Why do people think addicts and alcoholics are the scum of the earth? - SoberRecovery : Alcoholism Drug Addiction Help and Information

bluebird · 10-14-2007, 04:05 PM

It's a common reference.. I just don't get it. Last week I had to attend a drug testing meeting and the speaker was talking about addicts and how they're scum.. I just thought that was rather rude.

I mean..yeah..being an addict is definately not good, but I wouldn't call someone like that scum. Most people I know who have a problem with drugs or alcohol have had a hard life..and many have had a history of abuse growing up.

Sometimes when you're a teenager and you're living in hell..people choose different ways of dealing with it. You can't leave like an adult can. So you're stuck in a bad situation..and nobody will help..so sometimes people turn to drugs. And this is just one of a million reasons why a person would turn to drugs.

People just irritate me how they're so quick to judge..

Katie

emmer · 10-14-2007, 04:19 PM

oh I so agree with you Katie ....... calling everyone who uses scum is just plain ignorant.
The person who said that is sounds self rightous themselves.

littlethings · 10-14-2007, 04:38 PM

I agree as well.. that is rude.... no one should ever make that kind of comment especially at a meeting.

I believe that EVERYONE is addicted to SOMETHING at some point in their lives.. remember humans are CREATURES OF HABIT. Enough said.

**historyteach** · 10-14-2007, 06:09 PM

bluebird;

You raise a good question.
And I'm ashamed to say, before my own son became a heroin addict, I would have labeled addicts as "less than" too. Perhaps some of my own introspection will help us all understand each other....

If I label another person "scum" or some other "less than" human name, it serves as a protection for me. See, I see myself as human. Myself and all the other people who behave more or less as I do. Therefore, those who behave "other than" the way we do, are "less than" human. Consequently, I don't have to worry about being "one of them." Or, being affected by one of "them." And I could demand that LAW AND ORDER take care of "them." Lock 'em up; throw away the key. They can't live like human beings, then they can't live *with* human beings.
See the logic?

But, I was wrong...
My son became an addict. All that perceived protection went right out the window.
And what it really boils down to is this:

I forgot that that addict/alcoholic is a child of G*D.
Just like me,
But for the grace of G*D...

And I'm sorry for the ill will I caused, before I knew better. I cannot change the past, but, I work for a better future.

Shalom!

Brewster · 10-14-2007, 06:33 PM

Ten years ago, I would've probably said the same thing about addicts. Now that I am one, I've found some of the greatest people in recovery. I'm thinking that going through this is a charactor builder (if there can be any benefit to it at all). A great personal struggle/tragedy maybe is needed to help people appreciate the beauty in all kinds of people. My grandmother used to say, "don't be so harsh on people, everyone is going through their own personal struggle just to get along". I finally know what that wise woman meant.

Nothing has made me more tolerant of people than my recovery journey. For me anyway, an addict isn't less of a person, they are one of God's creations with a problem and I am in no position to judge them. Help them maybe, listen to them maybe but not judge them.

It took my personal tragedy to get me to that point. One of the few good things about my addiction I'm thinking.

As for calling someone scum, I think that says more or less about the person doing the name calling than the person being called the name. I have yet to meet an addict I couldn't find something to like about.

***marle*** · 10-14-2007, 06:40 PM

My daughter is my addict and I am ashamed to say that I have called her really bad names in the past. I no longer do that because of the good people that I have met on here. It took me a long time to understand addiction and why she does the things she does. I think I called her names out of fear. Fear that she would die and that if I shamed her enough, she would get clean. I know now that all it did was make me feel horrible about myself. I did not need to shame her, she already feels bad enough about herself. Thanks for the reminder that we need to treat people, all people, with respect. Marle

ccgirl · 10-14-2007, 09:25 PM

When I left the hospital in June, my friend of 15 years reamed me out, told me how could I be so morally bankrupt - I have a wonderful husband and children and home.

