Lyoness

Hello all. I've written about my fear of going cold turkey off methadone. At the moment I am being able to taper and am at 30mgs. Why I'm posting this time is that I would really like to hear about other people's experiences of coming off of methadone.

Whether you tapered or went cold turkey or whatever. I'd really like to know what people experienced, how long it took to feel "normal" again, what they did to help themselves through taper or cold turkey. I don't know exactly what will happen for me but I feel it's really helpful to hear others' experiences.

One big concern for me is depression which I already suffer from and have heard can be a big problem coming off methadone. So I'd like to know if others dealt with this and how.

Thanks.

Marcus

Hey Lyoness. Finally a new post in this forum. It has been over 3 weeks.

I think regardless of what drug you are coming off depression is inevitable in the beginning. Our bodies are truly amazing at recovering and adjusting, but we have to remember what we have been putting ourselves through. They can bounce back pretty quickly all things considered, but it doesn't happen overnight. There are usually good days and bad days, but as time goes on the good days happen more and more and the bad days less. For me accepting this and having a positive mindset that I am doing something good and necessary helped me through the rough times. I didn't want to start over AGAIN or go backwards so had to just hold on at times and know I was doing the right thing.

You are down to 30. That is great. For me at that point it was important to go slow if possible. I know that may not be an option for you. If it is not it was better for me to drop down to a lower dose and go slower than to continue to take 30 every day and then just be out completely. Methadone is strong so a small amount can at least hold things (similar to suboxone in my opinion although suboxone is even more pronounced when dropping to lower doses).

I am not going to pretend the physical stuff is not there because it is, but mental attitude is huge and it is pretty clear you are struggling with that part. If you are committed to stopping and your mind is accepting of it it is so much easier to get through. If you are feeling sorry for yourself and thinking the world and everything in it is against you of course it will be tough.

It is completely doable. I did it while working with a wife and 3 kids so didn't get to just take a day off. I am not saying that means it was harder than being holed up alone all of the time with your thoughts though. It was probably a good thing I had to be somewhere and continue to support my family. I had to push myself. It was easy to say I can't do it and just want to give up, but then I said no I am not going to let this happen - push myself to get out and do things. Push to get out in the world and make some face to face connections helped tremendously. Whether or not you think meetings are too religious or not for you just going and listening (speaker meeting or whatever) can be helpful. You don't have to sign up for life or anything - it just is a great way to meet other people who have been where you are and know what it feels like.

Take care of yourself. We really do care about you and trust me my life is far from perfect. Even in sobriety I have days where I wonder what is the purpose? Why am I doing any of this? What does life even mean? That is why it is important to make the best of today and live in today.

Lyoness

Thank you so much Marcus. I forgot to check if there was an answer and there was a great one. I know what you mean about a new thread though I've sort of asked this same question a few times. Oh well, it's a new question right?

I appreciate what you say because it makes a lot of sense to me. I do have regrets, anger, upset that this taper is being forced on me. It's not because I sat down with my ongoing doctor and made the best decision for me. It's a decision thrust on me, partly from my actions and partly from the action of others. (And some things have changed with that, in my other thread I wrote about some realizations about the responsibilities in this. It's not just all on my shoulders anymore.) So I am going to have to figure out how to come to terms with this, how to find acceptance. It may be the best thing that I am going off methadone now, but it is hard to have the decision ultimately being made for me.

I do agree that a slower taper would be better. I think my former doctor has agreed to go ahead and do the rest of the taper since I have tried for six months and not been able to find another doctor. But I know she wants it done fast and I can feel in my body/brain how it affects me even at the pace it is going. It is good and vital information that being slower later is even more important than slowing right now. I really do want to try to do this as healthily as I can. I don't want to implode.

I still find methadone a bit hard to understand in how it works. Some days I can feel withdrawals start before 24 hours are even up and other days I feel I could skip a day or half a day and not notice so much. I have been on it for a little over a year and a half, I think, I'm not exactly sure but I think that's about right. I'm glad that I wasn't on it for years and years because this would probably be a lot tougher.

