Clarity of defects? - SoberRecovery : Alcoholism Drug Addiction Help and Information

twilli59 · 08-22-2011, 11:23 AM

I posted recently about the benefits of my recent attempt of a thorough 4th step. I then spent 3 hours with my sponsor on the 5th. As I look at 6 & 7, I feel I'm getting a little obsessive about what to pray for the removal of. (I sure understand why i drank and used now!). I've worked the steps before, without the total surrender, and continued to drink and use. So, I am fearful that I'm not identifying my true defects. That fear drives me into self again - while working a program designed to free me from fear and self! Whoa.

So...any nice and easy tips (from experience only, please) on how you felt solid with 6 & 7? By the way, the broad categories work for me, but there is something going on with expectations of others/feeling abandoned or rejected that is eating at me. I hope this makes sense.

2granddaughters · 02-03-2012, 03:24 PM

This is a lifetime process. I believe we gradually attain the necessary willingness AND ability to do these Steps as we go along in recovery.
It's a lot like learning to play the piano. An orchestral pianist never stops practicing and never stops playing or he'll stop growing and begin to lose what he has.
Just my $0.02

Wishing you the best on your 6&7

Bob R.

2granddaughters · 02-03-2012, 03:24 PM

Double post

2granddaughters · 02-03-2012, 03:25 PM

triple post

2granddaughters · 02-03-2012, 03:27 PM

quadruple post

2granddaughters · 02-03-2012, 03:28 PM

sorry everyone, I'll keep my fat thumb off the submit button .......

TheJungianThing · 02-03-2012, 04:32 PM

The biggest thing in my inventory that came out was pride. A sense that people should more or less kiss my ass. Of course when they did, because I did something well, I"d play off like it wasn't necessary. But good heavens, pay attention to someone else or appreciate the feats and accomplishments of someone else and oh boy - I'd writhe with agony.

What good does that do me ? What good does it do you when I'm supposed to be of service to you ? No good at all. So that one almost immediately gets removed. But it comes back from time to time. I think that's a manifestation of Pride with a strong swirl of Envy baked in.

Sloth, and general lack of discipline were the ones I wanted removed first, so I'd "work on them". With success, followed by failure, followed by some success followed by more failure. My deal was I wanted to lose weight, look good, smell good, and pursue some of my own selfish ambitions in early sobriety. Not knowing if the wife was going to stick around - there were chicks needing to be impressed, and with my new found sobriety and "cleaning up my act" the U.S. Army wasn't totally out of reach. If MY arrangements would only stay put. Didn't happen that way.

I uttered a prayer, still do, and it took me some time to realize what I was actually saying and doing with that prayer. I was asking God to remove the defects of my character that stood in the way of my usefulness to Him and my fellow man. So I reckon he's doing that. Funny, after the delusions of being AA Stud (had my wife left or I left her) and the delusions of being the next Audie Murphy died - God has actually been stepping in and removing the things that block me from a gross sense of lack of discipline and sloth. Maybe because he thinks it's better for me to be alive and take care of the children He has given me in sobriety and not die slowly in front of them having limbs amputated due to being overweight and borderline - on the way - diabetic.

Like 2Grandaughters intimated. I've found it to be a lifetime process and incorporate the 7th Step Prayer in my 11th Step practices and 10th Step "watch" "turn" practices. Like heading into work, insecurity, fear, sloth, and the like will take hold - I can feel it - I utter the prayer, as I enter the building - I have good day where I'm useful. I don't utter the prayer and strew in my own spiritual poop - I have a horrible day. The beauty is I can step outside and utter that prayer at any time and my day gets better.

I don't know if that helps describe my solidity (or lack thereof) in steps 6 and 7. I guess that I do them and incorporate them into my Steps 10 and 11 are all I can offer at this point. If I'm doing it wrong, I'm open to correction.

LiveLikeGold6 · 05-07-2012, 10:12 AM

"I think that's a manifestation of Pride with a strong swirl of Envy baked in."

Careful with those delicious sounding words lol. But awesome post, Jungian, that really helped me

sugarbear1 · 05-07-2012, 10:48 AM

I worked steps 6 & 7 with complete abandon. Who was I to decide what defects were to be removed? Wouldn't that mean that I was still playing the role of Director? I was no longer my own Higher Power. I am now employed by my HP.

I am now to learn to have my HP align my will with the will of my HP. I am to learn to be useful to others. My HP is to chose which defects are to be removed, or not. I say the 7th step prayer daily, as I know that defects don't go away, but may be dormant. My HP is to decide which defects are to be removed for that day as some may come in handy, if I am to be useful to another.

My sponsor also had me write down my defects of character on one side of a paper and on the other side, I was to write the asset or opposite of that defect. As a human, we learn to balance many things. Defects have polar opposites, both the defect and the asset may be needed, not at the same time, but in a lifetime.

I strive for the positive, but my HP may find a defect to be useful. I don't decide, I'm just willing and ready to have my HP decide what needs to be removed. Those defects don't always disappear. Agree to disagree, this works for me for now. Subject to change in the future. Just 'nother opinion.....