I told her I didn't come out of my mother's womb hoping my life would turn out this way; I certainly didn't count being an addict as accomplishments I hoped to achieve in my life. Unfortunately, people, even people you are supposedly close to tend to see addiction as a moral shortcoming

Well, the friendship is over since that day, and frankly I don't care anymore; I have the people in my program and my husband and family. I have no room in my life for people who have no compassion and are quick to judge. I only hope for the sake of her children, they never slip and fall the same way because she would disown them.

exjunky · 10-14-2007, 09:37 PM

It really makes my blood boil to see these fools give their "tough love advice" to drug addicts. (Television's Dr. Phil comes to mind.) They have this air of superiority, as if to show that they must have more moral character, and they will show us the way. The fact is, if they were addicted to opiates, they'd sell their own mothers for the next fix and would lie and cheat and steal just like the rest of us did when we were hooked.

And then they often insist to the addict that cold-turkey is the best method. If they were hooked, would they last through even 15 minutes of withdrawals? Would they quit cold turkey, or would they be blubbering like a baby for another fix after an hour goes by? Character, schmaracter.

I have seen so many beautiful people destroyed by drugs. It's not the person who is a monster, it's the drugs that are monstrous.

calabash · 10-15-2007, 01:35 AM

While all these things may be true, and while as an addict I am not scum, I also think our addict behaviour often lend itself to the scummy side! Now let me see.... I lied, I stole, I cheated, I manipulated, ....... Now to those who do not suffer from the disease of addiction, and who have little knowledge of addiction, being ripped off, lied to etc creates a perception.

This is no justification for calling me scum. I am a child of God. I am a fellow human being. But my behaviours previously sometimes leed to me being judged.

PeachyClean · 10-15-2007, 01:45 AM

Quote:

I lied, I stole, I cheated, I manipulated,

Every HUMAN being has done the above at one time or another. We're all the same.

**best** · 10-15-2007, 01:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by calabash

But my behaviours previously sometimes leed to me being judged.

I would have called myself scum but I have called others who don't use at all scum as well. In my growth of recovery I started to learn and before I started to learn I was no different then "them".
What was it Forrest said? Stupid is as stupid does?

A rude and obnoxious person will get called names by almost everyone to some degree.
Some of us have been rude and obnoxious in our past. If the shoe fits...

People can call me what ever they want... I know the truth and so doesn't God.
No one elses opinion matters.

windysan · 10-15-2007, 07:30 AM

When you see that speaker again please tell him to kiss windysan's arse. thanks.

***Doug*** · 10-15-2007, 07:41 AM

Either they're closed minded, ignorant, or have been hurt bad in the past by an addict. Or maybe all three.

Some folks are just that way. Aggravating? Yep. Especially to all of us who have lived it.

And maybe some day people like that will stop talking long enough to hear somebody's story, and then realize this isn't something we chose to pursue.

And maybe not.

Don't take personal attacks personally.

**Ann** · 10-15-2007, 07:50 AM

Ignorance, a complete lack of understanding combined with a lack of compassion, would drive someone to say that. Or fear.

My son is an addict. Some of the most wonderful people I have ever met are addicts in recovery.

My prayers go out that the person who said that, never ever has to find out that the addict they refer to could be their son or daughter or brother or sister or spouse or best friend....none of whom are scum, all of whom are God's children worthy of love and respect...even in their darkest hour.

Earth people, that's what we codies call those who have no clue.

Hugs

PaperDolls · 10-15-2007, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Why do people think addicts and alcoholics are the scum of the earth?

The answer to this is simple for me......Ignorance.......possibly fear as well. Fear of the unknown.

I have to admit......as an addict and a ACOA.........addiction can be difficult to understand.

northbelle · 10-15-2007, 11:12 AM

The ONLY thing that seperates THEM...from US....
DUMB LUCK...
love north

PaperDolls · 10-15-2007, 11:13 AM

I was thinking the same thing North.