I'm grateful to hear you say that it's hard, there are physical symptoms, even with a taper. That way, hopefully, I can have a plan in place to deal with them. Maybe my psychiatrist, or if I can find a primary care person, could rx comfort meds if I need them. I hear clonidine mentioned a lot, and knowing what has worked for others gives me some ideas and choices.

If you don't mind saying, when did the withdrawals really hit you? And how long did they last? I know everyone is different but it helps to have an idea. And how did you finish your taper? I've read some people go to 1mg and then skip days, like folks do with suboxone. I'm going to try to get my former doc to go as slow as possible at the end. It's a balancing act, she doesn't really want to be prescribing this although is taking responsibility which I appreciate and think is appropriate given our whole situation. And I want to go slow so my body can adapt.

It's a real shame that we can't taper down as fast as our tolerance rises up! I remember each jump with oxy, telling myself I wouldn't do it and it went so fast--200mgs per day, 250, 300, 350, up, up, up and never the other way. That is one good thing about the methadone, that need to keep increasing the dose was not anywhere near how it is with the short acting opiates. And it's probably really good I was with a doctor and not a clinic because I've heard so many times that they just push people's doses up to crazy places.

I also hear you on getting out. I tend to hole up at home, alone, and that can get my mood worse. I could try meetings again, too, although I found that people really are not welcoming. I have a hard time in groups, sometimes I cannot speak at all, and I thought the anonymous meetings were known for people reaching out and welcoming you. But I may get desperate enough to try again.

Thanks again for your reply and anything else you want to share I'd really like to read. Especially about how you deal with those days where you question things.

toddle118

Hi guys, I joined a couple of years ago, my addiction was alcohol but moved to heroin and crack, it basically ruined my life, and my looks and arms! I will try and get in a forum that supports people like me, don't know what the best ones are. Im on 55 mls methadone and I hate it, I was wondering what would happen if I go cold turkey but I saw your link first, am sure there is an answer out there! Stay strong guys xxx

Lyoness

Hi Toddle. There's not a lot of activity on this forum as you can see. I think maybe a lot of people on methadone don't post. But I was thinking of going through the old threads as the time gets closer, you might try that too. I remember a few people over the years going off methadone and some described what they did and their experiences.

If you feel like answering, what is it that you don't like about methadone? I'm trying to learn more about it, esp. from people's experiences. I was opposed to going on it at first and went the suboxone route. The suboxone worked okay for awhile but over time my cravings increased radically, physical ones not just mental, and I got really depressed. When I went on methadone the cravings pretty much stopped, for awhile, as did the depression. If you've seen any of my other threads you know the depression came back with a vengeance and that led to a choice that has cost me a lot and I'm now dealing with. Hence the methadone taper.

I hope you can find some answers and ideas to help you! And I'll answer whatever I can.

