if you go slow enough you won't be sick! And your chance of reccovery will be higher then the next person who did not stand up for them self!
Sharebear & Glenn

[a Parent]

Hello, Is this a good place to ask questions about Methadone? I have a son who is currently going to a clinic, he's at about 65/70 MG. Is it possible to get off this eventually. He's had a hard time getting below this amount. Thanks!

[redjeepgirl76]

message below

[redjeepgirl76]

MESSAGE TO SHARE BEAR..............just to let you know.....I was on Methadone for 4 years at 140mgs......so i have lived the experience.....just like you. Let me ask you a question......Have you ever tried to kick it?? Do you want to be on it for the rest of your life?? If you want to live on it forever....than its great for you.....but the chances of successfully getting of of it without turning to your drug of choice is very minimal....like 2%. I adovated for the clinics...when i was a patient......after trying to get off of it.......I wanted to blow them up.....They are completely for PROFIT.....they want your business......they do not want you to leave.....they LIE about coming off of it saying to go very slow.....It doesn't matter how slow you go....the damage is done. It takes the human nervous system 2 years to heal from the damage from methadone. I have been on suboxone for 6 months...that is the true miracle drug....no side effects.....I realize that you feel normal right now....you're adjusted to feeling like that. Trust me when i tell you........YOU ARE IN FOR A SERIOUS SHOCK. I'm not trying to be a B###H, but Methadone ruined my life.....(trying to get off of it).....I still haven't heard a success story from someone on a Methadone maintenance program(Funny how the clinics claim to have many)....that hasn't relapsed or could quit. Suboxone allows your nervous system to heal....withdrawals are said to be very mild......And you can truley learn to live and deal............

[sharebear2004]

redjeepgirl76,
Well I have dropped 15mg. already and I feel fine! I will not allow myself to be on for long. And also you MIGHT have been on it for to long. Maybe I don't know but me and Glenn have a plan and it is to be on methadone as little as possiable. And also when we went to the clinic in Manchester NH. we were told that methadone is a very small part of recovery. I think if you are counting on methadone alone to get you better then you will relapse when you are off of it! And a lot of your recovery has to do with you and we know this that is why when we went to the program we had it in our head to stay at the lowest dose possiable! And I will admit that I went to high but as soon as I noticed what I Had done I had then drop it. And I had a habit unreal! Every other day we were picking up 10 grams and we would be going down sick! And also I tried to go on suboxon but I was sent home to get a smaller habit and then when I did they hung up on me. But I would also like to say that if you are on methadone then you also need to have more of a support system and theropy involved during and after. And were me and Glenn go we have been told that the time you are on methadone is up to you. You have control of how and when you go down. Maybe years ago they kept you there for money but in the 20th century there is and always be someone to take your place so I honestly believe that this is a myth. But I also beileve and know for a fact that methadone has saved my LIFE. And I also think that if you are going to be able to come off of methadone you will beable to do so within' the first year. Not start to drop your dose but be off of it completely and we are going to do it this way and when we are done with methadone we know out treatment is not done but it had just begun, and thats why we have made a whole treatment plan.
Sharebear & Glenn

[redjeepgirl76]

Methadone also saved my life at that point in time.....but if i could do it all over again i would try quitting my drug of choice....instead of this rollarcoaster of switching one drug for another. At that point in time I had about a 160mg a day oxy habit....it was the only thing(meth) available at the time. For four years I continued........I got tired of it...paying, etc. I figured after all that time my addiction was under 'better' control....I didn't have the same friends...a completely new life. I went down gradual but once i got down to about 25mg a day...I was constantly sick.....could barely work...chills constantly.....felt like i was dying. I didn't want to drag it on anymore so i went cold turkey...thinking since my body was in complete shock I wanted to get it over with. What the clinics tell you is 'meth' is a big bully...so if you try to get high on it....it overpowers it...therefore its just a waste of money and time.....What they don't tell you is....how it works......everyday when you dose your nervous receptors get flooded(my current physician said the maximum an adult should have is about 20mg...a day....as you can tell he does not support clinics) When your dosed above a certain amount your nervous system does have enough ports to accept it all, so your body creates them.....so lets say you have(for example only), 10 receptors.....and its flooded with methadone.....your body creates more receptors to keep it filled....when you withdraw....your system goes into meltdown....there aren't enough drug to keep all the newly formed receptors happy....hence detox. My doctor runs the Recovery Center at Mercy hospital in Portland Maine.....he has extended amounts of knowledge....he told me it takes the body 2 years to heal the receptors.....