Peace,

sugarbear1 · 05-07-2012, 10:53 AM

The OP wrote this on 8-22-11!

I hope they are still on here!

Still, it's a great question....

Notabobblehead · 05-08-2012, 06:55 AM

Since this has been restarted....

The original question picked up after the inventory (4th) and sharing (5th). I have found as long as I am seeking God’s will I need not worry if I miss something. It will be revealed when it needs to be.

This is how I do it: I ask God to direct my thinking. Sometimes I use pg 86 in the BB. When we retire at night has several questions. I ask myself the questions slowly. If something makes me cringe I stop and look at it.

Once I have the exact nature of my wrong (dishonesty, fear, selfishness, pride...) I am ready for steps 6 and 7. (I frequently share what I found with someone – step 5)

For step 6 I ask myself if I find this behavior, or now mostly thought pattern, objectionable? How spiritual am I being (thinking)? With practice, lots of practice, this cuts through my justification. (Unfreekenbelievable when this happens) If I want to be rid of my shortcoming (same thing as defect) I am ready for step 7.

For step 7 I get on my knees and ask God to remove my __________ so that I may be of better service to God and my fellow human beings.

Amazing things come from practicing this process. Freedom from selfishness being one of them!
All quotes are from 1st addition of the BB.

08-22-2011, 11:23 AM	#1 (permalink)
twilli59 Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Columbus, OH Posts: 95	Clarity of defects? I posted recently about the benefits of my recent attempt of a thorough 4th step. I then spent 3 hours with my sponsor on the 5th. As I look at 6 & 7, I feel I'm getting a little obsessive about what to pray for the removal of. (I sure understand why i drank and used now!). I've worked the steps before, without the total surrender, and continued to drink and use. So, I am fearful that I'm not identifying my true defects. That fear drives me into self again - while working a program designed to free me from fear and self! Whoa. So...any nice and easy tips (from experience only, please) on how you felt solid with 6 & 7? By the way, the broad categories work for me, but there is something going on with expectations of others/feeling abandoned or rejected that is eating at me. I hope this makes sense.

02-03-2012, 03:24 PM	#2 (permalink)
2granddaughters in my 24th year of sobriety Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Canada. About as far south as you can get Posts: 4,386	This is a lifetime process. I believe we gradually attain the necessary willingness AND ability to do these Steps as we go along in recovery. It's a lot like learning to play the piano. An orchestral pianist never stops practicing and never stops playing or he'll stop growing and begin to lose what he has. Just my $0.02 Wishing you the best on your 6&7 Bob R. __________________ . . .If you want to drink, that's your business ..... .If you want to quit, that's A.A.'s business. . . --- driven by a hundred forms of fear, self-delusion, self-seeking, and self-pity. . . L.D. 1989

02-03-2012, 03:24 PM	#3 (permalink)
2granddaughters in my 24th year of sobriety Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Canada. About as far south as you can get Posts: 4,386	Double post __________________ . . .If you want to drink, that's your business ..... .If you want to quit, that's A.A.'s business. . . --- driven by a hundred forms of fear, self-delusion, self-seeking, and self-pity. . . L.D. 1989

02-03-2012, 03:25 PM	#4 (permalink)
2granddaughters in my 24th year of sobriety Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Canada. About as far south as you can get Posts: 4,386	triple post __________________ . . .If you want to drink, that's your business ..... .If you want to quit, that's A.A.'s business. . . --- driven by a hundred forms of fear, self-delusion, self-seeking, and self-pity. . . L.D. 1989

02-03-2012, 03:27 PM	#5 (permalink)
2granddaughters in my 24th year of sobriety Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Canada. About as far south as you can get Posts: 4,386	quadruple post __________________ . . .If you want to drink, that's your business ..... .If you want to quit, that's A.A.'s business. . . --- driven by a hundred forms of fear, self-delusion, self-seeking, and self-pity. . . L.D. 1989

02-03-2012, 03:28 PM	#6 (permalink)
2granddaughters in my 24th year of sobriety Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Canada. About as far south as you can get Posts: 4,386	sorry everyone, I'll keep my fat thumb off the submit button ....... __________________ . . .If you want to drink, that's your business ..... .If you want to quit, that's A.A.'s business. . . --- driven by a hundred forms of fear, self-delusion, self-seeking, and self-pity. . . L.D. 1989