DarlingNikki

I can see that this thread is a few weeks old, but I just joined today. If you're still going through with the tapering, will you update and let us know how you're doing?
I know that methadone tapering can be rough, but if you've gotten to the point where you've made the necessary changes to your life and you've dealt with whatever issues were contributing to your addiction, it doesn't have to be bad at all.
I'm sorry that you aren't being allowed to finish treatment at your own pace. In my experience a lot of doctors and clinics forget that methadone patients are addicts so it's to be expected that there'll be some issues. In stead they terminate treatment when they should really either increase counseling or doses.
But if you find yourself needing to taper for whatever reasons, there are things you can do now to make it easier both throughout the taper and especially when you are completely done.
You wrote that depression has been an issue for you, and it is in fact an issue for everyone who stops methadone treatment. Simply put, the methadone has been replacing some of your "happy" chemicals in your brain. That means that when you stop taking the drug, you will be lacking these chemicals since it takes a while for your body to start producing them again. It can take up to three months.
The good news is that it's gradual, so you won't be feeling as bad mentally after six weeks as you did after one. You just won't be back to normal yet. The other good news is that a simple antidepressant can make a huge difference, but you should start taking this at least three weeks before your treatment ends. You can ask your doctor about this, but it shouldn't be a problem. The kind of antidepressant you need isn't something that's likely to be abused.
While the emotional/mental symptoms of detox lasts months, the physical part usually only takes weeks. It's similar to detoxing off other opioids, but with the timeline stretched out. Of course it varies from person to person, but you'll probably experience some physical symptoms once you quit completely, no matter how low a dose you end with - but the severity will definitely be determined in part by the amount your body is used to getting at the time.
Most people will start noticing the first signs after a day and a half to a couple of days. For the majority this will be a lack of energy and a general feeling of being unwell. After a day or two of this (now 3-5 days after last dose) you might start getting the more severe symptoms, such as the stomach problems, insomnia, "bone" pain and restless legs. This can continue for maybe a couple of days - and if you've tapered to a low dose you might not feel any worse than from a mild bug - but for a few it can last a week. Once you're over these symptoms you will probably still experience some of the general malaise for up to three weeks after your last dose.
But now the good news! Antidepressants can make this whole process a lot easier and so can exercise. I know it's the last thing you'll feel like doing when your sick, so get in the habit of going for a walk twice a day. It will make it easier when the time comes. Exercise will help your brain make more of those "happy" chemicals you're missing, and it will also make your metabolism burn the residual drugs in your system a little quicker.
Taking a good multivitamin daily will also help. It won't be noticeable instantly, but if you've experienced detox both with and without vitamins, you'll know it helps.
Also, simple OTC Imodium will actually help with diarrhea if you should experience this. It makes sense, because it's chemically similar to opiates but it doesn't enter your brain.

I hope that some of this might help you with what you're going through. I've been on methadone twice and the first time I quit at 20 mg, but without being stable on that dose. I also didn't take antidepressants or vitamins, and I certainly didn't exercise. I am slow at metabolizing methadone, so I didn't get sick until almost six days after but I stayed sick for over two weeks. Then I was depressed and generally didn't feel good for a couple of months - and then relapsed.
I started treatment again at a different clinic and got a great counselor. Her advice made a big difference. That time I started tapering from my 50 mg dose at 5 mg every other week. When I got to 30 mg we slowed it down to 2 mg every other week. At 15 mg we did 1 mg every two weeks. At 10 mg a day I stopped for 5 weeks and stabilized, and then picked it up again at 1 mg every other week. This continued until I was only taking 4 mg a day. Then I started only taking my take homes every other day (I know this isn't an option if you have to dose at the clinic every day) and after one month I stopped completely. I didn't save my unused bottles, I knew that would be too tempting. But I'd been on lexapro for depression since I started tapering, and I had honestly not felt my detox at all up until that point. My pace had been slow enough for my body to keep up.
After I took my last dose I was okay - 100% fine - for five days. Then I got a feeling of generally being unwell, along with some mild diarrhea. The Imodium completely handled that. I also had some trouble falling asleep for the first two weeks but I'd already been walking twice a day and by pushing my second walk until right before bedtime, I got over that. I think that by day 10 I was completely over any physical discomfort and never got the same depressed, useless feeling I had the first time I quit. It's been two years and I haven't relapsed and I honestly don't crave either the oxys or the methadone anymore.
I know this is a long post, but it's a complicated topic. I hope that maybe my experience can make it a little easier on you - or at least give you some hope.
Good luck

Lyoness

Thank you so much Nikki for your post! I think it will help me a lot. I'm going to read and reread it. Its late and I'm too tired to post much now but I did want to say thanks.

Lyoness

Now it's daytime and I'm awake I can respond more fully. You shared a lit of useful information and I sure appreciate it. One thing I've been wondering about is how fast to taper. There's a part of me that's anxious to get on with it while there's another part afraid of long term withdrawals, especially worsening depression. I do feel my body and brain respond to every dosage jump down, I want to make that as smooth as possible.

That's a good idea to write how my experience goes, it could help someone like me who is looking for info. Well, I just took about a 15% drop in my dose, down to 30mg. I was supposed to make that jump sooner but my doc decided to keep me at 35mg for another month which was wise I think. I've been battling this depression and also a very dark and grim winter so the extra stability made sense.