I have never felt such a strong desire to commit suicide during that time in my life. I have had many friends in my shoes....NO one was able to stay clean.....I had to admit myself into the hospital because i was going absolutely insane. I promised myself that i would try to explain to others how bad that stuff messes up your body......within 3 days...your body screams with electric shocks.....no sleep.....no food.....I lost 30lbs in a month.......my mind became obsessed with killing the beast.....I had to get help....when i got admitted all the nurses and doctors shook their heads.......they no how bad it messes you up. They said success rates are next to nill. I have been on suboxone for about 5 months....I'll be tapering very slowly.....the w/d's are supposed to be a 1/10 of methadone.

They say that withdrawls from meth can last up to a year. I would suggest to you guys, that you add suboxone to your treatment plan when you get below 30mg....between the drugs and the meth your mind has been numbed for years. I actually thought i felt normal...boy i had a MAJOR wake up call. You guys should taper down like your doing and arrange to set up an appointment......I just don't want anyone to go thru the absolute torment i endured....if i could one save only person the pain....

You should ask the clinic for proof of recovered people.....they talk the talk but they don't walk the walk.....I had a treatment plan too......but nothing will prepare you for this..........I wish you luck. All i'm asking is be skepical of what they tell you.....read the message boards......we are the people who know..............talk to you soon, Chrystal

[someguy]

Just my 2 cents on something I read above. Methadone clinics are absolutely there for the money. The counslers lose money when you get off of it and everyone else that works there. My wife has worked in recovery for 14 years on the financial end of it not the patient care end and I have to say from personally bein n methadone, it sucks to get off of if you don't do it slow and i mean slow. when i got down to 25mg, i just went down 1 mg a week and i never felt one w/d. But at the same time 2 months later i was shooting dope again. so i agree with both of you in last 2 posts. I am on suboxone now and can't unerstand why anyone would choose methadone over sub, unless it was a money or location factor. God bless.

[sharebear2004]

Someguy,
Hi it is sharebear: When I first heard of Suboxon I wanted to detox with suboxon instead of methadone and I made an intake appointment! Went to the appointment and they asked me how many bags a day I was doing and I was honest and told them my habit was at the least I was dong on a slow day was 30 bags. And then I was told well we can't put you on suboxon unless you go home and get a smaller habit. This was a thursday. So I went home and put myself through hell because I knew I had to get help so I what I did was a bundle a day from thursday through Tuesday and called and I was told that they WERE NOT going to HELP ME! So for me this was and still is the ONLY WAY! I'm not sure what your situation was before you got help but for me it was just a matter of days before I was dead! So to me methadone has saved my life and also made my life a hsppy place for me. This is the first time since I was 10 to not be completely out of it 24-7! And that means so much to me. I know what is going on around me and I know who my friends are and I also have given my step-childern a CLEAN PARENT! Something they have NOT had in YEARS! And he is also on methadone and has only let his dose get up to 60mg.! And before he went on methadone he had went 14 days without heroin! And he went through hell and he was a wreck. And if I didn't pay for him to be on methadone he would have gone back into the same lifestyle as before. So when I talk about methadone and what it has done for us I mean it and I do know of SUCCESS STORY'S and have met people who used to be on methdone daily and today they have nothing and they have not turned to there drug of choice! If you go and MAKE the DECISION to start the BATTLE of SOBERITY then you have made the decision for a long a tuff battle but this battle can WON! And with useing methadone or suboxon is you going to the clinic and saying hey I am human and I NEED HELP! And if you use after methadone it is because of you not fighting enough. And the reason you don't see many people who have made it is because they are sober and they don't need forum's and or they don't go to a meeting everyday. Because they have filled there time with positive thing's! I mean think about it what was your daily routine before you went to get help???? I know what mine was and I didn't leave my bed let alone my house! Since I have been on methadone I go out and do thing's and that is what other people do who have got off of methadone. And I am sure there will be a few days that you WILL feel like **** but I can promise you that without methadone or suboxon you would feel like **** even more days then with the help from one of them! So I know that I had a huge addicition and I still have a couple of days coming my way for feeling like ****..... I am not looking forward to it but it is something I just can't avoid! But I just thought I would let you know my feeling on people who use after they are off of methadone. I just thing that if you WANT SOBERITY BAD ENOUGH it WILL happen. I also think that you know what your outcome will be with the methadone clinic when you first start because let's say person #1 starts on methadone and they start with 30mg and that day they use 3 bags and then the next day they get 40mg and they only use 2 bags and then day 3 they get 50mg and they don't use anything that day they WILL have a better chance then person #2 who goes up as fast as #1 but continues to use even when they get up tp there daily dose! And also methadone has very little to do with reccovery, you need to have a support system that will follow you even when you are off of methadone!
Sharebear