Sort of like, the only thing separating me (and probably many of us) from homelessness is one (may be 2) paycheck(s).

GeorgiaPeach · 10-24-2007, 06:50 AM

Hey guys! I haven't been here in a while but I wanted to comment on this one. I agree that if you are an addict and you are in recovery that is one thing but don't you think that if you are an addict and know you are an addict and you just don't care especially if you have a family and you would rather buy drugs instead of take care of your family, that puts a whole new twist on the way you see that person? My husband has been an addict for about 7 years whether is be alcohol or pills or pot or whatever he could get his hands on. For about 3 or 4 years it was methadone. He did take care of us but all of our extra money was spent on pills and he would fuss if I spent $100 on groceries bevause that took away from money he spent on his habbit. He was a mean and abusive man while on any kind of drug and I never understood what I had done to make him be so mean to me until a year and a half ago when he told me about his addiction (I never knew about it). I have always stood by him and he actually went cold turkey about 5 times within the past year and a half. Each time he would go right back and hide his pills. I would find them and we would fight. I haven't thought of him the same since he went back after his first withdrawal from methadone. To this day I think less of him. He is now 5 weeks clean and hopefully he will stay that way. He started a new job in a new city & state and has no way (right now) of getting anything. He says that he is not craving them but he also says he wouldn't turn one down if offered. That's not too much progress but it is a start. Anyway, there has been drugs in my family for the past 15 years with one family member or another and I have a hard time seeing someone who used drugs and hurts people and doesn't want to get better as an equal. My ex-brother in law lost his family(my sister & nephew) & his home, got remarried and his son had health problems when he was born & his 5 month old daughter died because of his meth addiction (she suffocated but they were too messed up to know)and guess what.........he still uses meth! I certainly do not view him the same way I view others. Is that bad of me? I don't wish to make anyone mad but I can't help the way I feel.

GP

pakuni boy · 10-24-2007, 11:53 AM

that speker is a farse!, i agree that addcits are taken as scum in society, it seems than being an ex convict or murderer o rapist, etc is better than being an addict, also o when looking 4 a job, if the rumor ever comes that one is an addict, we can kiss goodbye to our job, here in my country there are associations and funds for helping all types of needed persons xcept addicts, when we live in a society full of addicts.

ccgirl · 10-24-2007, 12:13 PM

Georgia, I can see your anger; especially because it is a personal situation, but I still did not hear you think of him as scum.

It's people who stand on the sidelines and judge. I only wish they knew how much I would give to not be the way I am.

Jerzy007 · 10-24-2007, 12:16 PM

He's probably been robbed by one of US..LMAO

hairgirl · 10-24-2007, 03:12 PM

People fear what they don't know.People love to take the focus off of themselves, and people are quick to judge.You should be really careful what you say because it will eventually come bite you in the ass.

EricPaul · 10-26-2007, 06:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bluebird

It's a common reference.. I just don't get it. Last week I had to attend a drug testing meeting and the speaker was talking about addicts and how they're scum..

The speaker is ignorant and by the sounds of it still believes in the moral model of addiction. At one time in society, this is how people who became addicted to substances were viewed and treated. Some ignorant people still see things this way! Although, there are many people who are addicted and do criminal behaviors. If the behaviors are due to the use of the drug or the person is a criminally inclined person and would do criminal activities regardless of drugs use is an individual matter? Most people would not do robberies no matter how loaded they became. Getting loaded on substances lowers a persons inhibitions and they can do uncharacteristic behaviors due to the lowered inhibition, but some people would do these behaviors even when sober/clean.

Moral Model

Moral theories and models are based on beliefs or judgments of what is right or wrong, acceptable or unacceptable. These judgments imply that people who use drugs or alcohol are bad or sinful people. There is something morally wrong with people who use drugs or alcohol heavily. This model contributes little to our understanding of why people use drugs and alcohol heavily and offers no real help to those who have problems in their lives because of alcohol or drugs.