I have a unique situation in that a private doctor is doing my taper. She was my primary care provider and the original prescriber of the methadone. A lot has changed since then, you can read in my other threads, especially that she's no longer doing primary care. But she feels a duty of honor and care to help me taper since she was the original prescriber. We hit some hiccups sometimes but it is working out. The methadone clinic here is too far away so I am especially grateful. Especially because I've read what you wrote over and over again--that depression is common after going off methadone and I'm already there.

I have been trying some different antidepressants. I agree with you that having a stable dose is very important before my taper ends.

How did your doctor come up with your taper plan? I've been wondering what is the safest way, esp when getting down to lower doses. Right now my doc is dropping 5mg every month which means next times drop will be almost 20% which seems like a lot. I've also been researching to try and find out when to jump off altogether. And is it safe to go from 10mg to 5mg in one jump. So again, I really appreciate your lengthy post and any other info you want to share.

I think that is so great that it worked for you and you've found stable recovery. That is my hope too along with stability from the depression.

DarlingNikki

I think you've got an advantage in having a doctor in control of your treatment rather than a clinic. I think she might be more flexible in the end, although you might want to encourage her to do a little extra research - if you think she won't take that the wrong way. But the fact is that many doctors have very little knowledge of how methadone should be used in treatment of addiction.
What form of methadone do you take? I understand that if it's in pill form you are limited in the intervals you can drop down. Most clinics use liquid so the taper can happen a mg at a time like mine did. I do not know if you could get this at a pharmacy, however. I think the regular dose in a pill is 10 mg and assuming it can be broken into quarters you could change the dose by only 2.5 mg at a time.
When I did my successful taper I had a long talk with my counselor where we reached the conclusion that I was ready to taper but since my primary fear was getting sick from the detox we decided to do it a little slower than usual. I've met people who tapered without serious problems at a rate of 2 mg a week down to 15 mg and 1 a week down to 10 at which point they've quit. That's a common rate for voluntary detox at my clinic.
Once you get to 30 mg you really shouldn't drop by as much as 5 mg, as you pointed out, that's now a rather large percentage. If your doctor is willing to reconsider and maybe just taking 2.5 mg off next time I think you'd be more comfortable. And being comfortable and feeling safe during your taper is what will make it last.
I know the slow pace can be frustrating, but I've spoken to many patients and counselors (I now volunteer as patient advocate) and all are in agreement that people who either go cold turkey or taper too fast (usually because of the dreaded punishment, the 21 day taper) end up using again, and eventually return to treatment. Those that successfully stayed sober were the ones that didn't rush it. Another common factor in the successes seems to be that they often have a solid source of support during it all, either from a doctor, therapist or just a friend and family member.
I really wish you luck. Reading your posts I get the sense that you are so sincere in wanting the next sober chapter of your life to begin, and that's something if can relate to.
I think that your determination will pay off and there's something to look forward to. Even after having been sober for a while now I still wake up every morning realizing how great it feels to be well! You know that first day after you've recovered from a cold or flu, when you wake up and really appreciate how good it feels to just not be sick? That's a nice way to start each day and I am sure that you'll feel this too before too long.

Lyoness

Thank you again for such a helpful post! I really like what you wrote at the end. I know exactly what you mean about how amazing you feel when you're truly well after being ill for so long. That's a really unique feeling. And I do want that.

But I also forget about it, get so lost in the fact that I am still taking opiates, even if it's in the form of a methadone taper. I get afraid that I won't be able to make it. Or the withdrawals and PAWS will get to me and I'll use again or do something even more desperate. What if my chronic pain takes over my life again? And on and on.

Alternating with impatience to speed the taper up. It is so helpful to talk to someone who has real experience with tapering plus the knowledge you've gained from your counselor and the people you work with. That's what I've really been needing, to hear from people with direct experience in my situation. So thank you again.

I think my doctor would be open to hearing about the safest, or at least safer, ways to taper. I don't think she has a lot of experience with this. I also don't know if I could get the liquid prescribed but it sounds like a good idea. Do you know of any websites that might be written for a doctor/practitioners that would give a taper plan and have studies or clinical experience to back it up? I think that would be especially helpful for my doc. We're kind of in a unique and delicate situation since she's not my primary care anymore so I think that adds pressure to go faster. If she had medical information to support her, I think that would help a lot.