[Blake]

I hate methadone.

I used to do 240-320mg of Oxy then I had a $300 a day heroin habbit. I detoxed from both of those and it sucked but it was over in a week or so. When I was on methadone, I was taking 120mg/day and I quit cold turkey. The withdrawals from methadone are just as bad as heroin or oxy's and last 4 times as long. Methadone is a long acting oppiod so it stays in your system alot longer than meds or dope. I deffinately think clinics are there to make money off of addicts. Legalize heroin and see how many "heroin maintenance" clinics open....It's the same thing addiction is addiction is addiction. But thats my oppinion and oppinions are like ........


YRMV

[grrl1]

yup, opionions are like ..... but heres mine anyway. Drugs and drug treatment are a major source of revenue for a lot of people. and whether it's cold turkey, inpatient, methadone, suboxone, or magic dust, the success rates for treating addicts tend to be low. We are responsible for our own recovery, and we have to know and act upon that b4 we can get well. Also, no addict is going to respond exactly the same as another addict to any given type of treatment, because we are all individuals, with a lot of different physical, mental, and emotional components to our addictions. I got lucky. My for - profit methadone clinic happened to have some amazing and very caring people working there, who, like the people at the tables, were able to love me untill i could love myself. i know not every clinic is like that, i'd been to three others over a 7 yr period and they were s##tholes. but i stopped using illicit drugs while i was on methadone. i detoxed off methadone, and then used buprenorphine for 14 days to get through the worst of my WDs. I then felt like hell for a few months, but i went to meetings, i had the support of my family and friends, i told myself things would get better and slowly but surely they did.... because i did not use. like i said, i got lucky. but the biggest determining factor in what will or will not work for an addict is the addict themselves. but that is just my opinion, and i think that any of us who manage to earn any clean time against this disease should be commended, cuz it ain't easy.

[someguy]

60-80 pills a day?? Better get his liver checked, I never seen anyone eat that many pills without dieing. Hell the tylenon alone would kill him. I'm serious, if he really took that much daily he has got to have some serious liver damage. NOt trying to bum you out, but every post you make a metion as to the Number of pills he was taking, well i noticed and that is why I'm bringing it up. I was on methadone, if they just uped his dose you got to give it a couple of day's to kick in, it's not instant with that stuff. Coming off of it is the same way, got to go slow. Hey good luck

[sharebear2004]

Blake,
When you go to you intake appointment before you even go on methadone the safest ways to get off of it with little to no withdrawls! But I do know that I have been on methadone since 2/3/05 and I went up to 110mg. and was at 110mg. for only 3 days and I am know at 95. When I started the program I knew the I was in charge of my own reccovery. Yes they won't let you drop to fast unless you push but when they say why don't you wait 5 days and makesure you are ok. That is what the staff are there for to help you. In my opinnion you went too fast off of the methadone, witch of course your going to feel the ****! When you went cold turkey on 120mg of methadone that is just like doing a bundle a day for 2 months and just waking up one day and say nope thats it no more heroin! That is way to DANGEROUS! But this is my OPPINON
Sharebear&Glenn