Input on Suboxone...failed once, however

[marware]

Hello,

It pains me to even type this message but I really need help. I have an addiction that I just can't kick. I had back surgery 2 1/2 years ago and was treating the pain with doctor prescribed Lortabs. I could get through a day with taking three 7.5's and like everyone else, actually liked the way it made me feel. I eventually needed surgery that helped a bit, but the pain is chronic and I am still receiving Lortab's. I want to emphasize, I am having pain, but I do not need the Lortab's but that doesn't stop me from getting them prescribed.

I am very fortunate, married, three children, great job, great pay so I have a lot to lose. I tried taking myself off the Lortab's last summer and failed. I went cold turkey and it was an awful experience. Very weak was my wost complaint. Needless to say I found my way back on the Lortabs, and started searching forum like this for help. This is where I read about Suboxone. I searched my local area and due to my somewhat public image, I opted to go see a doctor 50 miles away from my home. Really not that big of a deal, as I often travel through this city ona regular basis.

I had my initial visit with the doctor and told him my history, current meds and he agreed to let me give suboxone a try. When I went to see the doctor (which was spring of 2007) I was taking 4 7.5 lortabs a day. I went off the Lortabs for two days to start going into withdrawls per physician direction and showed up at 8:00 am early in the morning.

I was in the office all day, actually did not leave until 5:00 pm that evening. I remember the nurse taking my vitals giving me some pills and putting them under my tongue. Other then the taste, I did not think it was all that bad. Then, every hour on the hour they nurse would enter and give me more pills to put under my tongue. After the 2nd dose I stated get pretty tired and slept most of the time between doses. The next thing I know it is 5:00 pm, my pupils are pin point and I am sick to my stomach. I really think I recieved too high of an initial dose.

After leaving the facility I still had to drive 50 miles to get home, I know beyond ignorant. I made it home and was still sick until the next morning. I really don't think this was the withdrawl, I really believe I was just given too much Suboxone.

I know some may say the 4 7.5mg's a day is not all that much, but it is still difficult to stop consuming. I am really wanting to see a different physician and see if a lower starting dose would be better. Does anyone have any suggestions.

I also want to add, after the suboxone treatment I went three days before I gave in. It really wasn't addiction, but I slipped another disc in my back, which required a second surgery. The second surgery helped tremendously and I am pain free. I have no reason to be on Lortabs other then the addiction. I want to stop not only for me, but for my children. I am still a great father, but I am not the best father on these pills. I want to stop, and I am really interested in trying the suboxone again. I personally believe my initial poor experience with Suboxone was due receiving too much Suboxone.

I was taking three pills, under the tongue, from 10:00 am until 5:00 pm.


Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[Brewster]

Welcome marware;

It's not the amount of lortab you take, it's how it affects you. If you feel you have a problem, congratulations you have found the right place. Happily it seems like you are not falling pray to taking more and more - thats a good thing.

I got involved with Oxycontins pretty heavy and went through a four week detox and rehab that included subutex. After that, I attended an IOP program. It worked for me. I was on a sub taper schedule for about 6 weeks. I had a bit of w/d symptoms, but they were fairly tolerable. Now I am 17 months clean and am a much better person for my family, employees and people in general.

I don't have much advice except to inform you that you can escape this and get back to the things that matter in life. I'm involved with a group of people that is somewhat secular in nature, but embraces the twelve step plan. We meet about four times a week and while I am strong and sober now, I am involved because helping others helps me (I'll always be an addict and need the participation)

Hope this helps

[ccgirl]

Hi

Good for you for recognizing your problem.

OK, now some, for what it's worth, advice. In June, I went into detox. I waited 48 hours, and was given suboxone. It was a relatively low dose, as I had been tapering my opiate consumption leading up to detox. I was dreadfully ill. Almost two straight days of vomiting. It was worse than withdrawals.

The detox center, which is a world renowned hospital, told me it was one of two things, and I'll bet the same is true for you. 1. Because of the relatively small amount of opiates I had been taking prior to suboxone, my system couldn't handle it. 2. I was allergic to suboxone, which they had seen twice before.

P.S. They only gave me 4 mg. suboxone, which, although I'm not sure because I've never looked into it closely since, is a low dose.

For what it's worth, I hope this helps.

[marware]

Originally Posted by ccgirl

Hi

Good for you for recognizing your problem.

OK, now some, for what it's worth, advice. In June, I went into detox. I waited 48 hours, and was given suboxone. It was a relatively low dose, as I had been tapering my opiate consumption leading up to detox. I was dreadfully ill. Almost two straight days of vomiting. It was worse than withdrawals.