I was thinking the next 5mg drop will be a lot, too, cuz it is almost 20%. I know we can't ask or give medical advice but it's sounding to me that doing something like dropping 2 1/2mgs every two weeks might be better than the full five. That's the kind of info it would be great to give her.

I also realized that your suggestion to write about my experience is helpful to me too, to make me more aware how it's affecting me. Knowledge and info can help me, especially if I start to slide into worse depression. Today I was feeling some withdrawal type symptoms and I finally realized what they were. Nothing huge, just a bit off in body temp, RLS, that electric feeling under my skin, jitteriness, lack of appetite. But realizing what it was helped.

So I took extra vitamins, ibuprofen, one of the lorazepam I'm prescribed for anxiety, spent time in the sun, did some small chores and went for a walk. Not much but tons compared to the depressed slug I've been all winter. Finding what works now can help me at the end. I'm hoping to have a lot of info to make the jump off the least painful I can.

That's cool that you advocate for people who are now where you once were. I bet it's very satisfying and probably a little frustrating at times too. But it must help you stay strong in your recovery and feel awesome knowing how you're truly helping people. I really appreciate your help for me and whoever might be reading this thread.

DarlingNikki

I don't know of a specific place to find information on safely tapering for your doctor, but I did find some reputable sources with a google search:


This is from a Canadian group of physicians and the relevant info is only one short paragraph on page 25 - but it makes sense and your doctor should deem the source reliable.

*I cannot post links, but I will send this in a message if I can*

This second link is really great, it's a guideline for methadone treatment by the California Society of Addiction Medicine. The portion dealing with tapering starts at page 91 but I think your doctor might find the entire thing interesting. I love how they emphasize patient comfort and the long term goal of staying sober. My only critique is that they are a little pessimistic about a patients chance of succeeding. If you read it, don't be discouraged. You're not a statistic, you are an intelligent person with an overwhelming desire to stay sober. You are doing so much to improve your chances of success that you really can't be lumped in with the statistics.
On a different note, I understand your concern about what would happen if your pain returned and you needed treatment in the future. First of all remember that there are many really effective non-narcotic ways of dealing with various types of pain but if you do need an opioid in the future, don't panic. Just be honest with your doctor and he/she can find you a type that's less likely to induce euphoria. I have a chronic pain condition that I've been managing with naproxen and exercise but during flare ups I have had to take narcotic pain meds. I still consider myself sober because I didn't abuse them, and I didn't engage in addictive behavior. The type I was prescribed actually didn't cause me to feel anything at all, which surprised me. My doctor explained that it was in part because I still retain an abnormally high tolerance and also because the pill released so slowly into my system that it was just too gradual to get me high. The first time I had to take it after being sober I still worried that I'd feel cravings after I finished, but I didn't.
And though I'm not a 12-stepper, I still go by the idea of taking things one day at a time. Focus on your current obstacles and know that if the time comes when you need these meds, you'll be strong enough to handle it.

Lyoness

Thanks for the link and the support. I really appreciate them both. I might wait til I'm on the computer to check it out, I'm just on my phone now and long reads aren't as easy on the tiny screen.

Like you I really like research and work that focuses on people being comfortable and yes, being able to have long term success. I've read studies and abstracts where people were pulled off methadone too quickly, forced to go off, and lots of them end in death, usually an OD. And that is a horrible waste of life.

I agree with you about not being a statistic too. When I started suboxone (which I tried before methadone) my doctor was telling me how my chances of success were practically nil and I got so angry. I wanted him to be encouraging and supporting me, especially at the beginning when I had so many doubts and kept going back to the oxy. I felt like if he doesn't have any faith or hope in me why should I? How could I?

That's inspiring that you keep your pain under control without meds. I have been so afraid to leave that security blanket. Frankly, I've been unwilling to believe I could survive without the pain meds. I guess that's my addiction as much as genuine fear of pain. But as I continue my taper I feel physical pain more too and I'm having to learn to do other things, to rely on other things. I've always done a lot of other stuff for my pain But also knew I could just rely on the pills most of the time. Its a learning curve in every way.