02-03-2012, 04:32 PM	#7 (permalink)
TheJungianThing Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 443	The biggest thing in my inventory that came out was pride. A sense that people should more or less kiss my ass. Of course when they did, because I did something well, I"d play off like it wasn't necessary. But good heavens, pay attention to someone else or appreciate the feats and accomplishments of someone else and oh boy - I'd writhe with agony. What good does that do me ? What good does it do you when I'm supposed to be of service to you ? No good at all. So that one almost immediately gets removed. But it comes back from time to time. I think that's a manifestation of Pride with a strong swirl of Envy baked in. Sloth, and general lack of discipline were the ones I wanted removed first, so I'd "work on them". With success, followed by failure, followed by some success followed by more failure. My deal was I wanted to lose weight, look good, smell good, and pursue some of my own selfish ambitions in early sobriety. Not knowing if the wife was going to stick around - there were chicks needing to be impressed, and with my new found sobriety and "cleaning up my act" the U.S. Army wasn't totally out of reach. If MY arrangements would only stay put. Didn't happen that way. I uttered a prayer, still do, and it took me some time to realize what I was actually saying and doing with that prayer. I was asking God to remove the defects of my character that stood in the way of my usefulness to Him and my fellow man. So I reckon he's doing that. Funny, after the delusions of being AA Stud (had my wife left or I left her) and the delusions of being the next Audie Murphy died - God has actually been stepping in and removing the things that block me from a gross sense of lack of discipline and sloth. Maybe because he thinks it's better for me to be alive and take care of the children He has given me in sobriety and not die slowly in front of them having limbs amputated due to being overweight and borderline - on the way - diabetic. Like 2Grandaughters intimated. I've found it to be a lifetime process and incorporate the 7th Step Prayer in my 11th Step practices and 10th Step "watch" "turn" practices. Like heading into work, insecurity, fear, sloth, and the like will take hold - I can feel it - I utter the prayer, as I enter the building - I have good day where I'm useful. I don't utter the prayer and strew in my own spiritual poop - I have a horrible day. The beauty is I can step outside and utter that prayer at any time and my day gets better. I don't know if that helps describe my solidity (or lack thereof) in steps 6 and 7. I guess that I do them and incorporate them into my Steps 10 and 11 are all I can offer at this point. If I'm doing it wrong, I'm open to correction.

05-07-2012, 10:12 AM	#8 (permalink)
LiveLikeGold6 SicknTired of bn SicknTired :) Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Northern California Posts: 454 Blog Entries: 7	"I think that's a manifestation of Pride with a strong swirl of Envy baked in." Careful with those delicious sounding words lol. But awesome post, Jungian, that really helped me __________________

05-07-2012, 10:48 AM	#9 (permalink)
sugarbear1 ~sb Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: MD Posts: 9,761	I worked steps 6 & 7 with complete abandon. Who was I to decide what defects were to be removed? Wouldn't that mean that I was still playing the role of Director? I was no longer my own Higher Power. I am now employed by my HP. I am now to learn to have my HP align my will with the will of my HP. I am to learn to be useful to others. My HP is to chose which defects are to be removed, or not. I say the 7th step prayer daily, as I know that defects don't go away, but may be dormant. My HP is to decide which defects are to be removed for that day as some may come in handy, if I am to be useful to another. My sponsor also had me write down my defects of character on one side of a paper and on the other side, I was to write the asset or opposite of that defect. As a human, we learn to balance many things. Defects have polar opposites, both the defect and the asset may be needed, not at the same time, but in a lifetime. I strive for the positive, but my HP may find a defect to be useful. I don't decide, I'm just willing and ready to have my HP decide what needs to be removed. Those defects don't always disappear. Agree to disagree, this works for me for now. Subject to change in the future. Just 'nother opinion..... Peace, __________________ Someday everything will all make sense. For now, laugh at confusion, smile through tears, & remind yourself that everything happens for a reason. All Big Book quotes are from the first edition. Linked with the permission of Alcoholics Anonymous World Services, Inc.

05-07-2012, 10:53 AM	#10 (permalink)
sugarbear1 ~sb Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: MD Posts: 9,761	The OP wrote this on 8-22-11! I hope they are still on here! Still, it's a great question.... __________________ Someday everything will all make sense. For now, laugh at confusion, smile through tears, & remind yourself that everything happens for a reason. All Big Book quotes are from the first edition. Linked with the permission of Alcoholics Anonymous World Services, Inc.

05-08-2012, 06:55 AM	#11 (permalink)
Notabobblehead Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: PA Posts: 56	Since this has been restarted.... The original question picked up after the inventory (4th) and sharing (5th). I have found as long as I am seeking God’s will I need not worry if I miss something. It will be revealed when it needs to be. This is how I do it: I ask God to direct my thinking. Sometimes I use pg 86 in the BB. When we retire at night has several questions. I ask myself the questions slowly. If something makes me cringe I stop and look at it. Once I have the exact nature of my wrong (dishonesty, fear, selfishness, pride...) I am ready for steps 6 and 7. (I frequently share what I found with someone – step 5) For step 6 I ask myself if I find this behavior, or now mostly thought pattern, objectionable? How spiritual am I being (thinking)? With practice, lots of practice, this cuts through my justification. (Unfreekenbelievable when this happens) If I want to be rid of my shortcoming (same thing as defect) I am ready for step 7. For step 7 I get on my knees and ask God to remove my __________ so that I may be of better service to God and my fellow human beings. Amazing things come from practicing this process. Freedom from selfishness being one of them! All quotes are from 1st addition of the BB.

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