Treatment: The suggested treatment under this model would be punishment. Bad people should be punished. Punishment could range from social disapproval to locking users up in jail.

http://www.bankhead.net/BoozeAndDrugs/theories.htm

10-14-2007, 04:05 PM	#1 (permalink)
bluebird Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: kansas city mo Posts: 15	Why do people think addicts and alcoholics are the scum of the earth? It's a common reference.. I just don't get it. Last week I had to attend a drug testing meeting and the speaker was talking about addicts and how they're scum.. I just thought that was rather rude. I mean..yeah..being an addict is definately not good, but I wouldn't call someone like that scum. Most people I know who have a problem with drugs or alcohol have had a hard life..and many have had a history of abuse growing up. Sometimes when you're a teenager and you're living in hell..people choose different ways of dealing with it. You can't leave like an adult can. So you're stuck in a bad situation..and nobody will help..so sometimes people turn to drugs. And this is just one of a million reasons why a person would turn to drugs. People just irritate me how they're so quick to judge.. Katie

10-14-2007, 04:19 PM	#2 (permalink)
emmer The lion sleeps tonight Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Canada Posts: 1,641	oh I so agree with you Katie ....... calling everyone who uses scum is just plain ignorant. The person who said that is sounds self rightous themselves. __________________ Love conquers all.

10-14-2007, 04:38 PM	#3 (permalink)
littlethings Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: New Jersey Posts: 28	I agree as well.. that is rude.... no one should ever make that kind of comment especially at a meeting. I believe that EVERYONE is addicted to SOMETHING at some point in their lives.. remember humans are CREATURES OF HABIT. Enough said. __________________ ~It's the little things in life that count~

10-14-2007, 06:09 PM	#4 (permalink)
historyteach To Life! Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: centered again Posts: 8,006	bluebird; You raise a good question. And I'm ashamed to say, before my own son became a heroin addict, I would have labeled addicts as "less than" too. Perhaps some of my own introspection will help us all understand each other.... If I label another person "scum" or some other "less than" human name, it serves as a protection for me. See, I see myself as human. Myself and all the other people who behave more or less as I do. Therefore, those who behave "other than" the way we do, are "less than" human. Consequently, I don't have to worry about being "one of them." Or, being affected by one of "them." And I could demand that LAW AND ORDER take care of "them." Lock 'em up; throw away the key. They can't live like human beings, then they can't live with human beings. See the logic? But, I was wrong... My son became an addict. All that perceived protection went right out the window. And what it really boils down to is this: I forgot that that addict/alcoholic is a child of GD. Just like me, But for the grace of GD... And I'm sorry for the ill will I caused, before I knew better. I cannot change the past, but, I work for a better future. Shalom! __________________

10-14-2007, 06:33 PM	#5 (permalink)
Brewster Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Gatlinburg, TN Posts: 245	Ten years ago, I would've probably said the same thing about addicts. Now that I am one, I've found some of the greatest people in recovery. I'm thinking that going through this is a charactor builder (if there can be any benefit to it at all). A great personal struggle/tragedy maybe is needed to help people appreciate the beauty in all kinds of people. My grandmother used to say, "don't be so harsh on people, everyone is going through their own personal struggle just to get along". I finally know what that wise woman meant. Nothing has made me more tolerant of people than my recovery journey. For me anyway, an addict isn't less of a person, they are one of God's creations with a problem and I am in no position to judge them. Help them maybe, listen to them maybe but not judge them. It took my personal tragedy to get me to that point. One of the few good things about my addiction I'm thinking. As for calling someone scum, I think that says more or less about the person doing the name calling than the person being called the name. I have yet to meet an addict I couldn't find something to like about. Last edited by Brewster; 10-14-2007 at 06:39 PM. Reason: incomplete thought

10-14-2007, 06:40 PM	#6 (permalink)
*marle* Community Greeter Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: East Tawas, MI Posts: 3,140	My daughter is my addict and I am ashamed to say that I have called her really bad names in the past. I no longer do that because of the good people that I have met on here. It took me a long time to understand addiction and why she does the things she does. I think I called her names out of fear. Fear that she would die and that if I shamed her enough, she would get clean. I know now that all it did was make me feel horrible about myself. I did not need to shame her, she already feels bad enough about herself. Thanks for the reminder that we need to treat people, all people, with respect. Marle __________________ "If we all knew the answers, there would be no need for questions."

