switching from methadone to subutex
 

been on subutex for about a year, got down to 6mg a day... like a twit i munched thro a few extra days of my daily dose (i get a weekly pick up from my clinic) so i took 25mg of methadone for five days (which i now know was too much) and now want to get back on the subutex... my last dose of methadone was 28 hours ago, i was gonna wait 36 hours so as not to go into a precipitated withdrawal... yeah i have had one of these in the past, and yes it sucked... i know it varies from person to person but is 36 hrs likely to be long enough to avoid precipitated withdrawal??? i know it is an inexact science but i would appreciate any advice anyone might offer as i VERY MUCH want to avoid the awful instant withdrawal i had before, but i also want to get back to normal i.e. back on subutex as soon as possible... thanks. ps i realise 6mg of subutex will not be enough so i have a few extra with which to make the, hopefully smooth, transition.....

cor, don't all come to my aid at once! (5 days and no reply) i suppose it was too much to expect any help from a lot of self focused, whinging, bullshitting crack freaks and silver surfers... in fact , exactly like an NA meeting: a group of mostly insincere, superficially friendly people who can barely suppress the junkie "me me me" attitude for long enough to help another human being who's in need of some help. worthless scumbags.

nice marm- very sweet.
you know, since I've quit narcs, I surf through here daily and try to post to anyone's thread I can, reminds me where I was and who I am and why I can't go back.
someone's thread can get overlooked, I guess, sorry it happened to you. I can tell you that everybody here has been instrumental in my recovery- I couldn't have done it without them.
never had any experience with sub or methadone-but hopefully one of us worthless scumbags who has had experience with those will be along in a min to give you advice

Hey Marmalade -
I have used both methadone and suboxone, never at the same time thankfully but I hear that precipitated withdrawal is very bad indeed. So by now you are back on the subutex hopefully and things are better - yes?

What you said about NA meetings really struck a cord with me. I find your description is right on the mark with some of them I have attended and they really don't do much for me. On the other hand I have been reading this forum for just a short time so I will reserve judgment on it until I have read more and kind of get the 'flow' of things.

worthless scumbag aka Noah

na meetings being populated by...
 

i've only been to 7 or 8 na meetings so can't claim to be an authority on the subject but have, in the main, found them to be populated by 3 types of people: 1. really sincere helpful, salt of the earth types (a minority , sadly) 2. people who say they have "a problem man" but this usually turns out to be the odd spliff or a couple of nurofen once in a while, either spotty studenty types usually named tarquin (the former) or middle aged mums (the latter) this group is larger than group 1 but still a minority. 3. and now to the largest and most common group (latin name: completeselfobsessionicus justhadabootinthetoileticus) these types usually go to na meetings either looking for sex or to borrow money, usually they are very cliquey, can't wait to jump in front of any newcomers with the words "i'm tracy/trevor i'm an addict, and relate what's been happening in their self centered, excuse for an existence... they specialise in phony friendliness, complete insincerity and total self focus, they will say "come and have a coffee with us all afterwards" (if they haven't nodded out) but by the end of the meeting will look at you blankly when you say "where are we going for coffee then", but will probably ask you for a cigarette or money before walking off in a group leaving you feeling really humiliated and belittled and will generally leave you, as a newcomer, with the avowed intention to score as soon as possible, to forget the whole ghastly episode...

thanyou peachy and noah...
 

thanks to peachy1005 and noah for at least replying to my post, actually i'm not quite as bitter as i might sound, all my posts are written with a wry smile on my face, although my post about the people i believe encounter many NA meetings, sadly, IN MY EXPERIENCE, was bang on the money. like a lot of addicts, in my old life i was fairly popular, but as an addict you have to adopt a "look after number one" mentality and though you might have many other addicts you hangout/score with/talk to, i bet most of us don't have many fellow addicts we REALLY TRUST... by this i mean a person you could leave your meds with for a few days and KNOW they would be there for you when you went back to collect them. i'm no hypocrite though, i'm not going to pretend i've never pulled a fast one to get drugs in time of need, although i've never used violence or done anything that makes it hard for me to look myself in the mirror come the morning. and for the record, after properly perusing the site with my mind not in a panic due to drugs issues, i do see that this site seems to be poulated by some kind sorts, who want to pass on their hard earned knowledge so others might not face the same horrors they once did......

That really hurts because in my case it's so damn accurate. If your post was two weeks earlier I would have jumped to help you in a minute, like I've done a hundred times here before. But I've been so self-absorbed with my recent temporary relapse that all I could think of is myself. I'm sorry.

OK so let me try to help... listen, if you had to "cheat" on your subutex program you sure picked a bad drug to do it with. The easiest transition is from short-acting opiates to subutex and methadone is the longest lasting opiate in the world.

I know this advice is a bit late but I'll explain it in case somebody else reads this thread one day who needs to know....

If I was in your situation my strategy would be like this:

Get off of the methadone and then go as long as possible, delve deep into the pain of withdrawals, at least two days. It won't be fun.

Then take subutex and expect the withdrawals to get even worse.

Then take more subutex. Then more. Then more still. Then some more. Pretty soon it won't make you feel worse, it will make you feel better.

While it will be unpleasant it will still be better than the alternatives of (1) fully going through methadone withdrawal, or (2) feeling precipitated withdrawals in full force.

thankyou
 

thanks for your help, i appreciate you taking the time to reply, in truth, having been on subutex a while (and having had a precipitated withdrawal due to messing about with methadone) i kinda knew what to do, but wanted a little reassurance from someone else who knew the score, you know what its like when you are starting to withdraw a little, it can be nice to check your strategy with someone more knowledgable, because i have learnt that there is always someone out there who knows a little more than i do about a given subject, in this case you! thanks for your honesty and your help...