ultram and suboxone - SoberRecovery : Alcoholism Drug Addiction Help and Information

sharpie · 12-07-2007, 11:41 AM

I suspect my addict husband is using ultram. (mainly because he offered me one the other night when I had a migraine. He's a medical professional on probation but still has access to most drugs) He's been on suboxone for the past 2 years for his methadone addiction. He has regular drug screens that have all been negative and swears up and down that ultram would show up (which dr. google refutes) and that suboxone would block any effects (can't find an answer.) He's also started to drink a lot more than usual. (from 1-2x/week to 2-3/night)

Can anyone provide me with firsthand experience? Does suboxone block ultram? Does alcohol increase it's effects? Thx.

bval · 12-07-2007, 12:32 PM

I would be way surprised if one could get much of a buzz off (if any) ultram while using suboxone. Especially if one were originally at one point hooked on methadone. You'd likely need so much ultram to catch a buzz that it'd put you into seizures.

I do not suspect that ultram would show up in a routine drug screen. Yes, alcohol will increase the effects of any opioid-type drug. Whether it will increase the effects in a particularly positive way, in terms of the high, is dependent largely upon the opioid in question, the relative amounts of dope and booze, and the individual. Put it this way: many heroin addicts are also heavy drinkers. Many of them die because of the combination of these two drugs, most of them know they are endangering their lives by mixing like this, and yet many of them do it anyway. Which leads one to the logical conclusion that the booze improves the high of the heroin.

That being said, for ME personally, my drinking fell WAY WAY off once I was started on the opiates, although I did still occasionally have a few drinks from time to time. I just didn't really like the feeling of the booze mixed with opiates, myself. So everyone is different, but it's certainly POSSIBLE that the increased drinking is a 'sign'. An alternate possible explanation might be is if he's on the straight an narrow and has been reducing his suboxone (like he should probably be doing) it may be that he's increasing the alcohol to cope with the unpleasantness produced by lessening his dose.

Truth is, if he is indeed taking ultram, he likely would've stopped the suboxone. Do you have any way of making sure he's still taking it? Tell him you wanna sit there and watch him suck on one for about 20 minutes (without spitting or swallowing) to prove to you he's still on it. If he's resistant, that may mean he's not been taking it, but has been taking something else, so he knows that taking it is going to make him feel like crap. If he does take it, watch for signs of it making him feel like crap afterwards, that would also be a good sign that he's been on something else.

Just my $.02 ... good luck

ccgirl · 12-07-2007, 02:36 PM

Um, curious - who has him on the suboxone? That seems like a long time to be on it. I hope it's not a case of the doctor "healing" himself.

sharpie · 12-07-2007, 03:00 PM

He just tapered down to the lowest dose last month so the theory about trying to reduce the discomfort fits. He's seeing a doctor for the therapy and the doctor along with OPD (office of professional discipline) want him to remain on it as a form of insurance.

I'll watch him next time he takes it. Thank you for your advice. I really appreciate it.

timada · 05-09-2008, 05:54 AM

Has there been any developments in the situation? I had a similar situation with my husband a few years ago and turns out he was abusing drugs. It can be very hard to find out because you really don’t want to suggest you don’t trust your partner or hurt their feelings. I got lucky in that he broke down and told me after several nights of asking if there is anything he wants to tell me. He went to a drug rehab and got himself fixed in a few weeks, I’m very proud of him.

kj3880 · 05-09-2008, 08:03 AM

What are you doing for you? You have to get out of his life and into your own or you are going to be miserable. Anyway, truth will out. Keep your own money, though. And get busy and happy with your hobbies, job, friends, family, life. Go to Alanon for help with this. Hugs!
KJ:praying

sosantney · 05-09-2008, 12:43 PM

Well in my experience as an opiate addict, having gone from heroin addiction, methadone addiction, and suboxone, taking Ultram didn't even give me a buzz for a headache. It would show up in a drug screen any opiate would. Also even on the lowest dose of Suboxone it would still block the effects of other opiates, especially a weak one like Ultram. Suboxone binds to the Opiate receptors so tightly that no other opiates can get on them, as well as has naltroxone which is an opiate blocker.

kj3880 · 05-09-2008, 08:36 PM

Well, I checked several medical sources and all of them say that many opiates, including oxycontin don't show up on the standard 4-panel screen, neither does suboxyn, or I couldn't take it. Heroin and codeine both metabolize into morphine so they show up, because the basic test used in most jobs tests for morphine. Percocet and Oxy don't break down quite the same. Chemists changes the structure of it to reduce the effect of nausea
kj

12-07-2007, 11:41 AM	#1 (permalink)
sharpie Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: ny Posts: 3	ultram and suboxone I suspect my addict husband is using ultram. (mainly because he offered me one the other night when I had a migraine. He's a medical professional on probation but still has access to most drugs) He's been on suboxone for the past 2 years for his methadone addiction. He has regular drug screens that have all been negative and swears up and down that ultram would show up (which dr. google refutes) and that suboxone would block any effects (can't find an answer.) He's also started to drink a lot more than usual. (from 1-2x/week to 2-3/night) Can anyone provide me with firsthand experience? Does suboxone block ultram? Does alcohol increase it's effects? Thx.