I'm still really grateful for your suggestion I post my experience tapering because it's making me be aware in ways I would not have been about how the taper is affecting me. And I'm being more aware if how other things are affecting me. I realize how important this is if I want to be successful in my taper.

Today I'm a little lower. I didn't sleep as well and woke up to a nightmare--yuck! I feel achy all over which may be the extra activity yesterday or the drop in dose or both. I was so inactive all winter, mostly sitting in a depressed huddle and I'm really feeling how atrophied I got for lack of a better word. Hopefully with spring coming and getting my antidepressant worked out, getting more active and eating more I will get into much better shape.

DarlingNikki

I'm sorry to hear that today is a tough day, it can be hard to stay hopeful when you're feeling bad physically, especially if you have other stressful things going on in your life. Whatever you have going on in your life, remember that at a time like this it's okay to be a little selfish. It's kinda like when the flight attendants tell you that in case of emergency put the mask on yourself before assisting children or others. You need to care for yourself and make yourself the priority so that you can get better. It's the only way you'll ever be able to fully take care of anyone or anything else in your life.
It made me angry to hear that a doctor had told you about how low your chances of success were, especially right in the beginning of your treatment! Nobody could succeed under those circumstances!
One of the reasons I don't like relapse statistics is because there are so many factors in play that it's impossible to account for them all. It's an unfortunate reality that many people return to using after ending methadone treatment but in my experience those are the ones that were forced off treatment or they weren't truly motivated to begin with. I've got a good circle of friends who have all successfully gotten off methadone and we get encouragement from each other. I look at them and see that it IS possible. I wish everyone could have that, but just know that it does happen.
About your fear over your pain and potential need for medications, I understand why you are afraid. I used to think that if I ever ingested a single pain pill it would send me into a tailspin and that within days I'd be right back where I started. Honestly, I think a big part of me continued to believe this until the time came and I was able to prove myself wrong.
Now I've come to realize that untreated pain is a much bigger danger to recovery than properly used pain medications. I've seen quite a few people relapse because they were unable to deal with the pain from either an injury or illness, so in my opinion it's better to seek out treatment before you get to the point where the pain is unbearable. It sounds like the doctor you are working with now is a reasonable and moral person. While I understand that she's not going to be able to care for you in the long term, she might be able to recommend you to someone for your general care? It can be difficult to find a doctor who has a good enough understanding of addiction and recovery to be able to provide care for recovering addicts who suffer from pain. Maybe you'd feel more secure if you knew that you already had a doctor who understands your situation? It sounds like you are the type of person who likes to be as informed as possible, and be prepared for any eventuality, which is certainly something I can relate to.
For example, my wonderful counselor only worked at the methadone clinic so I knew that once I'd finished my taper I'd lose her. That caused me a lot of anxiety, so she helped me by referring me to a colleague whom I could see after my treatment ended. Rather than waiting until a time when I'd be especially vulnerable to establish a relationship with the new counselor, I went ahead and saw her a few times during my taper. It just made me feel so much better to know that I already had her lined up.

Lyoness

I appreciate your posts so much. It puts a smile on my face when I look and see that you've posted. You are helping me so much, more than you probably know. (Plus whoever else might be reading.)

You're giving me hope that I can do this. That is priceless and I thank you so much.

I'm realizing more and more how I need to be an active part of this taper. I've been battling pretty severe depression (suicidal at times) and it's fed my apathy. I've felt like a victim of this taper rather than a willing participant. And now I'm starting to feel like I AM a part of it. It may or may not have been my ideal choice but I'm coming to realize, accept and even want to find out who, what, how I am off opiates. Like I just posted on my other thread, I've been on them a long time. Daily for over ten years and sporadically before that for five or so years. A LONG time.

I'm starting to pay attention to my thinking around opiates. Even if I don't feel the methadone (except for pain relief and withdrawal prevention) I am still psychologically hooked. It's still my security blanket or whatever you want to call it. I've got to get used to thinking about life without counting or relying on a pill to help me through or make things better. I think that's going to be a long journey.