10-14-2007, 09:25 PM	#7 (permalink)
ccgirl Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Harwich, MA Posts: 2,593	When I left the hospital in June, my friend of 15 years reamed me out, told me how could I be so morally bankrupt - I have a wonderful husband and children and home. I told her I didn't come out of my mother's womb hoping my life would turn out this way; I certainly didn't count being an addict as accomplishments I hoped to achieve in my life. Unfortunately, people, even people you are supposedly close to tend to see addiction as a moral shortcoming Well, the friendship is over since that day, and frankly I don't care anymore; I have the people in my program and my husband and family. I have no room in my life for people who have no compassion and are quick to judge. I only hope for the sake of her children, they never slip and fall the same way because she would disown them.

10-14-2007, 09:37 PM	#8 (permalink)
exjunky Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 602	It really makes my blood boil to see these fools give their "tough love advice" to drug addicts. (Television's Dr. Phil comes to mind.) They have this air of superiority, as if to show that they must have more moral character, and they will show us the way. The fact is, if they were addicted to opiates, they'd sell their own mothers for the next fix and would lie and cheat and steal just like the rest of us did when we were hooked. And then they often insist to the addict that cold-turkey is the best method. If they were hooked, would they last through even 15 minutes of withdrawals? Would they quit cold turkey, or would they be blubbering like a baby for another fix after an hour goes by? Character, schmaracter. I have seen so many beautiful people destroyed by drugs. It's not the person who is a monster, it's the drugs that are monstrous.

10-15-2007, 01:35 AM	#9 (permalink)
calabash Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: South Africa Posts: 141	While all these things may be true, and while as an addict I am not scum, I also think our addict behaviour often lend itself to the scummy side! Now let me see.... I lied, I stole, I cheated, I manipulated, ....... Now to those who do not suffer from the disease of addiction, and who have little knowledge of addiction, being ripped off, lied to etc creates a perception. This is no justification for calling me scum. I am a child of God. I am a fellow human being. But my behaviours previously sometimes leed to me being judged.

10-15-2007, 07:30 AM	#12 (permalink)
windysan Large Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: La Posts: 3,483	When you see that speaker again please tell him to kiss windysan's arse. thanks.

10-15-2007, 07:41 AM	#13 (permalink)
*Doug* Administrator Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: SR. (OFTEN imitated, never duplicated) Posts: 1,347	Either they're closed minded, ignorant, or have been hurt bad in the past by an addict. Or maybe all three. Some folks are just that way. Aggravating? Yep. Especially to all of us who have lived it. And maybe some day people like that will stop talking long enough to hear somebody's story, and then realize this isn't something we chose to pursue. And maybe not. Don't take personal attacks personally.

10-15-2007, 07:50 AM	#14 (permalink)
Ann Sharing Our Light Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: By The Lake Posts: 15,028	Ignorance, a complete lack of understanding combined with a lack of compassion, would drive someone to say that. Or fear. My son is an addict. Some of the most wonderful people I have ever met are addicts in recovery. My prayers go out that the person who said that, never ever has to find out that the addict they refer to could be their son or daughter or brother or sister or spouse or best friend....none of whom are scum, all of whom are God's children worthy of love and respect...even in their darkest hour. Earth people, that's what we codies call those who have no clue. Hugs __________________ Somewhere between the gator swamp and the Taj Mahal there is a path, it may be hidden, overgrown or may blend in with the other surroundings, but it is there, it's your path and it is calling you.~Frankly~