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12-07-2007, 12:32 PM	#2 (permalink)
bval Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: CA Native Posts: 2,509	I would be way surprised if one could get much of a buzz off (if any) ultram while using suboxone. Especially if one were originally at one point hooked on methadone. You'd likely need so much ultram to catch a buzz that it'd put you into seizures. I do not suspect that ultram would show up in a routine drug screen. Yes, alcohol will increase the effects of any opioid-type drug. Whether it will increase the effects in a particularly positive way, in terms of the high, is dependent largely upon the opioid in question, the relative amounts of dope and booze, and the individual. Put it this way: many heroin addicts are also heavy drinkers. Many of them die because of the combination of these two drugs, most of them know they are endangering their lives by mixing like this, and yet many of them do it anyway. Which leads one to the logical conclusion that the booze improves the high of the heroin. That being said, for ME personally, my drinking fell WAY WAY off once I was started on the opiates, although I did still occasionally have a few drinks from time to time. I just didn't really like the feeling of the booze mixed with opiates, myself. So everyone is different, but it's certainly POSSIBLE that the increased drinking is a 'sign'. An alternate possible explanation might be is if he's on the straight an narrow and has been reducing his suboxone (like he should probably be doing) it may be that he's increasing the alcohol to cope with the unpleasantness produced by lessening his dose. Truth is, if he is indeed taking ultram, he likely would've stopped the suboxone. Do you have any way of making sure he's still taking it? Tell him you wanna sit there and watch him suck on one for about 20 minutes (without spitting or swallowing) to prove to you he's still on it. If he's resistant, that may mean he's not been taking it, but has been taking something else, so he knows that taking it is going to make him feel like crap. If he does take it, watch for signs of it making him feel like crap afterwards, that would also be a good sign that he's been on something else. Just my $.02 ... good luck

12-07-2007, 02:36 PM	#3 (permalink)
ccgirl Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Harwich, MA Posts: 2,749	Um, curious - who has him on the suboxone? That seems like a long time to be on it. I hope it's not a case of the doctor "healing" himself.

12-07-2007, 03:00 PM	#4 (permalink)
sharpie Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: ny Posts: 3	He just tapered down to the lowest dose last month so the theory about trying to reduce the discomfort fits. He's seeing a doctor for the therapy and the doctor along with OPD (office of professional discipline) want him to remain on it as a form of insurance. I'll watch him next time he takes it. Thank you for your advice. I really appreciate it.

05-09-2008, 05:54 AM	#5 (permalink)
timada Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 4	Has there been any developments in the situation? I had a similar situation with my husband a few years ago and turns out he was abusing drugs. It can be very hard to find out because you really don’t want to suggest you don’t trust your partner or hurt their feelings. I got lucky in that he broke down and told me after several nights of asking if there is anything he wants to tell me. He went to a drug rehab and got himself fixed in a few weeks, I’m very proud of him.

05-09-2008, 08:03 AM	#6 (permalink)
kj3880 Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: md Posts: 3,002	What are you doing for you? You have to get out of his life and into your own or you are going to be miserable. Anyway, truth will out. Keep your own money, though. And get busy and happy with your hobbies, job, friends, family, life. Go to Alanon for help with this. Hugs! KJ:praying

05-09-2008, 12:43 PM	#7 (permalink)
sosantney Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: belmar. nj Posts: 11	Well in my experience as an opiate addict, having gone from heroin addiction, methadone addiction, and suboxone, taking Ultram didn't even give me a buzz for a headache. It would show up in a drug screen any opiate would. Also even on the lowest dose of Suboxone it would still block the effects of other opiates, especially a weak one like Ultram. Suboxone binds to the Opiate receptors so tightly that no other opiates can get on them, as well as has naltroxone which is an opiate blocker.

05-09-2008, 08:36 PM	#8 (permalink)
kj3880 Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: md Posts: 3,002	Well, I checked several medical sources and all of them say that many opiates, including oxycontin don't show up on the standard 4-panel screen, neither does suboxyn, or I couldn't take it. Heroin and codeine both metabolize into morphine so they show up, because the basic test used in most jobs tests for morphine. Percocet and Oxy don't break down quite the same. Chemists changes the structure of it to reduce the effect of nausea kj

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