The detox center, which is a world renowned hospital, told me it was one of two things, and I'll bet the same is true for you. 1. Because of the relatively small amount of opiates I had been taking prior to suboxone, my system couldn't handle it. 2. I was allergic to suboxone, which they had seen twice before.

P.S. They only gave me 4 mg. suboxone, which, although I'm not sure because I've never looked into it closely since, is a low dose.

For what it's worth, I hope this helps.

when you say small dose, what was it and how much? I know it is different for everyone but I was just wandering. I have read stories about people taking 30-40 pills a day (not saying that makes them worse than I) I just wander how bad I am from and addiction stand point.

thanks for your post. I am just wandering if I could try the suboxone at a much lower dose, less pills to just get me through. I felt awful for three to four day.

[ccgirl]

It was the stuff you put under your tongue; I think 4 mg.

[marware]

Originally Posted by ccgirl

It was the stuff you put under your tongue; I think 4 mg.

I called the doctor I went to (only once) to get the total dosage I took during the "induction phase". As stated previously, I showed up at the clinic at 8:00 am. I did a urine test and was given a script for the suboxone. Went to the local pharmacy had it filled and returned to the clinic to start treatment, which if I remember correctly started around 10:30 a.m.

From 10:30 to 5:00 pm I was given a total of 12 (2mg) tabs under the tongue. So over a 7 hour period I was given 24mg of suboxone. I can't tell you how bad I felt. I had to drive out of town for the treatment as I am somewhat well known in my area and I did not feel confident being treated locally. When I left the clinic I had not business driving a car, as I barely remember getting home. I do remember my pupils were pinpoint, and I felt AWFUL. By 8:00 I was throwing up and was pretty sick for a couple of days.

One thing I do remember, I felt great after the first two pills, started feel worse after I was given two more pills (there was an hour interval between doses). I feel like giving sub a try again, as I do not need these pills. I have no reason to take these other then I am physically dependent on them. I really would like to try it but at a much, much lower dose. Any input would be greatly appreciated.

[misslisa]

From what I have seen with opiate withdrawals and suboxone. the success rate is great. Its just to get you through the withdrawals. You say your dont really take that much of the pills. Can you go a day without them? your addiction sounds more mental than physical. When you go to see the doctor next maybe ask for an inpatient treatment centre (rehab) where you could go and stay for a week (at least) not only will you be monitored for your withdrawals, but you will also have alot of emotional support. Many addicts cannot stop when they do a quick fix to get off the drugs then straight back into normal life.

misslisa

[catcrazy]

24 mgs is a maor dose with sub..no wonder you were sick..eeks!
I pm'd you some info about sub..
I would say try again but read up on it, some of the Drs are just completely clueless..its the lowest dose that takes away cravings and wds..period..may be 2 mgs or can be 32,,depends on person..

[marware]

Originally Posted by catcrazy

24 mgs is a maor dose with sub..no wonder you were sick..eeks!
I pm'd you some info about sub..
I would say try again but read up on it, some of the Drs are just completely clueless..its the lowest dose that takes away cravings and wds..period..may be 2 mgs or can be 32,,depends on person..

thanks for the pm, and I will be posting there as well. Just trying to have more and more discussion as it helps me immensely. As I stated I felt great after the first dose (2 - 2mg tabs for a total of 4mgs of suboxone), then the second dose I started to feel sedated. Then after that, it was a big blur and I was lucky to even make it home. I am going to try it again and see what happens.

thanks again for the PM and the posts

[exjunky]

In my observation, doctors have the following attitude:

#1 - Overdosing on oral suboxone is almost impossible

#2 - Some of the worst addicts relapse if given too little suboxone

#3 - It's very easy to scale down from suboxone. E.g. a patient who drops from 70mg of methadone daily to 60mg will often complain about headaches, cravings, etc. But you can drop from 16mg of suboxone to 14mg of subxone without even noticing a difference.

Putting those things three together, they have a "better too much than too little" approach.

[LabRat]

I've been taking Suboxone since February and haven't used heroin since the night before my induction....haven't drank, or used any other drugs either. The morning of the induction I was given an 8 Mg - and 2 hours later another 8. I was having very bad cravings and at my one week appointment they bumped it up another 8mg and I have been great on that dose. So I take a total of 24 mgs a day - ( One 8 Mg 3 times a day) When I go for my monthly visit this month I start cutting back. I am ready to do that. I have gotten Suboxone off the streets in the past, to try to quit heroin. I was only taking an 8MG and always ended up using. For me....it just wasn't enough. This is the longest I have gone without drugs (Except for the Subs) and alcohol in MANY years. I think that finding the proper dose is the key.

LabRat