I'm still looking for a new primary care doctor and therapist. I have my addictions counselor who's been a huge support but I know I need more intensive therapy too. Got a lot to deal with. I live in a small community and there's a huge crackdown on doctors prescribing any pain meds, so finding someone to take me, with my history, has been tough. Also I'm on Medicare and lots of docs aren't accepting that either. And I miss my old doctor, she was (is) one in a million.

I'd love to hear more about your journey. What other things did you find to help you as you tapered and began recovery? It sounds like your counselor was amazing, did you have other support?

Lyoness

Haven't posted on this thread for awhile. Have done my next dosage drop of nearly 20% and I am feeling it. Worst withdrawals I've had in a very long time, since I was using addictively. The RLS/electricity coursing through my skin and muscles and bones, head to toe, is the worst. I'm just crawling and kicking and hitting things and shouting. Its awful.

What's making it worse is either the world's longest migraine (two consecutive weeks) or else it's withdrawals from the antidepressants I was trying. Whichever, it's like a million explosions going off in your skull with every movement, no matter how slight, setting off a million more. I got lightning, explosions, electricity, RLS everywhere and it is miserable.

I've thought about going to the ER for my head, but not being sure if it definitely is a migraine I don't know if they could help. Plus I'd have to find a ride.

I'm just hoping my body will adapt to the methadone taper quickly. As my dose lowers, each drop will be a bigger percentage and harder on my body. Next drop will be a full 20% and after that 25% and more. I want to go fast on one hand to be done with it. I also want slower drops to make it easier on my body. Sigh. Guess there's no easy way.

I'm trying a new med for my depression, a mood stabilizer. Supposedly they can be more successful for people like me whose depressions are so treatment resistant. I really hope it works.

Hope anyone else going through a taper is having an easier time of it.

Soberwolf

Lyoness

Taking a full 20%drop in taper dosage and I'm feeling it. RLS though it should be called restless body, deep muscle aches (that's the Fibromyalgia rearing its ugly head ), feeling freezing and pouring sweat, boiling hot and freezing simultaneously, sneezing, migraine. Boy, this is fun.

I asked old and new doc if we could slow my taper now that I'm getting down there. They both seem to think it's a good idea but are leaving town so screw me.

I'm trying to read up on safely tapering from this point on, how to cope with withdrawals and PAWS and am feeling overwhelmed. Don't know if either doc can or will help then. Trying alternative medicine with new doc, hoping he can help. Will have to quiz him seriously at next appt, see if he can or will help. I'm starting to have some doubts from talking to him. Even my addiction counselor is not taking my concerns seriously which is highly frustrating.

I guess we'll see what happens. I'm rereading Nikki's posts, she has some good points.

Soberwolf

I've heard D say that the quinine in tonic water helps with RLS ?

Your doing great Lyoness xx

Lyoness

Thanks Soberwolf. I was just reading about quinine last night. I don't know if there's any available in U.S. anymore but I'm going to look and see if I can find some.

I sure don't feel great but I appreciate your support.

Lyoness

Well I just spent the last hour reading about quinine and RLS. It does seem to work well for a lot of people. It used to be prescribed for leg cramps and RLS but the FDA banned its use for that because of serious side effects (deafness, blindness, death--serious). Those only occurred in a small percentage but still enough.

The amount in tonic water is far less but can still be helpful. Though a very small percentage of people can have bad reactions to this, too. Tinnitus seems the most common that I read. It sounds worth giving a try though. Apparently it works by relaxing the muscles and increasing oxygen to them--two major issues with Fibromyalgia which is a cause of RLS. I have FM and ironically one of the meds listed to treat RLS is methadone.

Other causes are low folate and iron levels. I have both those, needing to take iron and I have a genetic deficiency where I don't produce or use folate. So adding withdrawals, yeah, I'm in for a good time.

The treatment meds I saw listed most frequently were clonidine, gabapentin, valium, requip, mirapex and wellbutrin.

I'm going to try quinine first. Also see if I can get something for my folate deficiency (which turns out to be fairly common), then go for rx's if I can get them.

More than you ever wanted to know about RLS or tonic water.