10-15-2007, 11:12 AM	#16 (permalink)
northbelle Dopeless Hope Fiend Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: anchorage Alaska Posts: 1,674	The ONLY thing that seperates THEM...from US.... DUMB LUCK... love north

10-15-2007, 11:13 AM	#17 (permalink)
PaperDolls Miss Grumpy Pain in the Pants Join Date: May 2004 Location: Midwest Posts: 5,097 Blog Entries: 10	I was thinking the same thing North. Sort of like, the only thing separating me (and probably many of us) from homelessness is one (may be 2) paycheck(s). __________________ Sober Date: 07.07.2008

10-24-2007, 06:50 AM	#18 (permalink)
GeorgiaPeach Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 491	Hey guys! I haven't been here in a while but I wanted to comment on this one. I agree that if you are an addict and you are in recovery that is one thing but don't you think that if you are an addict and know you are an addict and you just don't care especially if you have a family and you would rather buy drugs instead of take care of your family, that puts a whole new twist on the way you see that person? My husband has been an addict for about 7 years whether is be alcohol or pills or pot or whatever he could get his hands on. For about 3 or 4 years it was methadone. He did take care of us but all of our extra money was spent on pills and he would fuss if I spent $100 on groceries bevause that took away from money he spent on his habbit. He was a mean and abusive man while on any kind of drug and I never understood what I had done to make him be so mean to me until a year and a half ago when he told me about his addiction (I never knew about it). I have always stood by him and he actually went cold turkey about 5 times within the past year and a half. Each time he would go right back and hide his pills. I would find them and we would fight. I haven't thought of him the same since he went back after his first withdrawal from methadone. To this day I think less of him. He is now 5 weeks clean and hopefully he will stay that way. He started a new job in a new city & state and has no way (right now) of getting anything. He says that he is not craving them but he also says he wouldn't turn one down if offered. That's not too much progress but it is a start. Anyway, there has been drugs in my family for the past 15 years with one family member or another and I have a hard time seeing someone who used drugs and hurts people and doesn't want to get better as an equal. My ex-brother in law lost his family(my sister & nephew) & his home, got remarried and his son had health problems when he was born & his 5 month old daughter died because of his meth addiction (she suffocated but they were too messed up to know)and guess what.........he still uses meth! I certainly do not view him the same way I view others. Is that bad of me? I don't wish to make anyone mad but I can't help the way I feel. GP __________________ The Future Belongs to Those Who Believe in the Beauty of Their Dreams.-Elanor Roosevelt

10-24-2007, 11:53 AM	#19 (permalink)
pakuni boy pakuni Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: lomas Posts: 94	that speker is a farse!, i agree that addcits are taken as scum in society, it seems than being an ex convict or murderer o rapist, etc is better than being an addict, also o when looking 4 a job, if the rumor ever comes that one is an addict, we can kiss goodbye to our job, here in my country there are associations and funds for helping all types of needed persons xcept addicts, when we live in a society full of addicts. __________________

10-24-2007, 12:13 PM	#20 (permalink)
ccgirl Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Harwich, MA Posts: 2,593	Georgia, I can see your anger; especially because it is a personal situation, but I still did not hear you think of him as scum. It's people who stand on the sidelines and judge. I only wish they knew how much I would give to not be the way I am.

10-24-2007, 12:16 PM	#21 (permalink)
Jerzy007 Jerzy007 Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: South Florida Posts: 241	He's probably been robbed by one of US..LMAO __________________ :Weightlif Jason "If we have no peace, it is because we have forgotten that we belong to each other."-Mother Teresa

10-24-2007, 03:12 PM	#22 (permalink)
hairgirl Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Berea,Ohio Posts: 378 Blog Entries: 1	People fear what they don't know.People love to take the focus off of themselves, and people are quick to judge.You should be really careful what you say because it will eventually come bite you in the ass.